GameFAQs Contests

At what point, that should say.
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"I can set you free, mate."
"My freedom was forfeit long ago!"

Bowser is so weird. He could beat Sora or fail to break 40%, and neither would even surprise me. Yeah - but go for the gamble!

Lightening has a good shot of getting close to 35%- but I don't think it will happen this year. Maybe if this contest was after the release, but I would still put her to not > 40%
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Dream3ater: I've played every FFgame from I-XII and I barely payed attention to the story in any of them...There are a ton of people like me

I think of the Bowser/Luigi/Yoshi trio, it's reversed into Luigi > Yoshi > Bowser. I doubt 2003/2004 would repeat itself there, for whatever reason. Nintendo has made Bowser look more and more like a clown and Yoshi is becoming irrelevant rather quickly. Luigi is getting one star role after another.
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"Writhe in my cage of torment, my friend."

Heh, I think it's just because Ryu has had that Mr Consistency tagline on him for so long that when he and Bowser fluctuated it may have caught us off guard and ryu has just changed more over the years than we first thought.
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Shakes Fist!

Well, Luigi put up about the same percentage on Kirby in 2006 as Bowser did in 2005, he might have been able to beat Bowser then. Who knows, I've never understood Mario character SFF. Yoshi owns the favorite Mario character polls, then loses easily to Bowser, then beats Luigi easily, and then Luigi beats Bowser easily.
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6 years later, Crono's quest to defeat Sephiroth -- Round 1: Missingno
'Till shade is gone, 'till water is gone, into the shadow with teeth bared....

Because those B-Tier (and lower) Nintendo guys blew ass pretty often when paired together. It's like they cannibalized each other. This was even more prevalent with Mario characters (Bowser, Luigi, Yoshi, and Peach all got a taste of this). Most people agree that Sonic Team overlap a lot more with Nintendo nowadays than something like 3D Final Fantasy or Halo. You throw a guy in there that overlaps a lot more with Bowser than he would with Auron, and they both suffer.

I don't get why it's still debated so much. No one is calling Shadow a Yoshi clone or anything, but those Sonic guys DO overlap with Nintendo to a greater extent than most other characters, enough so that they'd both suffer. This "suffering" seems greater than in other cases such as Squall/Sora because Nintendo has always been so much heavier in overlap and "isolation."

Welcome to the world of isolation, Sonic!

It's not as though I expect Shadow to hit mid-40s on Mario again (or Knuckles to hit 46% on Squall), but lose to Amaterasu? That is 4way fear, plain and simple.
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Yoblazer: http://i38.tinypic.com/2s024p4.jpg
Watch and you'll see... someday I'll be... part of your world!

Yeah, but Luigi got less than 40% on Sonic, and Bowser got 42.5% on Crono. Maybe it's close, but Bowser might still win.
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"Hold on a minute! That testimony stinks!"
"Witness! You can't just say 'Hello' and expect us to get anywhere! I want you to testify!"

of that Boswer/Luigi/Yoshi trio match them up against the capcom trio, Dante/Ryu/Leon, overall which group would you say is stronger and which ones can beat say Zelda.
that high tier middle pack is getting crowded pretty fast and it's getting tougher to predict clear winners.
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Shakes Fist!

Finally caught up with the 3 topics i missed. Screw finals week!

Couple questions for discussion.

Suppose L-Block is replaced with Midna in that 4-pack. Who do you have getting out of there? I can't figure out if HK or Isaac is stronger.

I haven't heard any discussion of Zelda and Jecht. What do the xsts say she is projected to get on auron and tidus?

Checking out the BOP, Ike is considered almost a lock to make round 3. I had no idea he was considered that strong.
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I used to have a good sig. Now my account is only a shadow of its former glory.

4-way fear's got nothin' to do with it. Shadow's got to prove to me he deserves to win a match. He flat out bombed the last two contests. I didn't pick Ammy. I picked Not-Shadow.

You throw a guy in there that overlaps a lot more with Bowser than he would with Auron, and they both suffer.

But overlap doesn't necessitate SFF. I guarantee Zelda and Final Fantasy overlap to a hefty degree on this site, but where's the SFF?
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"Spoil it for me. I'm never going to play that game so I want to know if he's going to be another Auron or another Sin." - Soul about Jecht vs. PW

I think in that kind of match you can almost throw their indirect strength out the window. It's SFF of the most incomprehensible kind, and moving one of the characters up or down a percent or two to add the "r" in front of the SFF probably isn't going to change the result.
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6 years later, Crono's quest to defeat Sephiroth -- Round 1: Missingno
'Till shade is gone, 'till water is gone, into the shadow with teeth bared....

It necessitates SFF in this case because no one really likes Sonic Co. more than Nintendo Co. Even the people who vote for the Sonic characters don't really know why. I've asked them; they usually can't even remember.

Except for Knuckles. He's thug.

And honestly, what is the point of this argument? It better not be AMATERASU.
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Yoblazer: http://i38.tinypic.com/2s024p4.jpg
Watch and you'll see... someday I'll be... part of your world!

come to think of it, how popular was Bowser's inside Story?
I mean I expect more from yoshi when Galaxy 2 comes out and Luigi just keeps increasing in my eyes, but that DS title was big on Bowser wasn't it?
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Shakes Fist!

But overlap doesn't necessitate SFF. I guarantee Zelda and Final Fantasy overlap to a hefty degree on this site, but where's the SFF?

Overlap doesn't guarantee SFF, but Differences in overlap do imply observable LFF.

That is, Link and Cloud definitely overlap, but if we add a third character to the poll so that everyone overlaps with each other equally, we won't see any LFF.
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6 years later, Crono's quest to defeat Sephiroth -- Round 1: Missingno
'Till shade is gone, 'till water is gone, into the shadow with teeth bared....

But how do you determine/decide when it becomes unequal preference? I just don't see any reason to believe in it. I think a lot of times we try to argue SFF/LFF because a match or two doesn't fit in with our expectations and preconceived notions.

I know I've done it in the past, and the biggest example for me is Tidus. I argued fervently that Mega Man/Tidus was a fluke because I was positive he was stronger than that.

Then Kirby happened, and I realized, "Oh, Mega Man/Tidus was legit. Whoops."
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"So cold. I am always by your side."
"There ain't no gettin' off of this train we on!"

Seriously, Sonic Team was negatively affected by Nintendo. If you don't buy that, then do you simply take their results at face value? Forget about Sonic flat-out losing to Kirby, look at the series' #2 and 3 guys:

Shadow loses to Zidane, the guy who lost handily to Ness the year before
Knuckles can't quite hit 60% on Fei Fong Wong

This just doesn't make sense, preconceived notions or not.
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Yoblazer: http://i38.tinypic.com/2s024p4.jpg
Watch and you'll see... someday I'll be... part of your world!

Knuckles did about the same on Fei that he did on KOS-MOS as he did the year prior to that. Xenogears is cult, but it's dedicated cult. I'm okay with that.

But the thing is that Shadow not only lost to Zidane, but he lost handily (3000 votes). He got 62% on Pyramid Head the year before, which certainly isn't good. It seems like he hovers around the low midcard/fodder line nowadays.
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"So cold. I am always by your side."
"There ain't no gettin' off of this train we on!"

Pyramid Head really impressed there, too. He went from 16.12% against Bowser to 16.18% in a four-way with Auron, Shadow, and Chris Redfield...and beat the RE-lead despite being an NPC from SH. Lots of props to Pyramid Head for that, Shadow-comparison or not...but I do wonder how much better PH could have done (and Shadow could have looked) if Redfield wasn't there.
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T E A M C H O C O L A T E
http://img269.imageshack.us/img269/7355/64590879.png

Well there really isn't a way to determine or quantify how much the overlap is between 2 characters, because we don't have the poll data for it. But you can do what you normally do- look for patterns and think about what seems the most probable.

I know I've constructed contest theories based to try to make things fit my preconceived notions, but I don't think that's hurt on the long run, except in cases where I let bias get into it (Chrono Trigger). Often, my preconceived notions are right, after all. When I have to come up with new ideas to fit my earlier theories too much- that's when I know I can reject those theories.

Also, I really don't argue for SFF/LFF in cases where it didn't strike me as a possibility beforehand, except maybe when I'm in delusional CT fanboy mode and trying to come up with anything to make Crono and co. look good.
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6 years later, Crono's quest to defeat Sephiroth -- Round 1: Missingno
'Till shade is gone, 'till water is gone, into the shadow with teeth bared....

*Silent Hill 2 spoilers look away*

















Pyramid Head technically is not a villain. James Sunderland is. Oh snap.


















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"As always Ulti, I bow to thou wisdom." -Meeks54

Amaterasu: 35.05% against Crono in R1
Amaterasu: 33.71% against Crono in R2

Shadow: 37.78% against Auron in R1
Shadow: 28.01% against Auron in R2

I believe Link hurt Shadow in his match against Zidane. I'm taking Ammy anyway.

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KrahenProphet lived up to his name.

I think James is one of the very few characters I'd support getting into the contest despite knowing he'd be horrible fodder.
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Yoblazer: http://i38.tinypic.com/2s024p4.jpg
Watch and you'll see... someday I'll be... part of your world!

Same. Didn't someone try to rally him a few years ago?
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Board 8 BOP: http://www.freewebs.com/charmander6000/CB8%20BOP.xls
Submit bracket here: http://www.gamefaqs.com/boards/genmessage.php?board=8&topic=52670380

Inviso has run at least one James Sunderland rally before.

Shadow: 37.78% against Auron in R1
Shadow: 28.01% against Auron in R2

Isn't this one of those things we normally chalk up to Last Place Factor? Of course, that depends on if you believe in such things.
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"But you have been given freedom. Freedom to be...outside."
"I am lightning...the rain transformed."

man was shadow really that weak in his last contest appearances?
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Shakes Fist!

I very much believe in Last Place Factor in 4ways, but even if 1v1 returns us to order Shadow has looked like such crap for 5 years now. This is not at all the same guy that got 45% on Mario, or anything close to it. The only collapse worse than this is Magus, really.

I'd love to see a Shadow vs Magus match.
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http://img.imgcake.com/mjpop.gif

The last time we saw Shadow outside of four-ways was in 2004.

35% against 2004 Mega Man or 35% against 2008 Crono?

That's of course if you think Shadow has been static all of these years.
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Board 8 BOP: http://www.freewebs.com/charmander6000/CB8%20BOP.xls
Submit bracket here: http://www.gamefaqs.com/boards/genmessage.php?board=8&topic=52670380

That's of course if you think Shadow has been static all of these years.

If Shadow has been static all these years, then there's no reason for Shadow/Ammy to be debatable. We haven't seen Shadow one-on-one since the site shift, so his one-on-one matches mean very little.
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"Spoil it for me. I'm never going to play that game so I want to know if he's going to be another Auron or another Sin." - Soul about Jecht vs. PW

So really the only Shadow has going for him is past glories, while Ammy has a new game coming out soon?
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Shakes Fist!

Shadow has being widely recognizable going for him, compared to Ammy's relative obscurity.
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6 years later, Crono's quest to defeat Sephiroth -- Round 1: Missingno
'Till shade is gone, 'till water is gone, into the shadow with teeth bared....

Shadow lost to Zidane.

Zidane! They guy who got Ulti-destroyed by Ness!

I need more italics.

Anyway, Ammy isn't great, but she can beat crap tier Square (Balthier) and put up not completely terrible performances on strong characters (Crono, Dante).

Shadow's best match in the last five years (Auron round 1) is one in which he gets 62% on Pyramid Head.
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Mustache...and Green...
http://backloggery.com/rpguy96

To be fair, it's also a match where Auron got 72% on Pyramid Head, and this is with Chris Redfield there to detract from Pyramid's base.

Auron crap tier
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Yoblazer: http://i33.tinypic.com/ml36gl_th.gif
Watch and you'll see... someday I'll be... part of your world!

Shadow has being widely recognizable going for him, compared to Ammy's relative obscurity.

The difference is that people actually seem to like Amaterasu.
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"Hold on a minute! That testimony stinks!"
"Witness! You can't just say 'Hello' and expect us to get anywhere! I want you to testify!"

Hey red sox, you approve of this? http://img707.imageshack.us/img707/7474/alucardvmagus.jpg

Bear in mind it's a PSX sprite against a SNES sprite. Only so much I can do to try making them look equal.
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11/15/2009 - Never forget 4th and 2.

I fully believe that Shadow's spiral downward is his fanbase slowly growing up and realizing what a godawful character he is.

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KrahenProphet lived up to his name.

Didn't we see the same thing about Phoenix Wright?

I think we should compare the two characters. Is Amy way more popular than PW?
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*is Dranze*
Krahen Prophet did a fatality.

Zidane will be on the up, I fully expect Dissidia to boost the B-tier FF leads who were easy to use, but will have 0 effect on the big names like Cloud and Squall, so Tidus might actually gain a few points here.
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Shakes Fist!

But most everybody knows who Tidus is, they just don't particularly like him. That collar isn't going to help him any in that regard.
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Mustache...and Green...
http://backloggery.com/rpguy96

After looking at Ama's past polls and using Frank West (I don't know if this is a bad idea or not), but if you ignore what she got on Crono, she only really gets 62/63% on him, and looking at Frank West's past matches, he's a joke; he was dominated in a poll by Ada Wong, remember? The same character Ama barely beat.

Although Shadow only managed to get similar numbers on Pyramid Head, I don't think Ama's looked anymore impressive than Shadow even in 4 ways.
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*is Dranze*
Krahen Prophet did a fatality.

I kinda liked him better after Dissidia for some reason, though I liked the FFIV guys less after playing that game so i dunno.
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Shakes Fist!

From: MarioSuperstar | #239
using Frank West (I don't know if this is a bad idea or not)

Yes.

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KrahenProphet lived up to his name.

Aw yeah, Bacon answered my question on SBallin'!

"Just a few contest related questions: Why did you decide to do a vote-in for this contest? How many nominations did the most nominated character get? How many nominations did the least nominated character who got into the contest get?" -LeonhartFour

Why do a vote-in? Why not! It seemed like an interesting way to round out the bracket and get some early hype built up for the contest, and it seems to have done exactly that. Link received the most nominations with 1853. Jak and Revolver Ocelot were tied for the last two people to make the contest without being a part of the vote-in with 196 nominations.
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"The great GF...Bahamut."
"...GF? I...? Using my powers...It is you humans...I fear..."

So did Prinny get outside help then?
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Board 8 BOP: http://www.freewebs.com/charmander6000/CB8%20BOP.xls
Submit bracket here: http://www.gamefaqs.com/boards/genmessage.php?board=8&topic=52670380

Woah, think that's the first time we've gotten hard numbers for nominations.

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KrahenProphet lived up to his name.

From: charmander6000 | #243
So did Prinny get outside help then?

Wouldn't be surprised if there were other Disgaea fans who nominated Prinny.
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"So cold. I am always by your side."
"There ain't no gettin' off of this train we on!"

That's pretty neat, but begs the question of how in the world did Ratchet get over 200 nominations?
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Mustache...and Green...
http://backloggery.com/rpguy96

From: KamikazePotato | #244
Woah, think that's the first time we've gotten hard numbers for nominations.

Yep, I asked because I was curious as to approximately how many nominations get a character into the contest and how much impact Board 8 rallies really have.
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"The great GF...Bahamut."
"...GF? I...? Using my powers...It is you humans...I fear..."

nah, prinny got B8 noms from people who didn't submit their noms to the board tally, like me and probably a few hardcore disgaea fans outside, though now we know 200 noms= safe spot.
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Shakes Fist!

Yes.

Is there a reason it's any worse than using Pyramid Head?
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*is Dranze*
Krahen Prophet did a fatality.

From: RPGuy96 | #246
That's pretty neat, but begs the question of how in the world did Ratchet get over 200 nominations?

R&C: A Crack in Time just came out within the last month or two.

Jak is the one that I'm curious about. When's the last time he even had a game?
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"So cold. I am always by your side."
"There ain't no gettin' off of this train we on!"