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Contest Stats and Discussion - Part 1132
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charmander6000 posted... He really should go back to 64 character contests, since 128 characters is just too much. I can't agree. Most of the characters that get in by way of an expanded bracket are liable to be fodder that we can afford not to see. Do we REALLY need to see, say, Kaim Argonar or Yoshimitsu stink up the joint year in and year out??? No! --- "Divine judgment for an evil soul! Sacred Penance! Rest in peace." - Estellise Sidos Heurassein, Tales of Vesperia |
We would lose out on an incredible numbers of games and character with only 64 entrants. --- Black Turtle did a pretty good job. |
Fun fact: Ryu from Street Fighter doesn't even get enough nominations to make a 128-character bracket this year. --- Black Turtle did a pretty good job. |
With a 64 character bracket you're more likely to get guys like Yuri wasting spots while Tifa misses the contest. You can say that a 128 character bracket lets lots of fodder in, but it also allows in strong characters who don't usually get a lot of nominations. --- Demyx is better than Axel. http://www.last.fm/user/crazydom |
MegatokyoEd posted... With a 64 character bracket you're more likely to get guys like Yuri wasting spots while Tifa misses the contest. That's true. No matter the bracket size, fodder's bound to worm its way in. --- "Divine judgment for an evil soul! Sacred Penance! Rest in peace." - Estellise Sidos Heurassein, Tales of Vesperia |
We
would lose far, far too many great characters to ever consider a
64-character bracket again. 128 1v1 12-hour format gave us two amazing
contests in 2010. Let's just bring it back for next time. --- I am Iron Chef Chinese Chen Kenichi's greatest fan. Iron Chef Kenichi's career record in Kitchen Stadium - W:67, L:22, T:3 |
We'd still get five or six Pokemon, a couple of Tales characters, and Guybrush Threepwood. To put things into perspective, a 64-character contest would only have the Top 7 seeds from each division of this contest, plus one wild card eight seed. --- Current Let's Play: Final Fantasy II - http://forums.somethingawful.com/showthread.php?threadid=3557012 Previous: http://lparchive.org/author/mega64 |
If
the 2010 bracket was only 64 characters (going by pure nominations),
among the characters that would have missed out are Mega Man X,
Knuckles, Donkey Kong, The Boss, Yuna, Frog, Sub-Zero, Zelda, Fox,
Jecht, Aerith, Terra, Tifa, and, you know, that guy who broke the
goddamn Noble Nine Missingno. 128 is fine. --- ~War~ |
The less we see of Ryu in regular contests the better. Maybe in B8 NCAA Contests |
KamikazePotato posted... Fun fact: Ryu from Street Fighter doesn't even get enough nominations to make a 128-character bracket this year. Indeed. If anything, there needs to be more of a movement to stop nominating obvious fodder, especially after this year. I'm really hoping for a more optimal roster next contest. Keep the jokes to a minimum and keep the strongest competitors in. --- Now Playing: Tales of Xillia (Jude Story), Fire Emblem Awakening |
ChenKenichiFan posted... We would lose far, far too many great characters to ever consider a 64-character bracket again. 128 1v1 12-hour format gave us two amazing contests in 2010. Let's just bring it back for next time. No. 12 hour matches are far too boring. --- "Divine judgment for an evil soul! Sacred Penance! Rest in peace." - Estellise Sidos Heurassein, Tales of Vesperia |
Jill almost missed the bracket. I would have thrown a goddamn seismic fit. --- I am Iron Chef Chinese Chen Kenichi's greatest fan. Iron Chef Kenichi's career record in Kitchen Stadium - W:67, L:22, T:3 |
StarStormScream posted... Indeed. If anything, there needs to be more of a movement to stop nominating obvious fodder, especially after this year. I'm really hoping for a more optimal roster next contest. Keep the jokes to a minimum and keep the strongest competitors in. The first step is to stop nominating Tails characters altogether. --- Current Let's Play: Final Fantasy II - http://forums.somethingawful.com/showthread.php?threadid=3557012 Previous: http://lparchive.org/author/mega64 |
I
can't agree. Most of the characters that get in by way of an expanded
bracket are liable to be fodder that we can afford not to see. You have to remember that fodder will get in a 64 character bracket which causes more strong character to miss out. Just going by 2010 we would have seen Captain Price GlaDOS (by 2010 standards she was weak) Laharl Isaac (borderline fodder) Travis Touchdown Lloyd Irving Soap MacTavish Yuri Lowell Not to mention we would get an assortment of weaker characters over strong snubs --- BOP Results: http://www.freewebs.com/charmander6000/CB9%20BOP.xls Points: 98/129 Today's Picks: Sora and Fox McCloud |
charmander6000 posted... I can't agree. Most of the characters that get in by way of an expanded bracket are liable to be fodder that we can afford not to see. Regardless, this "more is better" mentality is coming off to me as the wrong way to handle these contests... --- "Divine judgment for an evil soul! Sacred Penance! Rest in peace." - Estellise Sidos Heurassein, Tales of Vesperia |
I will not have a bad word said about Soap MacTavish. He is not fodder! --- Fine! I'll go to the store and get your Goddamn drain cleaner! Character Battle IX Tingle Victory Parade - the journey is over.... |
Some notable characters that would've missed a 128-character contest this year: Aeris Jak Ryu (Street Fighter) Jigglypuff Marth Nightmare Vincent Valentine The Boss Sub-Zero Meta Knight Midna Agent 47 Balthier Locke Cole Thrall Terra Princess Peach Tommy Vercetti Isaac (Golden Sun) Rydia Proto Man Eggman Niko Bellic Altair Ryu Hayabusa Lugia Laharl Ramza Beoulve Ridley Shadow the Hedgehog Wesker Simon Belmont Kerrigan Big Daddy Scorpion Gilgamesh Pac-Man Catherine Celes Chere Tails Ocelot Roxas Yuna Duke Nukem Vyse Wario Cecil Harvey Magikarp Jill Valentine Kratos Aurion Weighted Companion Cube Rikku Zelda Donkey Kong Remember, that's some of who would've missed a 128-character bracket, not 64. --- Black Turtle did a pretty good job. |
Not_Wylvane posted... StarStormScream posted...Indeed. If anything, there needs to be more of a movement to stop nominating obvious fodder, especially after this year. I'm really hoping for a more optimal roster next contest. Keep the jokes to a minimum and keep the strongest competitors in. Would be nice. (And I'm a Tales fan myself) It would be nice is some fighting characters got more love in the nomination phase, most specifically Street Fighter and Mortal Kombat. Would love to see a bracket with like 6-7 of them combined than seeing 4-5 Tales characters again. --- Now Playing: Tales of Xillia (Jude Story), Fire Emblem Awakening |
Regardless, this "more is better" mentality is coming off to me as the wrong way to handle these contests... I agree, a 256 character contest would be overkill, a 128 is not. --- BOP Results: http://www.freewebs.com/charmander6000/CB9%20BOP.xls Points: 98/129 Today's Picks: Sora and Fox McCloud |
If
you want to have a 64 entrant contest, but avoid fodder, give automatic
spots to every character to ever make the Sweet Sixteen and/or a
certain round. If there's still space left, have nominations for the
handful of spots left (possibly more if you have byes.) Could be good for creating a "Power Bracket" at least one year. I like 24 hour matches way more, so I'd rather have that than have stronger characters in but I understand a lot of people disagree, so I'd settle for only getting this every now and then. I still think this is something that should be tried at least once though. --- "What's the matter with bootblacking? We both like it very much!" This is Yesmar. |
StarStormScream posted... KamikazePotato posted...Fun fact: Ryu from Street Fighter doesn't even get enough nominations to make a 128-character bracket this year. Now that's something I can get behind. --- "Divine judgment for an evil soul! Sacred Penance! Rest in peace." - Estellise Sidos Heurassein, Tales of Vesperia |
Perhaps
this is too radical of a solution, but what about something like they
do in the MLB Hall of Fame? Where if you don't get n% you're no
longer eligible in future years? This would prevent fodder that makes
every contest only to get blown out in the first round (lol Tales) from
taking up spots from new challengers. Perhaps with a rule that being in a game that was released since the last contest ended re-instates the characters eligibility? Just some food for thought. There will always be fodder, but at least it would be new fodder. --- I pwn you all! |
Saying
Ryu wouldn't make a 128 bracket is a little misleading. That's assuming
that all of the 3/8 seeds would have gotten more nominations than him
(admittedly probable), and that there were no vote-ins, which seems
pretty unlikely. --- "What's the matter with bootblacking? We both like it very much!" This is Yesmar. |
raginbull911 posted... Perhaps this is too radical of a solution, but what about something like they do in the MLB Hall of Fame? Where if you don't get n% you're no longer eligible in future years? This would prevent fodder that makes every contest only to get blown out in the first round (lol Tales) from taking up spots from new challengers. Makes sense. Let's set it at 20%. Goodbye, X and Ryu! Goodbye, characters who get crushed by SFF! --- Current Let's Play: Final Fantasy II - http://forums.somethingawful.com/showthread.php?threadid=3557012 Previous: http://lparchive.org/author/mega64 |
Also, based on current board polls, looks like Tanner will be replacing Link in the Noble Nine. --- Current Let's Play: Final Fantasy II - http://forums.somethingawful.com/showthread.php?threadid=3557012 Previous: http://lparchive.org/author/mega64 |
hmm,
assuming the seeds accurately reflect # of nominations received (might
be doubtful for the 3 seeds), a 64-character bracket would've had the
following characters (by divsion so I don't use as many lines): Division 1: Link, Raiden, Shepard, Tharja, Draven, Yuri Lowell, Mega Man X Division 2: Sonic, Lucina, Phoenix Wright, KOS-MOS, Chrom, Garrus Vakarian, Bowser Division 3: Sephiroth, Morrigan, Luigi, Big Boss, Elizabeth, Kirby, Wheatley, CATS (probably) Division 4: Solid Snake, Alucard, GlaDOS, Ike, Shulk, Lara Croft, Kefka Division 5: Cloud, Handsome Jack, Dante, Squirtle, Yu Narukami, Leon, Gordon Freeman Division 6: Crono, Pikachu, Sora, Booker, Lee Everett, Nathan Drake, Fox Division 7: Samus, Neku, Ezio, Auron, Dragonborn, Master Chief, Tifa Division 8: Mario, Vivi, Squall, Ammy, Creeper, Red, Pit Division 9: Mega Man, Kratos, Zero, Lenneth Valkyrie, John Marston, Lightning, Charizard gonna just assume that of the 8 seeds, CATS would win out due to being a board favorite |
Not_Wylvane posted... Makes sense. Let's set it at 20%. Luckily for Ryu, SSF4 has an updating coming out this winter. Goodbye X, your contributions will not be forgotten. Now for Draven holding Link below 20%. --- I pwn you all! |
I the Character Contest becomes a yearly thing again we could do 128 Characters with some stipulations: If the character finishes in the Top 64 they are automatically enter the next contest and is seeded based on how they finished in the previous contest. If the character does not finish in the Top 64 they are banned from entering the next contest but my enter the one after. Or we could use the Top 32 or less. Some characters should just have an automatic entrance, that would prolly help keep some of the joke/fodder out --- https://pbs.twimg.com/media/BMcwhStCYAAr-mC.jpg Dallas Cowboys and Mavs |
I still think we need an Inanimate Object Contest! Portal Gun vs. Gravity Gun, who you got? --- PSN - Aevio "I'm on a Goomba." - BlackMageJawa |
KamikazePotato posted... Fun fact: Ryu from Street Fighter doesn't even get enough nominations to make a 128-character bracket this year. I have a feeling that stuff like this is the reason for the expanded field this year. Either way, let's get back to 128-entrant contests next time and start the 24h matches at least a round earlier. Sound good? --- Currently Playing - Super Metroid, MGS4, Brawl, FFVII, Wind Waker, RE4, SOTC |
12h for first two rounds are fine, if it's only for one round things get way too long. It's only a few people who obsess over trends that are dying off anyway as the userbase gets older and changes significantly that give a s*** about trends. Their opinions are meaningless in the grand scheme of things (unless it's put to a vote). --- Current Let's Play: Final Fantasy II - http://forums.somethingawful.com/showthread.php?threadid=3557012 Previous: http://lparchive.org/author/mega64 |
We could start 24 hour matches by the third round (32 characters), a 2.5 month contest is not too bad. --- BOP Results: http://www.freewebs.com/charmander6000/CB9%20BOP.xls Points: 98/129 Today's Picks: Sora and Fox McCloud |
Isn't it around the length we have right now anyway? 128-character 1v1 with 12h for first two rounds is pretty much the way to go. --- Current Let's Play: Final Fantasy II - http://forums.somethingawful.com/showthread.php?threadid=3557012 Previous: http://lparchive.org/author/mega64 |
I don't think there needs to be a rule for what characters to be "locked" in a new bracket Allen has enough contest knowledge to know what characters are actually worth something,and he can choose them himself Also-I believe we will need to see the return of the limit characters-per-game to avoid what happened with Pokemon this contest Of course we can also see something like 3 Pokemon from every generation to laugh at this rule...and limiting it to a franchise/series will really hurt FF so I don't know |
We can replace the Pokemon with more Monkey Island characters! --- Current Let's Play: Final Fantasy II - http://forums.somethingawful.com/showthread.php?threadid=3557012 Previous: http://lparchive.org/author/mega64 |
charmander6000 posted... We could start 24 hour matches by the third round (32 characters), a 2.5 month contest is not too bad. Division Finals and onward are 24 hours, that's 71 days not counting bonus matches |
Here
is a list for example of all of the characters to ever make the
Divisional Finals* (or place 1-2 in them in the case of 4 ways). Looks
like a pretty good group to me. Plus there's room for 6 more noms (or
14+ if you do a bye/ToC set up) Mario Donkey Kong Alucard Cloud Lara Croft Crono Aerith Snake Pac-Man Scorpion Jill Valentine Link Sonic Samus Mega Man Sephiroth Magus Squall Bowser Ryu Tommy Vercetti Yoshi Frog Zero Auron Dante Sora Diablo Ganondorf Kirby Master Chief Vincent Valentine Tifa Rikku Peach Zelda Yuna Chun-Li Luigi Pikachu L-Block Zack Mega Man X Mewtwo Weighted Companion Cube Charizard Revolver Ocelot Liquid Snake Kefka Dr. Robotnik Draven Commander Shepard Big Boss GladDOS Squirtle Leon Kennedy Pokemon Trainer Blue Red/Wario/Wrex *First three contests have been converted to 8x8 brackets for the purposes of comparison. --- "What's the matter with bootblacking? We both like it very much!" This is Yesmar. |
128
with several vote-ins is probably optimal for characters. 128 on its
own will lead to plenty of big name snubs. 64 would be a complete
disaster. At least a fifth of the bracket would be fodder and many, if
not most, midcarders would miss out. Some near-elites wouldn't make it.
Heck, a noble-niner could miss out and it wouldn't totally shock me. And a 64-entrant games contest with no vote-ins would be much worse. --- We are living our lives Abound with so much information |
As long as board 8 influences the nominations as much as they do, it's going to be hard to avoid the amount of fodder we get. --- tune in tokyo 142.94 |
Alternatively,
kind of vote in poll could help weed out the dumber options. Also agree
that 128 is the best number, and if you do 1v1 in that format, 12 hour
matches are ideal, at least in the first round. --- tune in tokyo 142.94 |
troll idea: whoever gets the most nominations wins the contest outright what now, LoL fans |
1337gamerpr0 posted... troll idea: whoever gets the most nominations wins the contest outright Each champion gets 1000 nominations Link gets 1001 Link wins |
And lost in all of this is the fact that Nathan Drake isn't doubling Mr. G&W any longer... --- "Divine judgment for an evil soul! Sacred Penance! Rest in peace." - Estellise Sidos Heurassein, Tales of Vesperia |
stop going up G&W |
Why
not give byes to the stronger seeds until later rounds ala domestic
soccer cups. Round one is for new noms and fodder. Winners get to face
midcarders in round 2. Winners there face near elites in round 3.
Finally have the elites/noble 9 enter in round 4. You get to keep more characters involved and have more interesting/close/debateable matches in each round. --- “If we smell the roses and sip some Champagne, so be it; if not, that’s life.” |
1337gamerpr0 posted... stop going up G&W shhh, he'll hit you with the 9 hammer --- "Divine judgment for an evil soul! Sacred Penance! Rest in peace." - Estellise Sidos Heurassein, Tales of Vesperia |
Fayt_Esteed posted... 1337gamerpr0 posted...stop going up G&W *uses Counter* |
Why
not give byes to the stronger seeds until later rounds ala domestic
soccer cups. Round one is for new noms and fodder. Winners get to face
midcarders in round 2. Winners there face near elites in round 3.
Finally have the elites/noble 9 enter in round 4. You get to keep more characters involved and have more interesting/close/debateable matches in each round. The main issue is seeding does not directly translate into strength, just look at all the seeding upsets this contest has had. --- BOP Results: http://www.freewebs.com/charmander6000/CB9%20BOP.xls Points: 98/129 Today's Picks: Sora and Fox McCloud |
charmander6000 posted... Why not give byes to the stronger seeds until later rounds ala domestic soccer cups. Round one is for new noms and fodder. Winners get to face midcarders in round 2. Winners there face near elites in round 3. Finally have the elites/noble 9 enter in round 4. but I want Shulk to get multiple byes! :lol |
Vincent
as a 23 seed goes on a streak until the 11th seeded Mewtwo (unless you
think he has dropped enough to lose to The Boss/Sub-Zero) or if you
think the picture really affected him badly he could go to Bowser or
even Sonic. --- BOP Results: http://www.freewebs.com/charmander6000/CB9%20BOP.xls Points: 98/129 Today's Picks: Sora and Fox McCloud |
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