Contest Stats and Discussion - Part 1366

charmander6000 posted...

At that level the stats fall apart. At least in 2018 Draven is recognized as that guy that won the contest in 2013. There's a reason why Draven (and Sans) did better among GameFAQs account voters vs. GameFAQs visitors against their respective opponents.

Him getting recognized as that guy is why he does worse though.

Then he would have performed worse among registered GameFAQs users compared to the visitors.

Honestly the people who anti-vote him now likely wouldn't have voted for him in the first place

charmander6000 posted...

Then he would have performed worse among registered GameFAQs users compared to the visitors.

Honestly the people who anti-vote him now likely wouldn't have voted for him in the first place

Not necessarily. It depends on how many registered users would have voted for him before. And people would anti-vote him when they may not have voted at all.

Why did Draven and Sans do better among registered users, anyway?

It's like trying to backstab your own community...

The boost from increased recognition was bigger than their losses due to anti-voting. This effect was bigger for registered users than non-registered users since registered users or more likely to know the history of the characters.

Advokaiser posted...

Why did Draven and Sans do better among registered users, anyway?

It's like trying to backstab your own community...

Why do we even have to see it that way? I didn't even like watching the Draven or Undertale rallies anyway.

Team Rocket Elite posted...

The boost from increased recognition was bigger than their losses due to anti-voting. This effect was bigger for registered users than non-registered users since registered users or more likely to know the history of the characters.

Pretty much, the people that anti-voted them probably weren't going to vote for them if you ran Ammy vs. Draven or Pac-Man vs. Sans in a timeline where Draven/UNDERTALE didn't win their respective contests.

LinkMarioSamus posted...

Why do we even have to see it that way? I didn't even like watching the Draven or Undertale rallies anyway.

That's my point. What registered user (aside from Ulti) liked seeing those contests being ruined by them?

They gave me PTSD.

Most people don't care about contests, they just vote and go on with their lives.

https://gamefaqs.gamespot.com/poll/7234-have-you-entered-the-character-battle-yet

I was more asking why we have to see the Draven and Undertale rallies as an attack on the site's community.

I have no problem with rallies in theory, just those were not fun to watch in the least. Didn't help that I knew nothing about League of Legends before the Draven rallies and hadn't even heard of Undertale before its rallies. As much as Ulti likes to say he's pro-rally in general, the fact he's a big fan of both League and Undertale most definitely made it easier for him to enjoy those rallies.

LinkMarioSamus posted...

I was more asking why we have to see the Draven and Undertale rallies as an attack on the site's community.

Because they were!

Draven isn't even that liked among League players, yet they made sure to take Link down in a very suspicious manner. The site also became infested by horrible trolls. They had every intention of pissing everyone off.

You could make a case with Undertale being genuinely supported... Though the number of votes for the Undertale matches were incredibly disproportionate in relation with the number of people who had actually played the game at the time, so that isn't entirely true.

So much buttdevastation in 2013

It's possible in Sans's case that he would have won registered voters by even more without 2015. For example, if he did 2 percentage points better among registered users in actuality (not sure the number here, just using an example), he might have actually done 5 percentage points better if the rallies in 2015 had never happened.

I can't really see Draven being an ordinary user fave over Ammy though.

LinkMarioSamus posted...

I have no problem with rallies in theory, just those were not fun to watch in the least. Didn't help that I knew nothing about League of Legends before the Draven rallies and hadn't even heard of Undertale before its rallies. As much as Ulti likes to say he's pro-rally in general, the fact he's a big fan of both League and Undertale most definitely made it easier for him to enjoy those rallies.

Somewhat in Ulti's defense, he tried out those games because of the rallies.

True.

Yesmar_ posted...

It's possible in Sans's case that he would have won registered voters by even more without 2015. For example, if he did 2 percentage points better among registered users in actuality (not sure the number here, just using an example), he might have actually done 5 percentage points better if the rallies in 2015 had never happened.

I can't really see Draven being an ordinary user fave over Ammy though.

Right! I didn't think of that. It also made perfect sense when Undertale didn't get past Round 1 despite being a 3-seed.

Draven is still a mystery, no matter how I look at it. Non-registered users antivoting a character worse than the users who actually hated him...

Non-registered users didn't anti-vote Draven they just don't know who he is.

Undertale was absolutely not an attack on the community. It was totally different to Draven, who didn’t even win legit. Draven featured a toxic invasion of the board from a fanbase renowned for its hostility. With Undertale the toxicity sadly came from within Board 8. Now to be fair it was mainly just a few of the typical bad actors but they were very loud and still have not stopped. I was embarrassed for Board 8 then.

Now, were the vote totals disproportionate? Not important in any way, that’s how rallies and dedicated fanbases work. Besides, Undertale was blowing up in popularity at that time, so only a small percentage of its players needed to have voted. Didn’t it sell a million copies on Steam alone in 2015, not even all of its sales? I guarantee that there have been JRPGs that have had a much bigger proportion of their total playerbase vote than Undertale did.

The fact is the 2015 Undertale fanbase was very warm and welcoming community full of love for the game that rallied it because they genuinely thought it was the best. Ironically I wound up rooting against it because I knew what the backlash would be and it is a wonderful game that didn’t deserve that.

Yeah, Draven was a full-scale board invasion. The relatively few Undertale fans who migrated to B8 were mostly pretty chill.

Lightning Strikes posted...

Undertale was absolutely not an attack on the community. It was totally different to Draven, who didn’t even win legit. Draven featured a toxic invasion of the board from a fanbase renowned for its hostility. With Undertale the toxicity sadly came from within Board 8. Now to be fair it was mainly just a few of the typical bad actors but they were very loud and still have not stopped. I was embarrassed for Board 8 then.

Now, were the vote totals disproportionate? Not important in any way, that’s how rallies and dedicated fanbases work. Besides, Undertale was blowing up in popularity at that time, so only a small percentage of its players needed to have voted. Didn’t it sell a million copies on Steam alone in 2015, not even all of its sales? I guarantee that there have been JRPGs that have had a much bigger proportion of their total playerbase vote than Undertale did.

The fact is the 2015 Undertale fanbase was very warm and welcoming community full of love for the game that rallied it because they genuinely thought it was the best. Ironically I wound up rooting against it because I knew what the backlash would be and it is a wonderful game that didn’t deserve that.

I really hope you’re not talking about me in that first paragraph. You can check the tape. I could not have been more happy/pleasant.

Advokaiser posted...

What registered user (aside from Ulti) liked seeing those contests being ruined by them?

I liked seeing Undertale win since it's a good game despite all the meme culture that surrounds it.

Advokaiser posted...

Right! I didn't think of that. It also made perfect sense when Undertale didn't get past Round 1 despite being a 3-seed.

Undertale didn't make it out of Round 1 because Octopath ended up being equal in strength to Shovel Knight. At the end of the day, without rallies, Undertale is just another indie game on this site, and not even the kind that GameFAQs would normally take to.

Remove 2015, now imagine Undertale vs. Shovel Knight. I think people would have considered a 47-53 split to be a good result for Undertale.

I think Undertale would have won that match if it was held even half a year earlier.

Lightning Strikes posted...

The fact is the 2015 Undertale fanbase was very warm and welcoming community full of love for the game that rallied it because they genuinely thought it was the best. Ironically I wound up rooting against it because I knew what the backlash would be and it is a wonderful game that didn’t deserve that.

It was the timing most of all, don't believe half of the them a year later would still call it the absolute best game ever, but the community was right there in its peak and wanted to help their new favorite toy to victory.

Later on part of the strength definitely also came from people just wanting to piss us off because they thought we were all MWC or Extha. That boosted it for sure.

ctesjbuvf posted...

It was the timing most of all, don't believe half of the them a year later would still call it the absolute best game ever, but the community was right there in its peak and wanted to help their new favorite toy to victory.

Later on part of the strength definitely also came from people just wanting to piss us off because they thought we were all MWC or Extha. That boosted it for sure.

It's still very close to my top 10. That game is legitimately an all-time great.

Bump

I guess that things are really quite. But Dragon Quest 12 was announced and I hope it comes to Switch.

I don't think we will see DQ12 for at least 2-3 years! the engine the game being built on Unreal Engine 5 is not officially released yet. they did say they are making the game more "adult" and changing the turn based battle system, seems like it's going to be quite different than the usual DQ.

"I'm always honest, picking the best answer for me" vs. 2018 Link.

It just means these people genuinely believe Link is the best ever

I meant it as in "who's stronger", lol.

Advokaiser posted...

I meant it as in "who's stronger", lol.

Link

Because they genuinely believe he's the best

My older brother's untouchable all-time favorite game is OoT and even then he asked me 2 months ago, "But why is Link so popular (on GameFAQs)?"

I honestly didn't know what to say.

Advokaiser posted...

My older brother's untouchable all-time favorite game is OoT and even then he asked me 2 months ago, "But why is Link so popular (on GameFAQs)?"

That makes no sense.

UltimaterializerX posted...

That makes no sense.

Well, he added: "He only says 'hyah!'..." Couldn't agree more.

I mean, we both like him, we are aware he's extremely iconic, etc. But you gotta admit he's extremely bland as a character.

Almost no one is voting based on who is most well written character, you're just asked for your favorite, which can be based on anything. Most of our strongest characters are bland

Bland characters are often the most popular because we can easily personify our most desirable qualities onto them.

Well, a third of the Noble Niners (Cloud, Seph, Snake) aren't "bland". Hell, even Sonic had much more of a personality than Mario did in the 16-bit era.

I think it's more that most game characters are bland due to the focus on gameplay over story, and people are going to focus more on the characters associated with games they love. And if story takes a backseat to gameplay, it's clear that dull characters would wind up being popular, simply because there's more of them.

charmander6000 posted...

Bland characters are often the most popular because we can easily personify our most desirable qualities onto them.

Why isn't Frisk way more popular than Sans, though? (Honest question.)

Advokaiser posted...

Why isn't Frisk way more popular than Sans, though?

who

Oh, the MC.

There are always exceptions to the rule, but those exceptions are generally situations where the secondary character is an overwhelming fan favorite (like Auron) or the protagonist just isn't likable. Even silent characters are capable of displaying personality, and Frisk just doesn't. It's a case where the player can project themselves TOO much into the lead role and it basically erases the avatar as a character.

Bump

Bump again.

Samus vs. Cloud, Semifinals 2021 or 2022
make it happen

First we need Samus vs Mario in the round before that. And watch Mario somehow still pull it out again.

the biggest Metroid game that's come out during the contest era

Metroid Prime 1 came out after the first contest!

Did it? I thought it came out just before, whoops!

Yeah, part of what made Samus/Sonic such a shocker was that all Samus really had was Smash and Super Metroid.

It's also not clear if Super Metroid was all that strong back then. It would also be many, many years before Super Metroid would put up a good looking showing in a contest match.

I mean, we knew Metroid Prime was coming out back then, right? Pre-release hype for something like that probably helped.