And you'd take Pac-Man over Vercetti?!?!?

That'd be a close match. I don't trust or care what the X-Stats say at this point. Really, I can't. I'd probably take Tommy V, just to get screwed over again.
---
Ability to preview contests to moderators before posting it.http://boards.gamefaqs.com/gfaqs/genmessage.php?board=7&topic=19643565(225 Signs!)

For me, it would be:

1) Crono
2) Samus
3) Mario
4) Mega Man
5) Sonic
6) Solid Snake
7) Tifa Lockheart
8) Ganondorf
9) Auron
10) Zero
11) Ryu
12) Bowser
13) Tidus
14) Zelda
15) Squall Leonhart
16) Dante
17) Vincent Valentine
18) Sora
19) Alucard
20) Knuckles the Echidna
21) Kirby
22) Yoshi
23) Luigi
24) Master Chief
25) Donkey Kong
26) Leon Kennedy
27) Frog
28) Tommy Vercetti
29) Ness
30) Diablo
31) Pac-Man
32) Lloyd Irving
---
Summer 2005 Contest - 28/31 points
Current Match Prediction: Revolver Ocelot vs. Pac-Man

Squall > Zelda AND Snake? o.O
---
"i started playing mario brothers as luigi and threw the controller down in disgust in the middle of the game because he lacked character"--gokujont

Yep, I think Squall is underrated.
---
Leon's Quest For Ultimate Glory:
1. Gordon Freeman; 2. Mega Man

Pac-man should win!
---
Final Fantasy was in 2D? I thought the number 7 was just a metaphor for something .... - Cbaker216

yikes, those are some bad lists. Vincent at 17? I hate the guy and even I wouldn't put him that low. Squall over Snake? ..yikes.
---
http://picturesofwalls.com

Looks like Advent Children is still going to be released on September 14th in the USA, despite earlier rumors that I saw in this topic.

http://www.gamespot.com/news/2005/08/19/news_6131564.html

Cool, that means Cloud > Link is once again a possibility.

---
Reserved for the winner of the SC2K5 Guru Challenge.

I still believe that Snake/Zelda won't be close and that Snake will banninate Zelda with over 55% of the vote.

You expect it to be 55%, as Zelda did almost better on a stronger Mega Man. And she INCREASED.

That match to me is no way any lock on either sides.
---
"I dont know what I am talking about? I know more about gaming than 90 percent of the users on the internet." -xmagxus

Oh please. The level of whining here is incredible. Let's look at how the stats have performed objectively, shall we?

Of the 32 matches so far:

- 21 have involved one or more new contenders and so can't be used, unless you're using "well, if x is as strong as y, and there's sff going on, and x has a good pic, and it's on a weekend and I had toast for breakfast" kind of reasoning.

- 7 are matches where the two characters have been in the same contest before, and the most recent unadjusted stats resulted in a prediction of a comfortable (55% or greater) victory for one character and were correct.

This leaves Vivi/Zelda, Magus/Knuckles, Luigi/KOS-MOS and Ocelot/Pac-Man. Of these, Vivi/Zelda was a clear "use your judgment" call anyway if you look across the years to see where they rank in relation to characters that would be in their "tier", Luigi/KOS-MOS was odd but you'd have to have been daft to not pick Luigi anyway, and that leaves today and Magus/Knuckles. Use the raw figures and Magus/Knuckles suddenly becomes a judgment call as well. Ocelot's close enough to Kefka in the Spring rankings that we can put him in the same tier as Pac-Man (using the closeness of the direct Kefka/Pac-Man match) and make that a judgment call as well.

So the point is? That people, myself included, didn't think enough about some matches that we should have done. That's not the stats fault. I've dropped five including today, two of the "odd four" from above (Knuckles, Pac-Man), two that the stats can't estimate (Ness, Vincent), and I dropped the ball with Vercetti by overestimating Kefka, which was the closest of the "seven matches" that the stats got right. That's bad judgment on my part, not the stats' fault.
---
Jon Thomson - MARIO, Samus, SOLID SNAKE, Bowser, CRONO, Squall, Sonic, MEGA MAN

If anything, Squall is over-rated in 2k4.

His performances against Kirby and Bomberman already proved it.

Now whether or not he can pick back up his lost strength this year is a whole different question.

---
Reserved for the winner of the SC2K5 Guru Challenge.

Transience's idea interests me, I will try it.

Mario
Crono
Samus
Tifa
Mega Man
Ganondorf
Bowser
Zelda
Vincent
Sonic
Zero
Solid Snake
Auron
Sora
Yoshi
Squall
Tidus
Alucard
Luigi
Knuckles
Ryu
Kirby
Master Chief
Dante
Frog
Donkey Kong
Diablo
Vercetti
Pac-Man
Leon
Lloyd
Ness


Man, that was hard. Also: Pity Ganondorf's stuck where he is. I think he'll make it close with Samus, but I don't see him winning. But he'd be an interesting variable in a lot of other places... say, going up against the two FF7 newbies.

But I wouldn't even classify Samus over Ganondorf as a lock anymore. We've seen too much strange stuff. Still, I'd never pick Ganon.
---
I can't think of anything to put here, but I can't just leave it blank, can I?

You forget, I believe Kirby and Bomberman are both caught behind SFF in 2003. I believe Kirby's performance this year will prove that.
---
Leon's Quest For Ultimate Glory:
1. Gordon Freeman; 2. Mega Man

Mario > Crono > Samus is something I can never see.
---
Knuckles the Echidna's road to the Sc2k5 Title!
Round 2: (2)Squall Leonhart

I think Ganon-Crono could be a fun match. given what I've seen with Magus and Frog this year, I think Crono could lose to a number of people, from Mega Man to Sonic to maybe even Tifa.
---
http://picturesofwalls.com

Well, that part of it's anybody's guess. Samus last year was strange, though... she suddenly advanced over everyone in her tier in the x-stats. Remember, that's where we used to have Mega Man, and that was only really true in 2k2, I think. So we'll see with her this year.
---
I can't think of anything to put here, but I can't just leave it blank, can I?

Who knows, maybe she was behind SFF? naah, impossible!
---
"I dont know what I am talking about? I know more about gaming than 90 percent of the users on the internet." -xmagxus

Dranze is right! Link clearly did not SFF Mario and Samus!
---
Knuckles the Echidna's road to the Sc2k5 Title!
Round 2: (2)Squall Leonhart

1-Samus
2-Crono (Mario)
3-Mario (Crono)
4-Tifa
5-Mega Man (Sonic)
6-Sonic (Mega Man)
7-Vincent
8-Ganon (Auron)
9-Auron (Ganon)
10-Zero (Zelda)
11-Zelda (Zero, Bowser)
12-Bowser (Zelda, Solid)
13-Solid (Bowser)
14-Ryu (Squall)
15-Squall (Ryu, Sora)
16-Sora (Squall, Kirby)
17-Kirby (Sora, Luigi)
18-Luigi (Kirby, Yoshi)
19-Yoshi (Luigi, Dante)
20-Dante (Yoshi, Alucard)
21-Alucard (Dante)
22-Diablo
23-Tidus (Knuckles)
24-Knuckles (Tidus, MC)
25-MC (Knuckles)
26-Frog (DK)
27-DK (Frog, Ness)
28-Ness (DK, Vercetti)
29-Vercetti (Ness)
30-Pac (Leon)
31-Leon (Pac)
32-Lloyd

Yes, I see some obviously-weird things like Luigi bein' above Yoshi, but, truth be known, that was hard as hell to list anyways; I wouldn't expect that to be 100% right.
---
Hillary Clinton: We need to treat violent video games the way we treat tobacco or alcohol.
Lewis Black: Namely as valued contributors to our re-election fund.

I think Ganon-Crono could be a fun match. given what I've seen with Magus and Frog this year, I think Crono could lose to a number of people, from Mega Man to Sonic to maybe even Tifa.

If Crono can beat Mario, I really don't see him losing to Ganondorf.
---
It's just not the same without this name.
Faithful supporter of Squall Leonhart in SC2K5

But after seeing Magus and Frog struggle...CAN Crono beat Mario?
---
Knuckles the Echidna's road to the Sc2k5 Title!
Round 2: (2)Squall Leonhart

I'm gonna bet that Vincent and Tifa > Ganon.

Magus was alot weaker than orginally thought. He beat Ganon. Yuna managed to get alot higher on Ganon than expected. That much of a rise from X-2? A game that is very hated in general?

The thing that sucks is if Ganon does beat Auron there will be SFF against Samus and we'll still be up in the air.

In the end after what Vincent did to Kerrigan and what Tifa did to Vyse I'm thinking they're gonna break alot of brackets, its apparent that anything FF7 is just a powerhouse.
---
http://users.ign.com/collection/Dark115.
Currently Playing: Halo 2 (Xbox), Final Fantasy VIII (PS1), Super Mario Bros 3 (GBA)

But after seeing Magus and Frog struggle...CAN Crono beat Mario?

Considering I doubt their struggles were the result of them dropping...Yes, he can.
---
It's just not the same without this name.
Faithful supporter of Squall Leonhart in SC2K5

Yes, yes, Link SFFed her. I know that. What confuses me is how subpar anyone else from the Metroid series does in contests and the performance of her games in the spring contest, among other things.

And while we're on the subject of SFF: Mega Man vs. Zero last year. Everything we've seen in other matches points to the fact that Zero should have gotten SFFed. Why didn't he? Or if he did, just how good is he?
---
I can't think of anything to put here, but I can't just leave it blank, can I?

I really don't see how Magus and Frog connect to Crono at all. We never had an actual exact reading on either of them. We KNOW Crono is strong.

And remember, Magus and Frog aren't weak. They're midcarders. No shame in that.
---
I can't think of anything to put here, but I can't just leave it blank, can I?

And while we're on the subject of SFF: Mega Man vs. Zero last year. Everything we've seen in other matches points to the fact that Zero should have gotten SFFed. Why didn't he? Or if he did, just how good is he?

Could be a case of the fsbled rSFF. After all, I would have a hard time putting Zero over Snake.
---
Speak of Galcian again in that tone and I shall cleave you in two
- Ramirez, Skies of Arcadia

From: Dark115 | Posted: 8/20/2005 12:28:18 AM | #071
its apparent that anything FF7 is just a powerhouse.

Nominate Random FF7 Furniture for SC2K6!!!

And yeah, I'd have posted my top 32, but quickpost gave me errors. Needless to say I've got Squall higher and Vincent lower than everyone else, and my champion not at the top due to lack of transitivity.
---
Jon Thomson - MARIO, Samus, SOLID SNAKE, Bowser, CRONO, Squall, Sonic, MEGA MAN

I suppose Zero just had his own fanbase, which leads me to think Protoman probably wasn't even SFF'd
---
"I dont know what I am talking about? I know more about gaming than 90 percent of the users on the internet." -xmagxus

We KNOW Crono is strong.

Yeah, Crono is a proven powerhouse, I have yet to find a reason to doubt his strength.

---
Reserved for the winner of the SC2K5 Guru Challenge.

I would have put it on Zero to be much stronger than he showed against Hayabusa, but then again Hayabusa finally had his ninja pic and showed up as a half-way decent draw. But do pics matter that much or don't they? Either way...all I can say is that we probably won't have a decent reading for Zero until he faces Mario (and there *really* shouldn't be a lick of SFF there).
---
"i started playing mario brothers as luigi and threw the controller down in disgust in the middle of the game because he lacked character"--gokujont

I suppose Zero just had his own fanbase

But we see SFF in matches between two characters from different FFs, or different Nintendo games, or hell, different RPGs. Why would Zero's fanbase be different from Mega Man's, when A: they're mostly in the same games, and B: MMZ is not too different in its formula than the MM games?
---
I can't think of anything to put here, but I can't just leave it blank, can I?

It's so awesome that Pac-Man is winning, even if it costs me my third point of the round. =p

---
To the man whose spirit was so free it was bothersome... Kurosaki Ichigo, my sword has been broken by your freedom of spirit.

I still think Protoman got a lil' bit of SFF (whether it be from Zero/Proto or Mega/Zero, that's up in the air)...not much, mind you, but enough to fight toe-to-toe with Duke Nukem.
---
Hillary Clinton: We need to treat violent video games the way we treat tobacco or alcohol.
Lewis Black: Namely as valued contributors to our re-election fund.

Because there was no MMX picture >_>
---
Knuckles the Echidna's road to the Sc2k5 Title!
Round 2: (2)Squall Leonhart

It's so awesome that Pac-Man is winning, even if it costs me my third point of the round. =p

*wonders, not for the first time, just how many matches me and HM have rooted for the same person in this contest*

*guesses around four*
---
I can't think of anything to put here, but I can't just leave it blank, can I?

And yeah, I would say that the two relationships that have me thinking if rSFF is viable are the Mega Man/Zero relationship and the Bowser/Yoshi/Luigi relationship. I mean, if Luigi didn't rise enough or KOS-MOS didn't fall enough...who knows.
---
"i started playing mario brothers as luigi and threw the controller down in disgust in the middle of the game because he lacked character"--gokujont

Zero just has a large and loyal fanbase of his own. I would imagine that the closer characters are in popularity, the less likely there is to be significant SFF (Aeris/Sora being the only exception I can find to this).
---
It's just not the same without this name.
Faithful supporter of Squall Leonhart in SC2K5

For Bowser/Yoshi/Luigi, my best guess is that they're simply very close together. Or it could be the fabled rSFF.

For Mega Man/Zero... Hell, I've got nothing. If Mega Man vs. Sonic ever happens, that could clear up a few things.
---
I can't think of anything to put here, but I can't just leave it blank, can I?

*Anticipating Zero's matchup against Mario to silence the Zero doubters*
---
MM are my INITIALS "There are only 10 kinds of people in this world, those that read binary and those that don't."

Either way...all I can say is that we probably won't have a decent reading for Zero until he faces Mario (and there *really* shouldn't be a lick of SFF there).

This is the board that though up Link/Megaman SFF. Don't be so sure.
---
Speak of Galcian again in that tone and I shall cleave you in two
- Ramirez, Skies of Arcadia

Pac-Man is costing me my third point too, but I'm happy he's winning it.

I'm looking forward to Sonic vs. Mega Man. It would suck so bad if the blue duo didn't get to go at it thanks to Ms. Lockheart....
---
Vote for Yoshi
You have no chance to survive make your time.

I think Ganon-Crono could be a fun match.

Regardless of what Magus and Frog have done, Crono shouldn't have any trouble beating Ganon. I don't really think that would be a very fun match at all, considering it would be over within the first few minutes.

---
To the man whose spirit was so free it was bothersome... Kurosaki Ichigo, my sword has been broken by your freedom of spirit.

I don't really think that would be a very fun match at all, considering it would be over within the first few minutes.

So was Kerrigan/Vincent, but you seemed to have fun with that.
---
Knuckles the Echidna's road to the Sc2k5 Title!
Round 2: (2)Squall Leonhart

So far, I haven't missed a match where I'm mad about it preference-wise yet. I like Ness and Pac, and Knuckles ****in' rules. =)
---
Hillary Clinton: We need to treat violent video games the way we treat tobacco or alcohol.
Lewis Black: Namely as valued contributors to our re-election fund.

I have a feeling we're not going to even be close to seeing a perfect this contest. As in, the top score may have missed 15 points or something. This contest is reminding me alot of 2k2 as far as predictability is concerned, and the highest score in that missed around 20 points I believe.

Yeah, I'm just trying to make my -5 bracket feel better, but I wouldn't be surprised, really.
---
Raiden fact of the post: Have I mentioned Raiden would do better than this against Pac-Man enough? I don't think so.

The highest score in 2K2 missed 14 points.
---
"All pretty girls are a trap, a pretty trap, and men expect them to be."
MasterMage119

heh, Harrich, you gave up hope in Tidus > Bowser already?

it's funny how people are saying Crono is independent of Magus/Frog while saying that anything in FF7 could beat half the bracket. Crono's strength is based on matches with Mario, since that's all we've ever seen. (sounds like Snake-Knuckles, no?) Crono got butchered by Link almost as bad as Magus did. his only impressive win outside of the whole Mario thing (which is sketchy as is) is Snake in 2k2. that's three years ago. Crono's not going to get a real test until the Vincent/Squall/Dante mess clears up, so we'll see when the time comes. I still think he'll make it through unscatched to the finals, but it's certainly possible Chrono Trigger is general has dropped in the last year.
---
http://picturesofwalls.com

This is an awesome upset. I don't mind losing a point for this at all.
---
"Thank you, Mario. But our princess is in another castle."
-Toad in Super Mario Bros.

Crono got butchered by Link almost as bad as Magus did.

Crono had to face a much stronger Link than Magus did. Also, Magus had his sprite in his match vs. Link, so (as Magus/Knuckles shows) Magus is overrated by the stats.
---
Summer 2005 Contest - 28/31 points
Current Match Prediction: Revolver Ocelot vs. Pac-Man

Crono's strength is based on matches with Mario, since that's all we've ever seen. (sounds like Snake-Knuckles, no?) Crono got butchered by Link almost as bad as Magus did.

He still did noticeably better than Magus against a beefed up Link and outperformed Mega Man.
---
It's just not the same without this name.
Faithful supporter of Squall Leonhart in SC2K5