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Contest Stats and Discussion - Part 340

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LeonhartForever | Posted 8/3/2006 12:47:35 AM | message detail

Wow you guys get more heated in here than I remember. >.>

This is unusually heated, even for the contest season. And to think, it all started with discussion about the females side of the bracket.

AND YOU ALL SAID A FEMALES HALF WOULD BE BORING!
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Squall, Tidus, The Prince of Persia, Nightmare, Sub-Zero, Captain Falcon, Raiden
Presea, Chun-Li, Tifa, Celes, Quistis, Amy Rose, Mei Ling

ChichiriMuyo | Posted 8/3/2006 12:47:51 AM | message detail

Don't care. You said it happened after the Nintendo boost and it didn't. I don't care who you were telling it to or what context you need to set it to for it to fit in their tiny world view. He didnt' gain after the Nintendo boost, he gained in 2k3. For christ's sake, he only reinforced the kid's belief that Seph wasn't that value in 2k3.
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Z1mzum kicked my ass in the guru contest, so now I have to kiss his ass.
Detective in Sir Chris' Police

Lopen | Posted 8/3/2006 12:48:19 AM | message detail

Go ahead. Do it for all four years. I'll be waiting here for you.

Yeah, I like this strategy... because I actually have to do work, and I'm too lazy to do this, you automatically win.

Just look at the damn 2004 SFF adjusted stats and compare them at a glance with the 2005 SFF adjusted stats. You'll see I'm right and that "everybody dropping" is nonsense.
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Z1mZum whooped me so bad in the Guru Contest that the next Lopen wannabe is gonna feel it.

Karma Hunter | Posted 8/3/2006 12:49:03 AM | message detail

From what I've seen Stats Topic Discussions are the most angry topics on the entire board. I'm, like, 1000 times more nasty in here than I am anywhere else. <_<

"For the last time, Snake *will* beat Samus after SSBB! I'LL F'ING KILL YOU"
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Do not kill. Do not rape. Do not steal. These are principles which every man of every faith can embrace. These are codes of behavior.

ChichiriMuyo | Posted 8/3/2006 12:49:09 AM | message detail

"AND YOU ALL SAID A FEMALES HALF WOULD BE BORING!"

I never once believed that. In fact, I've always been a proponent of the idea that a females bracket would be better than a villains bracket and I'm glad to see more peopel agreeing (though I think you always thought that, right?)
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Z1mzum kicked my ass in the guru contest, so now I have to kiss his ass.
Detective in Sir Chris' Police

creativename | Posted 8/3/2006 12:49:11 AM | message detail

I think you meant the other way around? But either way, Snake vs Leon, Bowser vs Ganondorf, winners face each other sound good? It'd solve a lot of problems.

What would Snake vs. Squall show? I'm not clear on that one.

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As the best poster in the stats topic, I move that we all stop acting like elitist know-it-alls about matches that aren't horribly obvious.

ChichiriMuyo | Posted 8/3/2006 12:49:54 AM | message detail

"you automatically win."

It's okay. I'd have won if you did the work, too. I'd just have won MORE.
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Z1mzum kicked my ass in the guru contest, so now I have to kiss his ass.
Detective in Sir Chris' Police

LeonhartForever | Posted 8/3/2006 12:50:44 AM | message detail

What would Snake vs. Squall show? I'm not clear on that one.

Uhh..the KHII effect?

Really, I'm thinking he just threw Squall in there just to have Snake somebody to face. It's really more about who wins Bowser/Ganon and if they could beat Snake.
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Squall, Tidus, The Prince of Persia, Nightmare, Sub-Zero, Captain Falcon, Raiden
Presea, Chun-Li, Tifa, Celes, Quistis, Amy Rose, Mei Ling

ExThaNemesis | Posted 8/3/2006 12:50:44 AM | message detail

I think it's coz you guys still get along even if you're willing to carve someone up verbally.
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Everything's 10X better with a RKO and Orton pose. ~ Donkey111

ChichiriMuyo | Posted 8/3/2006 12:50:58 AM | message detail

"What would Snake vs. Squall show? I'm not clear on that one."

How badly Squall still gets SFF'd by Snake, of course.
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Z1mzum kicked my ass in the guru contest, so now I have to kiss his ass.
Detective in Sir Chris' Police

MasterOfHunters | Posted 8/3/2006 12:51:16 AM | message detail

I meant Leon S. Kennedy... Who knows? Leon may have gotten stronger with PS2 RE4. I can't see Snake facing anyone stronger than Leon (assuming he increased a little) in the 1st round.

Karma Hunter | Posted 8/3/2006 12:51:52 AM | message detail

Snake v. Squall wouldn't show much other than perhaps revealing whether or not Squall got SFFed in 2k2, depending on how he performed. Vincent would fulfill that role there much better, seeing as how FF7 v. MGS is much more dangerous than FF8 v. MGS.
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Do not kill. Do not rape. Do not steal. These are principles which every man of every faith can embrace. These are codes of behavior.

MasterOfHunters | Posted 8/3/2006 12:52:05 AM | message detail

Neh, I wouldn't waste Squall in the 1st round.

LeonhartForever | Posted 8/3/2006 12:52:18 AM | message detail

Wait...you're assuming this all happens in the first and second rounds?

If Bowser/Ganondorf is a first round match, CJayC has no idea how to make a bracket.
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Squall, Tidus, The Prince of Persia, Nightmare, Sub-Zero, Captain Falcon, Raiden
Presea, Chun-Li, Tifa, Celes, Quistis, Amy Rose, Mei Ling

ChichiriMuyo | Posted 8/3/2006 12:52:41 AM | message detail

"I think it's coz you guys still get along even if you're willing to carve someone up verbally."

I think it's 'cause we aren't a bunch of little ******* and can take a heated argument for what it instead of lettign that rule your opinion of a person. Well, except Shake and Master Mage. Neither of them can let go of ****.
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Z1mzum kicked my ass in the guru contest, so now I have to kiss his ass.
Detective in Sir Chris' Police

Draco1214 | Posted 8/3/2006 12:53:22 AM | message detail

I wouldn't take Ganondorf over Snake. On top of the fact that it's not even completely clear if Ganondorf is stronger than Bowser, Snake has a history of performing badly in the sprite round. Look at Snake/Frog and Metal Gear/Fire Emblem.
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Organization XIII - Number III - Xordac
Owned by Z1mZum in the Best. Series. Ever. Guru Contest

ChichiriMuyo | Posted 8/3/2006 12:53:49 AM | message detail

"CJayC has no idea how to make a bracket."

QFT

>_>

<_<
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Z1mzum kicked my ass in the guru contest, so now I have to kiss his ass.
Detective in Sir Chris' Police

creativename | Posted 8/3/2006 12:53:57 AM | message detail

I meant Leon S. Kennedy.

Ah, silly me. I should've known.

Though actually I still wouldn't have known what you were referring to, and am still a bit confused.
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As the best poster in the stats topic, I move that we all stop acting like elitist know-it-alls about matches that aren't horribly obvious.

MasterOfHunters | Posted 8/3/2006 12:53:58 AM | message detail

I am assuming a 32 character bracket. 1st RD matches are really 2nd RD matches.

creativename | Posted 8/3/2006 12:55:13 AM | message detail

Bowser/Ganon could conceivably happen as a 4/5, and that would be 1st round in a split 32/32 bracket with 8 divisions.
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As the best poster in the stats topic, I move that we all stop acting like elitist know-it-alls about matches that aren't horribly obvious.

ChichiriMuyo | Posted 8/3/2006 12:55:32 AM | message detail

Ganon/Bowser shouldn't be a rd 2 match either. It's a rd 3 match, no exception short of stupidity.
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Z1mzum kicked my ass in the guru contest, so now I have to kiss his ass.
Detective in Sir Chris' Police

LeonhartForever | Posted 8/3/2006 12:55:34 AM | message detail

I am assuming a 32 character bracket. 1st RD matches are really 2nd RD matches.

Nevertheless, you just don't put Bowser and Ganondorf in the first round. It's anti-climactic.
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Squall, Tidus, The Prince of Persia, Nightmare, Sub-Zero, Captain Falcon, Raiden
Presea, Chun-Li, Tifa, Celes, Quistis, Amy Rose, Mei Ling

Karma Hunter | Posted 8/3/2006 12:55:55 AM | message detail

That makes a *little* more sense in a 32 character bracket, actually. But still...Leon S. Kennedy? Forgive me, but someone like that seems wasted against Snake (Snake on his worst day in his worst year with his worst sprite wouldn't make that match interesting in the slightest). Leon is so much more appealing in other setups.
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Do not kill. Do not rape. Do not steal. These are principles which every man of every faith can embrace. These are codes of behavior.

ChichiriMuyo | Posted 8/3/2006 12:57:16 AM | message detail

Yeah, but in a 32 character field Leon doens't really rate anything better than fodder. He just won't get enough noms to put him anywhere else.
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Z1mzum kicked my ass in the guru contest, so now I have to kiss his ass.
Detective in Sir Chris' Police

Mac Arrowny | Posted 8/3/2006 12:57:28 AM | message detail

I still don't get why Chichiri's confused about what Creative said. Sephiroth did better on Link in 2005 than in 2002. We know that 2005 Link is stronger than 2002 Link. This is clear evidence that 2005 Sephiroth is stronger than 2002 Sephiroth, and that somewhere between 2002 and 2005, Sephiroth boosted. This is all quite obvious from Creative's original post.
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Pity for the Gurus is treason to Z1mZum.

creativename | Posted 8/3/2006 12:59:36 AM | message detail

I appreciate it Mac, but it's fruitless to stir that up again :)

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As the best poster in the stats topic, I move that we all stop acting like elitist know-it-alls about matches that aren't horribly obvious.

MasterOfHunters | Posted 8/3/2006 12:59:45 AM | message detail

ChichiriMuyo | Posted 8/3/2006 12:59:51 AM | message detail

"I still don't get why Chichiri's confused about what Creative said."

I'm not confused in the least. he said it wrong, and the way he said it has only reinforced the idea in Lopen's head that Sephiroth's 2k3 value isn't legit.
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Z1mzum kicked my ass in the guru contest, so now I have to kiss his ass.
Detective in Sir Chris' Police

Mac Arrowny | Posted 8/3/2006 1:02:38 AM | message detail

On Leon Kennedy: he did outstandingly in 2k5, and I would imagine that RE4 for the PS2 gave him AT LEAST as big a boost as DMC3 gave Dante. And given that Leon 2k5 is already as strong as Dante 2k4, that would actually put Leon ahead of Dante, and in the top half of the males. That's hardly fodder.
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Pity for the Gurus is treason to Z1mZum.

MoogleKupo141 | Posted 8/3/2006 1:03:56 AM | message detail

If Clinkeroth and Mario are out of the bracket, Snake is probably the 4th strongest male character in the bracket. Leon should be right around 5th weakest... this is completely ignoring the female side of the bracket. I can't think of much weaker character to face snake, with Crono, Mega Man, and Sonic probably facing 2 or 3 pure fodders like Phoenix Wright.

Leon is 28th in the adjusted stats, with three females ahead of him, so he's 25th male.
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Please nominate K. K. Slider (Animal Crossing) (Male) and Kazooie (Banjo-Kazooie) (Female)

ChichiriMuyo | Posted 8/3/2006 1:04:13 AM | message detail

"On Leon Kennedy: he did outstandingly in 2k5,"

He did rather poorly in nominations, though. Even if we toss out Mario and the 4 females with higher seeds he just barely makes the contest this year, if at all, if we only have 32 males.
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Z1mzum kicked my ass in the guru contest, so now I have to kiss his ass.
Detective in Sir Chris' Police

Karma Hunter | Posted 8/3/2006 1:04:16 AM | message detail

Whoa, whoa, whoa, I'm all for Leon being strong, but let's not say Dante 2k5 and get carried away here. I just think he'd be much more interesting in a 2-7 setup, is all. There's bound to be at least one somewhat soft two seed.
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Do not kill. Do not rape. Do not steal. These are principles which every man of every faith can embrace. These are codes of behavior.

Lopen | Posted 8/3/2006 1:04:20 AM | message detail

It's okay. I'd have won if you did the work, too. I'd just have won MORE.

Oh it's on now... there are only about 40 repeats between 2k4 and 2k5... I'll show you!

Wait... I realize that 2k4 Link is supposedly adjusted to 53.34% on 2k3 Link... so if I were to compare straight 2k5 with 2k4 "Super Link", that would imply Link had actually dropped... maybe I should do this with 2k3->2k5 instead... but that's two years... egh...

and the way he said it has only reinforced the idea in Lopen's head that Sephiroth's 2k3 value isn't legit.

I never agreed with Creative's points, did I? I don't even remember what you two are arguing about, exactly.
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Z1mZum whooped me so bad in the Guru Contest that the next Lopen wannabe is gonna feel it.

ChichiriMuyo | Posted 8/3/2006 1:04:54 AM | message detail

"Leon is 28th in the adjusted stats, with three females ahead of him, so he's 25th male."

And out of 32 that's not far from "5th weakest", now is it?
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Z1mzum kicked my ass in the guru contest, so now I have to kiss his ass.
Detective in Sir Chris' Police

LeonhartForever | Posted 8/3/2006 1:05:04 AM | message detail

I don't even remember what you two are arguing about, exactly.

Semantics.
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Squall, Tidus, The Prince of Persia, Nightmare, Sub-Zero, Captain Falcon, Raiden
Presea, Chun-Li, Tifa, Celes, Quistis, Amy Rose, Mei Ling

MoogleKupo141 | Posted 8/3/2006 1:05:47 AM | message detail

And out of 32 that's not far from "5th weakest", now is it?

It's seventh weakest ;>_>
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http://www.gamefaqs.com/features/contest/contest_nominate.php
Please nominate K. K. Slider (Animal Crossing) (Male) and Kazooie (Banjo-Kazooie) (Female)

Mac Arrowny | Posted 8/3/2006 1:06:00 AM | message detail

Leon is 28th in the adjusted stats, with three females ahead of him, so he's 25th male.

Don't forget the Cloud, Link, and Sephy are also ahead of him. That puts him up to 22nd, and any boost can do nothing but help him. That's not even considering the probability that some of those who would be ahead of him won't get into the bracket thanks to nomination competition.
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Pity for the Gurus is treason to Z1mZum.

MoogleKupo141 | Posted 8/3/2006 1:06:40 AM | message detail

Err, eight weakest I mean.

He could conceivably be a 6 seed.
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http://www.gamefaqs.com/features/contest/contest_nominate.php
Please nominate K. K. Slider (Animal Crossing) (Male) and Kazooie (Banjo-Kazooie) (Female)

Lopen | Posted 8/3/2006 1:06:58 AM | message detail

On Leon Kennedy: he did outstandingly in 2k5, and I would imagine that RE4 for the PS2 gave him AT LEAST as big a boost as DMC3 gave Dante.

I have a hard time believing a port gives anyone as big a boost as DMC3 gave Dante. Most people on this site own both PS2 and GC, or neither, right?
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Z1mZum whooped me so bad in the Guru Contest that the next Lopen wannabe is gonna feel it.

MoogleKupo141 | Posted 8/3/2006 1:07:48 AM | message detail

Don't forget the Cloud, Link, and Sephy are also ahead of him. That puts him up to 22nd, and any boost can do nothing but help him. That's not even considering the probability that some of those who would be ahead of him won't get into the bracket thanks to nomination competition.

Good point. 11th weakest. That puts him at a 6 or 5 seed depending on how much of a boost you think PS2 RE4 did. He could actually be put into a good match.
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http://www.gamefaqs.com/features/contest/contest_nominate.php
Please nominate K. K. Slider (Animal Crossing) (Male) and Kazooie (Banjo-Kazooie) (Female)

Karma Hunter | Posted 8/3/2006 1:08:13 AM | message detail

I'm thinking Leon has a *very* big chance of being left out this year, though, for what it's worth. RE4 isn't as fresh in people's minds as it used to be (one might note the PS2 version, to which I say lol NintendoFAQs).
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Do not kill. Do not rape. Do not steal. These are principles which every man of every faith can embrace. These are codes of behavior.

Mac Arrowny | Posted 8/3/2006 1:08:47 AM | message detail

He did rather poorly in nominations, though. Even if we toss out Mario and the 4 females with higher seeds he just barely makes the contest this year, if at all, if we only have 32 males.

Heh, I think that PS2 RE will have enough of an effect to increase his nominations quite substantially.

Whoa, whoa, whoa, I'm all for Leon being strong, but let's not say Dante 2k5 and get carried away here. I just think he'd be much more interesting in a 2-7 setup, is all. There's bound to be at least one somewhat soft two seed.

Yeah, but...why wouldn't he be as strong as Dante 2k5? I can't think of any reasons for him not to be.

I have a hard time believing a port gives anyone as big a boost as DMC3 gave Dante. Most people on this site own both PS2 and GC, or neither, right?

When the port's a bigger game than the original, I can certainly see it making a difference. There are many people (myself included) who own both a PS2 and a GC, and waited for the PS2 version because it's superior. Not to mention the GC version going Player's Choice since then.
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Pity for the Gurus is treason to Z1mZum.

ChichiriMuyo | Posted 8/3/2006 1:09:14 AM | message detail

"I never agreed with Creative's points, did I?"

Nope. But that just shows what I'm saying isn't off base. what I'm trying to say is that cn's arguments were, to put it bluntly, not going to do a whit of good if he's giving you "outs". By not enforcing the ideal that Sephiroth's gain was in fact all in 2k3 you have the option of throwing out "year to year fluctions" or what have you. Of course, after readin what you responeded with I don't think you were at all tricked into believing that Seph's gain wasn't all 2k2 -> 2k3 but that you were saying it wasn't all KH, right?
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Z1mzum kicked my ass in the guru contest, so now I have to kiss his ass.
Detective in Sir Chris' Police

Lopen | Posted 8/3/2006 1:09:25 AM | message detail

Contest strength != nominations. I'm doubting Kennedy gets in this year... he only managed a 5 seed with the help of the nomination rally... and thinking about it only the 4 seeds and above are favorites to even get in without a big effort.
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Z1mZum whooped me so bad in the Guru Contest that the next Lopen wannabe is gonna feel it.

ChichiriMuyo | Posted 8/3/2006 1:09:39 AM | message detail

"It's seventh weakest ;>_>"

That's not far from 5th, is it? :P
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Z1mzum kicked my ass in the guru contest, so now I have to kiss his ass.
Detective in Sir Chris' Police

MoogleKupo141 | Posted 8/3/2006 1:09:43 AM | message detail

I'm thinking Leon has a *very* big chance of being left out this year, though, for what it's worth. RE4 isn't as fresh in people's minds as it used to be (one might note the PS2 version, to which I say lol NintendoFAQs).

He's got 20 board nominations on the tally... which puts him at 18 more nominations than Mike got.
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http://www.gamefaqs.com/features/contest/contest_nominate.php
Please nominate K. K. Slider (Animal Crossing) (Male) and Kazooie (Banjo-Kazooie) (Female)

Mac Arrowny | Posted 8/3/2006 1:09:48 AM | message detail

ChichiriMuyo | Posted 8/3/2006 1:10:52 AM | message detail

"He could conceivably be a 6 seed."

But not with the seeding he got last year.
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Z1mzum kicked my ass in the guru contest, so now I have to kiss his ass.
Detective in Sir Chris' Police

Lopen | Posted 8/3/2006 1:11:01 AM | message detail

don't think you were at all tricked into believing that Seph's gain wasn't all 2k2 -> 2k3 but that you were saying it wasn't all KH, right?

Right. All I've been saying is I don't buy Seph got 6% from KH... that's ridiculous.
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Z1mZum whooped me so bad in the Guru Contest that the next Lopen wannabe is gonna feel it.

MoogleKupo141 | Posted 8/3/2006 1:11:22 AM | message detail

I still think Leon gets in, although I suppose the RE fanbase may just focus their efforts on Jill...
---
http://www.gamefaqs.com/features/contest/contest_nominate.php
Please nominate K. K. Slider (Animal Crossing) (Male) and Kazooie (Banjo-Kazooie) (Female)

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