GameFAQs Contests
Contest Stats and Discussion - Part 1007
ZFS posted... I would take Ryu/Ken over Crono/Lavos pretty easy. --- Black Turtle did a pretty good job. |
   |
Sure
you can. It's not a traditional contest. You can have totally different
results if people take into consideration the rivalry aspect of the
contest. If they don't, we'll get the mostly predictable results. If
they do, who knows. --- peace comes from within |
Crono
is a farcry from Samus, and he's teamed with a bad second half, who
isn't a rival in any notable sense. If it's Crono vs. Ryu, then yeah,
Ryu loses. --- peace comes from within |
ZFS posted... Sure you can. It's not a traditional contest. You can have totally different results if people take into consideration the rivalry aspect of the contest. If they don't, we'll get the mostly predictable results. If they do, who knows. Yep, and I'd rather bank on rivalries mattering. Because if they don't matter, then I'll die a little inside anyway. --- PSN - Aevio BlackMageJawa - "I'm on a Goomba." |
Crono
is a far cry from Samus, but Ryu is a far cry from Crono. Lavos sucks
but Ken isn't much better. You gotta bank on a significant rivalry
boost, which is fine, but I've outlined a couple reasons why I'm
skeptical that that'll happen so yeah. --- Black Turtle did a pretty good job. |
That's
fine! I'm not trying to convince you to believe what I'm saying,
because there's no way I can without knowing how people are going to
vote -- and no one will know that until the contest starts. I'm banking
on rivalries mattering, maybe not 100% 'must be a good rivalry to get my
vote,' but enough that the 'classics' will benefit more than most. --- peace comes from within |
From: WarThaNemesis2 | #342 I've been saying Akuma > Ken for years! From: red sox 777 | #344 What in the world are we basing Zack's previous strength on exactly? A 4-way mess? In the one clean match, you can project him at around 30% on Link, which is rather humorous considering that's basically what I adjusted Zack to in 2010 based on Mario/Mega Man weirdness. I mean, you can assume there was no Mario/MM weirdness if you like, and that'll drop Zack down to about 21%, but I don't think most people are accepting that big of a drop for Zack. MMX isn't as strong as MM, but he's not too far off (maybe 54-46 or something) Also, I don't really think MMX is worth that much on MM indirectly. I've never been very impressed with MMX, and I don't think he deserves to be on the same tier with the likes of, say, Auron or Ganondorf. I don't think MMX wins those matches. --- http://www.gifsoup.com/view/593815/frasier-and-niles-dance-o.gif |
KamikazePotato posted... Lavos sucks but Ken isn't much better. welp --- From his looks Magus is Macho Man Randy Savage as an anime zombie. The black wind howls, and one of you will snap into a Slim Jim ooh yeeeah! -sonicblastpunch |
From: KamikazePotato | #355 Ryu/Crono is probably closer than Samus/Crono at this point. --- http://img.imgcake.com/leonpngpe.png http://img.imgcake.com/squalloweenpngem.png |
redrocket posted... KamikazePotato posted... Lavos sucks but Ken isn't much better. welp Sorry but almost jobbing to Wesker and then getting owned by Ganondorf after not making the contest for 5 years doesn't inspire confidence! --- Black Turtle did a pretty good job. |
Lavos isn't that weak, honestly. Or he wasn't in 2005. It's hard to say what 45% on Liquid Snake is worth because that guy is more unstable than...something unstable, but he got that once upon a time. --- "I can set you free, mate." "My freedom was forfeit long ago!" |
I wouldn't even consider Lavos over Ken, but maybe that's just me. --- peace comes from within |
Lavos
would never beat Ken. I'm just saying the strength difference between
them isn't very substantial. Ken probably 60-40s him but neither of them
are strong enough for that number too matter too much. --- Black Turtle did a pretty good job. |
I
don't even think it's Liquid that's an issue. It's more like, look at
where other CT characters were in 2005 versus where they are now. Maybe
the stats say differently, but that feels like an entirely different
era. CT seems much less popular these days, as unfortunate as that is. --- peace comes from within |
I
think Ken would go higher, but I agree that it's not too important
either way. I don't like lining up individual characters against each
other and calling it at that. Maybe that's how it'll go, but that's not
what I'm going with. --- peace comes from within |
I'm
not trying to do that either! I'm just saying that Ken himself isn't a
very valuable asset. Ken as a rivalry boost is something else entirely,
but as far as character strength goes, Ryu's going to be the one holding
down the fort. --- Black Turtle did a pretty good job. |
What
in the world are we basing Zack's previous strength on exactly? A 4-way
mess? In the one clean match, you can project him at around 30% on
Link, which is rather humorous considering that's basically what I
adjusted Zack to in 2010 based on Mario/Mega Man weirdness. I mean, you
can assume there was no Mario/MM weirdness if you like, and that'll drop
Zack down to about 21%, but I don't think most people are accepting
that big of a drop for Zack. 30% on Link, twice. Followed by 34% on Link with Mario and MMX in the poll. It makes 30% on 2008 Link for Zack very clear, about as clear as you can possibly get in 4-ways. I have no idea what you did to adjust Zack in 2010, but I've steadfastly said Zack was at 30% on Link since he put up exactly that in the 2008 contest. 21% is obviously ridiculous- I'm assuming that's for no SFF in Mario/MM or Link/Mario? If Zack 45-55s his former self, then he's not too close to Price. He still did better against MM than Price MMX, so would still wind up at 58-60% on Price with MMX at 46% on MM. That puts 2008 Zack (the one that's worth 30% on Link) just slightly below MMX, which is just about what we would expect based on Link/MMX with a tad bit of SFF. Remember, Link also suffered a major fall in 2010. --- 90s games > 00s games |
Ken Masters (2010c) VS Lavos (2005v) Ken Masters has a strength of 23.81. Lavos has a strength of 18.38. Ken Masters wins with 61.40% of the vote! A win of 16,507 with 72,382 total votes cast. Indisputable proof. --- From his looks Magus is Macho Man Randy Savage as an anime zombie. The black wind howls, and one of you will snap into a Slim Jim ooh yeeeah! -sonicblastpunch |
I
don't even separate them like that. Ryu/Ken are a package set - its the
fact they're together that gives them so much potential (or potential
in my book, anyway). That's as classic a pair as you can get. Voters
might not see it the same way, but if I lose out on taking them over
Samus I'm not going to feel too bad! --- peace comes from within |
2005
wasn't a good year for CT. 2004 was. Magus lost to Knuckles in 2005,
Frog lost 70-30 to Samus, Crono lost 54-46 to Mario. Those matches
probably go pretty similarly now, or even better for CT (because 3 of
those opponents have gotten weaker). Go back another year to 2004, and
you get a very different picture. --- 90s games > 00s games |
red sox 777 posted... 2005 wasn't a good year for CT. 2004 was. Magus lost to Knuckles in 2005, Frog lost 70-30 to Samus, Crono lost 54-46 to Mario. Those matches probably go pretty similarly now, or even better for CT (because 3 of those opponents have gotten weaker). Go back another year to 2004, and you get a very different picture. CT's only gotten weaker over the years, so this isn't really relevant when comparing to the numbers from 2010. --- PSN - Aevio BlackMageJawa - "I'm on a Goomba." |
i mean come on http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MZP3WYiOncI best there ever was don't fail me gamefaqs --- peace comes from within |
ZFS posted... i mean come on http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C19O5xm51dk best there ever was don't fail me gamefaqs I agree --- Black Turtle did a pretty good job. |
From: red sox 777 | #370 CT characters have gotten weaker since 2005 as well. Just those other characters have probably dropped more. It's hard to see Knux beating Magus by a lot after getting the fight of his life from Cecil, for example. Frog losing 70/30 to Samus probably isn't that far off. He got 36% on Bowser. Bowser would have to get more than 40.72% on Samus indirectly for Frog to improve on that 2005 number. That sounds about right, probably, all things considered. Mario/Crono, I dunno. I have a hard time seeing Crono improving on that 2005 number. --- "The great GF...Bahamut." "...GF? I...? Using my powers...It is you humans...I fear..." |
CT's only gotten weaker over the years, so this isn't really relevant when comparing to the numbers from 2010. Has it? If CT would put up the same numbers that it did in 2005, then it's not actually weaker than it was then, is it? Of course it's true that Nintendo and Sonic are weaker than in 2005, so that's not exactly true- but it means that CT has declined no more than Nintendo has since 2005. CT declined very fast from 2005 to 2007, and not since then. --- 90s games > 00s games |
From: ZFS | #372 The best --- http://i.minus.com/iH9vIGOBoyTQ2.gif |
I
have a great deal of respect for Samus's strength though. I'd be very
disappointed if she could beat Crono worse than Crono can beat Ryu, and I
don't think she would, but I could see it happening. --- 90s games > 00s games |
red sox 777 posted... CT's only gotten weaker over the years, so this isn't really relevant when comparing to the numbers from 2010. Has it? If CT would put up the same numbers that it did in 2005, then it's not actually weaker than it was then, is it? Of course it's true that Nintendo and Sonic are weaker than in 2005, so that's not exactly true- but it means that CT has declined no more than Nintendo has since 2005. CT declined very fast from 2005 to 2007, and not since then. Well, 2007 is after 2005, so "since 2005" still works. And why are we talking about nintendo? I thought the original comment was 2005 Lavos vs. 2010 Ken, which has zilch to do with nintendo as a whole. --- PSN - Aevio BlackMageJawa - "I'm on a Goomba." |
My
2010 stats have Crono/Ryu at 60/40 and Samus/Crono at 55/45.
Admittedly, that's taking Missingno's performance on Sephiroth at face
value, which is probably not entirely accurate. --- http://i.minus.com/iH9vIGOBoyTQ2.gif |
Well, 2007 is after 2005, so "since 2005" still works. And why are we talking about nintendo? I thought the original comment was 2005 Lavos vs. 2010 Ken, which has zilch to do with nintendo as a whole. Because I am objecting to the idea that CT has been in constant decline, and that it is a lot weaker than in 2005. It's probably outright stronger than in 2007, and even if it's just flatlined since then, that decline doesn't look nearly as bad when spread over 6 years instead of 2. As for Lavos/Ken, I'd take Ken pretty easily. --- 90s games > 00s games |
I find it fitting that the SF4 trailer is the only one putting the rivalry at center stage! Untouchable tbqh --- peace comes from within |
Leon > KP > ZFS |
The Squall/Seifer duel is the central focus of the FFVIII opening! --- "So cold. I am always by your side." "There ain't no gettin' off of this train we on!" |
So CT got a port just like every other old game. I really don't know if Virtual Console, PSN, or XBox Live ports do very much for these old games. Haven't really noticed anything as yet. --- http://img38.imageshack.us/img38/7760/222bj.jpg |
Crono's not really on par with the other Noble 9 anymore (Sonic aside.) He did barely outdo Yoshi on Missingno. --- "Ahem! There is *sand* on my *boot*!"--Kefka Black Turtle beat me, Yesmar in the Fall 2010 Guru Contest! |
None
of those Missingno matches can be used in any kind of statistical way.
Going by that logic, Crono's pretty close to Sephiroth. --- I wish I could wear skirts and dresses :( -GMUN |
Well, I'm just saying that in a best case scenario, Crono is at 45% on Samus and 60% on Ryu. It's probably less than that. --- http://img.imgcake.com/leonpngpe.png http://img.imgcake.com/squalloweenpngem.png |
I don't disagree about any of that, just saying that using Missingo matches are not the way to prove the point! --- I wish I could wear skirts and dresses :( -GMUN |
Oh, you were responding to Yesmar's post, not mine. I didn't see his post before. --- "I couldn't stand a day without a past or future. I need to live each moment to keep fighting here and now." |
I don't disagree about any of that, just saying that using Missingo matches are not the way to prove the point! Unless Missingno dropped in popularity to to where he 55+/45 his 1st round self (which there's no logical reason for), I think it's a fair argumet, --- "Ahem! There is *sand* on my *boot*!"--Kefka Black Turtle beat me, Yesmar in the Fall 2010 Guru Contest! |
From: LOLContests | #391 I suppose it's fair to say that Kirby would've won the contest in 2007 if he hadn't been LFF'd by DK because of how badly he beat L-Block in round 1 that year then. --- http://i848.photobucket.com/albums/ab48/Leonhart4/Squall.jpg |
I
suppose it's fair to say that Kirby would've won the contest in 2007 if
he hadn't been LFF'd by DK because of how badly he beat L-Block in
round 1 that year then. Based on his 2008 performance, perhaps this is true!~ --- I wish I could wear skirts and dresses :( -GMUN |
I
suppose it's fair to say that Kirby would've won the contest in 2007 if
he hadn't been LFF'd by DK because of how badly he beat L-Block in
round 1 that year then. L-Block increased between rounds due to momentum (and somewhat due to getting better pictures.) That's an entirely logical series of events. Saying Missingno would just drop in popularity when it had momentum at its back, does not. Just because joke characters are unpredictable, doesn't meant they're illogical. You should still be able to explain things afterwards. There are occasionally matches where there's no real explanation other than "fluke," but that happens for everyone, not just joke characters. --- "Ahem! There is *sand* on my *boot*!"--Kefka Black Turtle beat me, Yesmar in the Fall 2010 Guru Contest! |
If you take Yoshi at ~45% on Sephiroth you can do some very interesting things. In the 08 fourways, for what it's worth, Crono got 45% on Samus (with Pikachu and Vincent) and 57% on Ryu (with L-Block and Amaterasu). --- Praise the Black Turtle, Game of the Decade Guru Champ. (Well, I never promised creativity, did I?!) |
From: LOLContests | #394 The problem is that you're presuming to know which Missingno matches were legit and which ones were not. --- http://img.imgcake.com/leonpngpe.png http://img.imgcake.com/squalloweenpngem.png |
Well, I'm just saying that in a best case scenario, Crono is at 45% on Samus and 60% on Ryu. It's probably less than that. If I could lock in Crono's strength for this year, I might take that. It's not as high as I would hope for, but probably about as high as I can reasonably expect to get. 45% on Samus = 48% on Mario in my book.....well I suppose 48% is acceptable. --- 90s games > 00s games |
There's
a lot of good reasons to think Missingno wasn't on his game against
Yoshi. A lot of people predicted this beforehand, Ulti for one was very
vocal about it, so it's not after the fact justification. The basic
idea was the Yoshi was no fun to bandwagon against- he's a Nintendo
midcarder, not a Square elite. Also, removing Missingno's rally votes in Crono/Missingno and adjusting for the fact that it was a day match already puts Crono up to 55-56% on Yoshi. You don't even need any difference in Missingno's performance between rounds to get that far. --- 90s games > 00s games |
The problem is that you're presuming to know which Missingno matches were legit and which ones were not. All I'm saying is that to put Crono on par with the other Noble 9, you have to assume that Missingno underperformed against Yoshi relative to Crono. People came up with explanations for why Missingno would not overperform, but nobody, to my recollection, came up with an explanation for why he would underperform. Even if you use red sox's (undboutedly) generous stats for Crono that's still not on par with Mega Man IMO, the weakest N9 member besides Crono and Sonic. Personally I would rank them (circa 2010) off of Base Link, thusly: Link- 50 Cloud ~47-46 Sephiroth: 40 Snake: 40 Samus: 38 Mario: 38 Mega Man: 36 Crono: 30 Sonic: 30-29 --- "Ahem! There is *sand* on my *boot*!"--Kefka Black Turtle beat me, Yesmar in the Fall 2010 Guru Contest! |
From: LOLContests | #399 People came up with reasons why Missingno would underperform against Yoshi before the match even happened. --- "Stay with me until the end. Please." "Not until the end. Always." |
