And everybody else in that division would like a word with you.
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Squall Leonhart's Road to the Summer Contest 2005 Championship
Round 2: (2) Squall 53310 (53.80%), (6) Knuckles 45780 (46.20%)

Except nobody really liked Kazuya in the first place. You can refuse to buy it all you want, but unless Sonic took a huge drop, Jin is MUCH stronger than Kazuya.

I know Jin is stronger, what I don't buy is him being THAT much stronger.

Btw, don't compare Ryu with Jin, as Ryu has always been the main char in the SF series, while Jin hasn't.

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Reserved for the winner of the SC2K5 Guru Challenge.

You don't have to buy it. The evidence clearly points in favor of it, whether you really like it or not.
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Squall Leonhart's Road to the Summer Contest 2005 Championship
Round 2: (2) Squall 53310 (53.80%), (6) Knuckles 45780 (46.20%)

Paul Phoenix >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Jin > Kazuya
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Vincent's Path to Victory: Round 1 - (4)Kerrigan Round 2 - (1)Dante Round 3 - ?????

Blue Streak... speeds by...

Sonic the Hedgehog!

Go Sonic!
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Vote for Yoshi
You have no chance to survive make your time.

And everybody else in that division would like a word with you.

Oh, did I forgot to mention that logic would like to have a word with you for calling SFF in Link vs. MM?

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Reserved for the winner of the SC2K5 Guru Challenge.

He has no problem with ignoring evidence.
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To settle my score with you, I came dancing all the way up from the fires of hell.

Why not Harrich?

I'm of the opinion a pay-service game like that isn't goin' to reach Starcraft-levels, considering how huge Starcraft and its fansites already are and having been out so much longer.


I find it hard to believe that Jin could be stronger than say, Terry.

Here comes a newflash: here's what Terry and Jin each got against Sonic...

Terry - 19.16%
Jin - 23.85%

...and it doesn't hurt Jin's case that Sonic-through-Diablo is making him look stronger this year than last year.


Yoshimitsu and Sub-Zero for 2k6!!

I second both of these notions.


And you really think Tekken 4 and 5 would increase the Tekken series' popularity as a whole?

I would, although I've only played Tekken 3 and Tekkan Tag. Jin's one of the few characters I remember by name though...also keep in mind Jin has essentially NO board nominations to get in whereas Terry did. It's unreasonable to think Terry > Jin, I promise, and I'd bet that it would look something like 62-38 if they were to face off.
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Hillary Clinton: We need to treat violent video games the way we treat tobacco or alcohol.
Lewis Black: Namely as valued contributors to our re-election fund.

Link SFFing Mega Man is illogical? They shared a system for about a decade, and it's illogical? Oh right, they're not from the same company, so there's absolutely no way the fanbase overlaps enough for it to matter, right? Link's and Mega Man's fanbases HAVE to be mutually exclusive.
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Squall Leonhart's Road to the Summer Contest 2005 Championship
Round 2: (2) Squall 53310 (53.80%), (6) Knuckles 45780 (46.20%)

Terry had board noms? News to me.

Moreso than Jin for sure, and I think HM tried to rally for Terry.
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Hillary Clinton: We need to treat violent video games the way we treat tobacco or alcohol.
Lewis Black: Namely as valued contributors to our re-election fund.

we should classify SFF cause it's getting really confusing now.
there's company SFF
there's series SFF
there's console SFF

what else is there?
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Kilroy:There fate will be in each other's hands as they decide whether to share or to shaft

He rallied for Terry in his match against Sonic, not so much to get him into the contest.
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Squall Leonhart's Road to the Summer Contest 2005 Championship
Round 2: (2) Squall 53310 (53.80%), (6) Knuckles 45780 (46.20%)

Jin came out of left field in this tournament. It was obviously linked to Tekken 5's recent release.

Especially without a company cap to help others get in, he still made it in this year. And coming off of Tekken 4, Tekken 5 is that much more amazing.
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To settle my score with you, I came dancing all the way up from the fires of hell.

Ah, my bad then. I'll assume I'm wrong about the board nominations then...the rest is still more than enough to confirm Jin > Terry by a good margin, at least 60-40.
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Hillary Clinton: We need to treat violent video games the way we treat tobacco or alcohol.
Lewis Black: Namely as valued contributors to our re-election fund.

Link SFFing Mega Man is illogical? They shared a system for about a decade, and it's illogical? Oh right, they're not from the same company, so there's absolutely no way the fanbase overlaps enough for it to matter, right? Link's and Mega Man's fanbases HAVE to be mutually exclusive.

No fanbase is mutually exclusive, even Link and Cloud shared a good deal of their fanbase.

But yet there's no SFF between those 2.

Shared fanbase is only half the story to SFF, the other half that you always ignore is similarity in appeal.

There's little reason for me to believe that Link and MM has similar appeal, let alone enough to create SFF.

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Reserved for the winner of the SC2K5 Guru Challenge.

"Kazuya was the "main char" of the Tekken series back then, Jin is his current replacement."

Actually, you're wrong. Proves you don't play Tekken. Jin replaced Kazuya in Tekken 3 which predates the 2k2 contest. If the whole board would hav ebeen archived I could find the Scorp vs. Kazuya topic where I mentioned that. Frankly, Kazuya should never have been in the contest over Jin.
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No balls to be bustin', no fightin', no cussin'... just a love for a drug called contest statin'.

You'd still pick Tifa over Sonic?

Yes. It wasn't like Tifa was relying on Sonic putting up a lackluster performance in order to keep her chances alive.

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http://img177.imageshack.us/img177/5980/12mw.gif
Both knowledgeable and experienced, he can get past any tight situation without so much as breaking a sweat.

There's little reason for me to believe that Link and MM has similar appeal, let alone enough to create SFF.

Meh, Link shares little appeal with Fox or Yoshi, but he crushed them mercilessly. The similarity? Their games were exclusive for a system!
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Squall Leonhart's Road to the Summer Contest 2005 Championship
Round 2: (2) Squall 53310 (53.80%), (6) Knuckles 45780 (46.20%)

these fighting game character's are so weak and get such low seeding they'll probably never face each other.so i see no point in debatting if scorpion>Jin>terry bogard>kazuya cause they'll basically never face each other
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Kilroy:There fate will be in each other's hands as they decide whether to share or to shaft

Actually, you're wrong. Proves you don't play Tekken. Jin replaced Kazuya in Tekken 3 which predates the 2k2 contest. If the whole board would hav ebeen archived I could find the Scorp vs. Kazuya topic where I mentioned that. Frankly, Kazuya should never have been in the contest over Jin.

Not so much, I'm not into fighting games anyway.

Kazuya seems to be the main char in 4, but I forgot about 3 already.

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Reserved for the winner of the SC2K5 Guru Challenge.

Kazuya was personal favorite just because his ending in Tekken 2 kills me.

As an avid Tekken player with all the forums and sites I browse about it, I've come to accept that I'm actually in a minority there. Most people even prefer Heihachi over Kazuya. BAH. Old guy in a diaper? I DISAGREE!
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To settle my score with you, I came dancing all the way up from the fires of hell.

Meh, Link shares little appeal with Fox or Yoshi, but he crushed them mercilessly. The similarity? Their games were exclusive for a system!

They shared SSB and SSBM, arguably the biggest games for all except Link.

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Reserved for the winner of the SC2K5 Guru Challenge.

How many people became fans of those characters through SSBM? Other than Ness, the Fire Emblem guys, Captain Falcon, and Game & Watch, I doubt that it's a large number.
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Squall Leonhart's Road to the Summer Contest 2005 Championship
Round 2: (2) Squall 53310 (53.80%), (6) Knuckles 45780 (46.20%)

by the way what is the strongest type of SFF?

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Kilroy:There fate will be in each other's hands as they decide whether to share or to shaft

Look, many people just think of Megaman as Nintendo, and some even believe he is Nintendo. A fanbase overlap is not illogical by any means.

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Magus screwed my bracket over. Yay!

Yes. Smash Bros. creates significant SFF for all participating Nintendo characters. You'd be fooling yourself if you think Ness would've beat Jak OR CJ on the strength of Earthbound alone.
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5/18/05
Never forget. Never forgive.

Well, 4 was after the 2k2 contest, and Kazuya merely made a return. The focus was still on Jin though, as a whole, the game had less of a feeling of even having a main character to me than 3 did. That aside, Jin was still the central focus.
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No balls to be bustin', no fightin', no cussin'... just a love for a drug called contest statin'.

Yes. I'm sure a significant amount of Yoshi's strength comes from SSB.

I find that highly improbable.
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To settle my score with you, I came dancing all the way up from the fires of hell.

But Yoshi IS actually Nintendo, which defeats your "same console" SFF argument.
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5/18/05
Never forget. Never forgive.

As an avid Tekken player with all the forums and sites I browse about it, I've come to accept that I'm actually in a minority there. Most people even prefer Heihachi over Kazuya. BAH. Old guy in a diaper? I DISAGREE!

I agreed that Kazuya is not nearly as prominent as he used to be now.

But I'm sure he's about as prominent as Jin is now back then in 2k2.

I guess the casuals made the difference for Jin, he's more casual bait than Kazuya.

---
Reserved for the winner of the SC2K5 Guru Challenge.

Well, I'm not talking about now. That was back in 90s as well. I was bigger into Tekken in the Tekken 2 days.
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To settle my score with you, I came dancing all the way up from the fires of hell.

as someone whose played tekken3 only once i always thought jin was the hero but i didn't like using him. i prefered dr dark in street fighter. i forgot which one it was but it had cracker jack
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Kilroy:There fate will be in each other's hands as they decide whether to share or to shaft

Street Fighter EX. Heh, that game was pretty cool. Skullomania for the win!
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Squall Leonhart's Road to the Summer Contest 2005 Championship
Round 2: (2) Squall 53310 (53.80%), (6) Knuckles 45780 (46.20%)

Look, many people just think of Megaman as Nintendo, and some even believe he is Nintendo. A fanbase overlap is not illogical by any means.

Let me repeat, fanbase overlap is only HALF of the story to SFF.

It opens the possibility of SFF, but other factors are also required before SFF exists.

---
Reserved for the winner of the SC2K5 Guru Challenge.

"But I'm sure he's about as prominent as Jin is now back then in 2k2."

Why, the last game he actually starred in hit the PS in 96. How on earth do you think he could even compare to Jin then? Really, besides being in TTT (which had no main character) he was pretty much forgotten about thank to Jin and the fact that Tekken 3 was a bigger game than 1 and 2 combined. Sorry, but a character that has been virtually retired for 6 years and has been replaced as the lead of his only game is not the strongest dude to rep that game.
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No balls to be bustin', no fightin', no cussin'... just a love for a drug called contest statin'.

I believe Crono suffered swordsmen SFF against Link myself. DID YOU SEE THAT PIC?
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To settle my score with you, I came dancing all the way up from the fires of hell.

wait, what? fanbase overlap is only half of same fanbase factor?
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http://picturesofwalls.com

so it's street fighter ex heh. my favourite character was garuda. impaling someone all the time=winner
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Kilroy:There fate will be in each other's hands as they decide whether to share or to shaft

fanbase overlap is only half of same fanbase factor?

Yeah, 'cuz then the over-lap has to significantly favor somebody.
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Hillary Clinton: We need to treat violent video games the way we treat tobacco or alcohol.
Lewis Black: Namely as valued contributors to our re-election fund.

that part is implied, since we've yet to definitely see a case where the weaker character is preferred over the stronger character.
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http://picturesofwalls.com

after street fighter what's the most popular fighting series
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Kilroy:There fate will be in each other's hands as they decide whether to share or to shaft

Look, many people just think of Megaman as Nintendo, and some even believe he is Nintendo. A fanbase overlap is not illogical by any means.

I have never seen anyone but people on this board even think of Mega Man as Nintendo.

hmm...
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Vincent's Path to Victory: Round 1 - (4)Kerrigan Round 2 - (1)Dante Round 3 - Squall

If Mega Man vs. Link is SFF... meh, we really shouldn't assume that until we have more data. Too much of a slippery slope.
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I can't think of anything to put here, but I can't just leave it blank, can I?

Probably Soul Calibur
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There is only one war of the brood!

This
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Putting any type of TOS violation in your profile will result in a suspension and possible banning of your account.

topic
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Putting any type of TOS violation in your profile will result in a suspension and possible banning of your account.

Jesus > Diablo.
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Hillary Clinton: We need to treat violent video games the way we treat tobacco or alcohol.
Lewis Black: Namely as valued contributors to our re-election fund.

e
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190/192 points in sc2004
tiebrakowned by nifboy