Well at least Geno is more or less indisputably ahead of Cecil. Not that that's saying much mind you.
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Please sign this petition for a history board:
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Well, based on Squall and Dante's previous values, he's right around Terra, too.

Which is apparently taboo, but whatever.
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Squall Leonhart's Road to the Summer Contest 2005 Championship
Round 1: (7) Geno

And potentially higher than Terra. Whic I guess also doesn't say much.
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"Those whose memories fade seek to carve them in their hearts..."
"All dreams are but another reality. Never forget..."

Squall is slowly losing in percentage. My Oracle was pretty nice today, but I need this points badly! Squall, continue the killing! <__<

2 points behind of the perfects ain't bad, anyway.
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That's right. Cloud N. Candy would get a NEGATIVE percentage, and RPGuy's extrapolated calculator would crash. - therealmnm

His picture was more recognizable than Terra's. <_<

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Warden: Talk! What is SeeD all about!?
Squall: ...Flower.

I haven't followed the past couple topics at all (had internet connection trouble at home yesterday and today, and there's too much to catch up on). But I've skimmed a very small portion of the discussion, and it seems that some people are stating that maybe Magus' un-adjusted 2K4 value was accurate...?

That sounds real unbelievable to me. Would anyone here actually take Magus to have a 50/50 match with Vercetti or DK, or maybe lose to KOS-MOS? I can't imagine anyone would actually be willing to act on that. And the whole point of data analysis is to have something on which to act on.

I can't see too many people acting as if Magus or Knuckles really are at only about 24% (in terms of their brackets, or Oracle predictions). So that doesn't seem like a reasonable place to put them.
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www.SC2K5.com
www.sc2k5.com/gallery

I kinda pity Geno, he didn't do anything that makes him deserve a beating this bad, but I've expected an even worse beating than this.

Note that I'd take Kerrigan or Terra in a close match against Geno.

So Squall's performance today isn't up to my expectations.

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Reserved for the winner of the SC2K5 Guru Challenge.

Squall is slowly losing in percentage. My Oracle was pretty nice today, but I need this points badly! Squall, continue the killing! <__<

2 points behind of being perfect ain't bad, anyway.
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That's right. Cloud N. Candy would get a NEGATIVE percentage, and RPGuy's extrapolated calculator would crash. - therealmnm

"Yeah, I'd definitely take Squall over Vivi,"

Of course Squall would beat Vivi, considering how badly he is SFFing Geno >_>
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Now Link, fill up your hearts
So you can shoot your sword with power

But I've skimmed a very small portion of the discussion, and it seems that some people are stating that maybe Magus' un-adjusted 2K4 value was accurate...?

Yeah, but he was overrated from the start. Just because it turned out to be more accurate doesn't mean we should solely consult the unadjusted stats. People are getting out of hand with this. Magus was simply overrated, and Knuckles exposed him.
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Squall Leonhart's Road to the Summer Contest 2005 Championship
Round 1: (7) Geno

Both Magus and Knuckles are underrated by the unadjusted stats, and Magus is overrated by the adjusted stats. Simple as that.

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SC2k5: 21/23
Today: Squall vs. Geno

That sounds real unbelievable to me. Would anyone here actually take Magus to have a 50/50 match with Vercetti or DK, or maybe lose to KOS-MOS? I can't imagine anyone would actually be willing to act on that. And the whole point of data analysis is to have something on which to act on.

I can't see too many people acting as if Magus or Knuckles really are at only about 24% (in terms of their brackets, or Oracle predictions). So that doesn't seem like a reasonable place to put them.

Most people seem to be giving Squall the win for Knuckles vs Squall so I don't think many people would rank Magus and Squall much higher than 26%BL. But dropping Magus to 26%BL does help solve a few other anomalies in the stats.
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"Those whose memories fade seek to carve them in their hearts..."
"All dreams are but another reality. Never forget..."

That sounds real unbelievable to me. Would anyone here actually take Magus to have a 50/50 match with Vercetti or DK, or maybe lose to KOS-MOS? I can't imagine anyone would actually be willing to act on that. And the whole point of data analysis is to have something on which to act on.

Hey, after yesterday, I'd take KOS-MOS over Magus in a very close match.

And honestly, in what way is Knux's un-adjusted value in 2k4 not legitimate?

Knux -> SS -> MM -> Link is as clean as any extrapolation can be.

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Reserved for the winner of the SC2K5 Guru Challenge.

Yeah, but he was overrated from the start. Just because it turned out to be more accurate doesn't mean we should solely consult the unadjusted stats. People are getting out of hand with this. Magus was simply overrated, and Knuckles exposed him.

Yes, but people can't believe Knuckles purely unadjusted value was accurate either. Even if you don't buy the Magus~=Tidus~=Adjusted Knuckles logic, I can't see people actually thinking they are at the levels that the completely unadjusted stats have them at.

I'm sure if most of the people who are trying to argue that they should be that low, wouldn't act as if they were that low if they actually had something at stake.
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www.SC2K5.com
www.sc2k5.com/gallery

interesting note (maybe): when i voted today, i had just got done playing sm64 on my ds. Im almost positive i would have voted squall since i loved ff8 but i guess you could say i was in a mario kind of mood. When i saw geno, i thought of mario and....voted geno. Do you think other people are influenced by what ever game they happen to be enjoying at the time so much that they vote for a character from that universe or series despite the fact they may like another character more? something like that may in some small way account for un explained drops and raises.

note: this may just be my pain pills talking, so if this sounds dumb dont take it seriously.
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*pacing back in forth waiting for: advance wars ds, twilight princess, ffxii, kingdom hearts 2, castlevania dos*

How else do you explain Knuckles beating Magus? Having no SFF in Crono/Magus is completely ridiculous.

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SC2k5: 21/23
Today: Squall vs. Geno

How else do you explain Knuckles beating Magus? Having no SFF in Crono/Magus is completely ridiculous.

There IS some SFF in Crono vs. Magus, but not as much as we thought.

I'm very confident that Magus legitimately dropped between 2k4 and 2k5, by how much is anyone's guess.

I'd say Magus dropped between 3%-5% against Link 2k3 from 2k4.

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Reserved for the winner of the SC2K5 Guru Challenge.

Most people seem to be giving Squall the win for Knuckles vs Squall so I don't think many people would rank Magus and Squall much higher than 26%BL. But dropping Magus to 26%BL does help solve a few other anomalies in the stats.

Giving Magus 26%BL is fine...but why are you assuming that he's stayed exactly constant from 2k3 -> 2k5? No character has stayed constant over 2 years like that, even Ryu changed significantly between 2k3 and 2k4, and perhaps again between 2k4 and 2k5.

For (hopefully) the last time:

1. Magus is overrated in 2k3.
2. Magus dropped between 2k3 and 2k4.
3. Magus was SFF'd by Crono.
4. Magus dropped between 2k4 and 2k5.
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Pity for the guilty is treason to the innocent.

Of all the contestants who have been in every summer contest, only Link, Cloud, Sephiroth, Solid Snake, Ryu, and Gordon Freeman have held each of their opponents to under 60%. An elite list if I ever saw one.

He he he. To argue needlessly, you could say Knuckles has, too; he's held Solid under 60% before...not everytime, mind you, but he still held Solid below it. =P


Link had a horrid pic against Magus as did Snake against Frog.

I'll accept Solid, but, as a Link fan, old-school Link is still cool.


As I said, I wouldn't be surprised to see Kefka benefit from his normal FFVI sprite. I just couldn't see it happening based on his last boss sprite.

I agree, though I think Angel Kefka also helped out; it's just that his normal sprite should help even moreso. While we're on this though, this makes me even more confident that Mother Brain is over-rated in the stats; facing Cell-Lavos (I think it's called) had to have hurt Lavos, expecially when compared to how well original-Lavos did against Liquid.


If Wesker underperformed against Kefka, Luca Blight jumps up significantly.

Which could mean Magus could have SFF'd Luca significantly, something alot of us (including myself) has over-looked for the most part.


now, with his easiest run to the Sweet 16 he has ever had, Knuckles fans have greatly regained their faith in him and cam eout in full force.

Nearly two thirds of the bracket-makers had Knuckles losing in the first round, and NOBODY in the Gurus/BOP/Oracle gave Knuckles a chance...and that's just the faith-part; Magus was considered the heavy favorite amongst the BOP and Guru to win the division, and Squall's probably not all that far away from Solid nowadays, too. I rreeaallllyy doubt your logic's right on that.
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Hillary Clinton: We need to treat violent video games the way we treat tobacco or alcohol.
Lewis Black: Namely as valued contributors to our re-election fund.

For (hopefully) the last time:

1. Magus is overrated in 2k3.
2. Magus dropped between 2k3 and 2k4.
3. Magus was SFF'd by Crono.
4. Magus dropped between 2k4 and 2k5.

I'll give those statements my utmost backing.

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Reserved for the winner of the SC2K5 Guru Challenge.

"Hell, you want a bracket that is damned near impossible to predict perfectly?"

(3)Ganondorf
versus
(14)Magus

(6)Tidus
versus
(11)Knuckles

I took this from your 2003 Analysis, Ulti. Knuckles winning over Magus just made me wanna bring this up.

XD
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Summer Contest Score: 21/23
Today's Pick: Squall

Either way, something doesn't completely add up.

Tidus > Knuckles in the 2004 stats, and they were in the same division, so there shouldn't be anything tricky there.

So either...Tidus rose from 2003 to 2004 (meaning he actually did BETTER against Mega Man than he should have), Knuckles rose from 2004 to 2005, or Magus has dropped from 2003 to 2005.
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Squall Leonhart's Road to the Summer Contest 2005 Championship
Round 1: (7) Geno

The last two are very possible.

But 35% on Mega Man is BETTER than what Tidus was supposed to do? Wow...I find that hard to believe.
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Moltar's Comics - http://www.stripcreator.com/comics/Moltar
Squall vs. Geno - Bracket: Squall - Vote: Geno (20/23)

Magus has dropped from 2003 to 2005

That is what happened, IMO.

Or, to elaborate:

1. Magus is overrated in 2k3.
2. Magus dropped between 2k3 and 2k4.
3. Magus was SFF'd by Crono.
4. Magus dropped between 2k4 and 2k5.

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Reserved for the winner of the SC2K5 Guru Challenge.

Giving Magus 26%BL is fine...but why are you assuming that he's stayed exactly constant from 2k3 -> 2k5? No character has stayed constant over 2 years like that, even Ryu changed significantly between 2k3 and 2k4, and perhaps again between 2k4 and 2k5.

Magus obvious didn't stay perfectly constant, but it should still be pretty close. Assuming Magus was 26%BL in 2k3, Tidus and Sam Fisher still fall by a small bit. I wouldn't expect Magus to be outside the range of 24-28%BL during 2k3, 2k4 or 2k5.

So either...Tidus rose from 2003 to 2004 (meaning he actually did BETTER against Mega Man than he should have), Knuckles rose from 2004 to 2005, or Magus has dropped from 2003 to 2005.

X-2 perhaps? Maybe it got a few more people to play/re-play FFX.
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"Those whose memories fade seek to carve them in their hearts..."
"All dreams are but another reality. Never forget..."

X-2 perhaps? Maybe it got a few more people to play/re-play FFX.

Well, I was a proponent of this idea in 2004, but nobody else was. Perhaps Auron boosted from it, too, which is why Auron through Scorpion is stronger than Auron through Tails.
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Squall Leonhart's Road to the Summer Contest 2005 Championship
Round 1: (7) Geno

or Magus has dropped from 2003 to 2005.

Probably. From what I've heard, he had a huge backing in 2k3, whereas most people probably figured that he'd win anyway so they voted Knuckles.

Maybe the same happened when Magus went up against Link...
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The King of all Cosmos' route to summer victory:
Round 1: (0) Voters

No, I didn't mean IT dropped him by that much, but to say that Knuckles was boosted by the Collection while Mega Man dropped after his doesn't make any sense.

Well to be fair... Mega Man really only appears on Sony and Nintendo consoles, however, Mega Man Anniversary Collection did not come out for Xbox until the Spring of 2005, which means a newer audience may be able to get their hands on it, bringing him back up. Now Sonic games were mostly featured on Sega consoles, which was back in the day when it was good ol' Nintendo and Sega, which allows Sonic to tie in more with the Nintendo community than any other. I know that's a bit of a stretch, but I believe it. Now, the Sonic Mega Collection previous to this contest had only appeared on the Nintendo console, after the Summer Contest, it was released on the Xbox and PS2 consoles as well. Long story short, I'm expecting Knux increase and a MM increase.

---
Explicit Content.
Cheer Up Emo Kids.

I wonder how many people click View Results before voting.

I know I do.

I don't. I don't want the results influencing my vote. I just vote for my favorite (or bracket vote if I don't care about either).
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Squall Leonhart's Road to the Summer Contest 2005 Championship
Round 1: (7) Geno

I always vote first.

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Explicit Content.
Cheer Up Emo Kids.

I don't either. Not that the first 1-10 votes says very much about how the battle will turn out anyways. <_<
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"Those whose memories fade seek to carve them in their hearts..."
"All dreams are but another reality. Never forget..."

I don't either. Not that the first 1-10 votes says very much about how the battle will turn out anyways. <_<

**** you Tre. >_>

---
Explicit Content.
Cheer Up Emo Kids.

Heh heh heh.
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Squall Leonhart's Road to the Summer Contest 2005 Championship
Round 1: (7) Geno

Well, I'm off to go clubbing now; here's to hoping Sonic absolutely murders Jin.
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Hillary Clinton: We need to treat violent video games the way we treat tobacco or alcohol.
Lewis Black: Namely as valued contributors to our re-election fund.

Hopefully kittens.

---
Explicit Content.
Cheer Up Emo Kids.

I'm talkin' a beating so bad it actually pleases Lime Cat.

Seriously, gone now.
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Hillary Clinton: We need to treat violent video games the way we treat tobacco or alcohol.
Lewis Black: Namely as valued contributors to our re-election fund.

LIME CAT IS PLEASED!

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Explicit Content.
Cheer Up Emo Kids.

If Jin does better than Terry Bogard, heads will roll.
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Squall Leonhart's Road to the Summer Contest 2005 Championship
Round 1: (7) Geno

I think Jin will break 20% pretty easily with that picture Sonic's got.
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That... was her final mission. And like a true soldier, she saw it through the end.
ZSB [aX]

Geno>Squall

OMG last post?
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But beer, I only had six officers tonight...

omg 8 to go?

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Explicit Content.
Cheer Up Emo Kids.

I think Jin will break 20% pretty easily with that picture Sonic's got.

...So they're gonna vote for some guy they either don't know or don't care about because Sonic's picture is lower quality? Remember, this is Tekken we're talkin' about here. Jin will get crushed. He wouldn't come close to 20% one way or the other.
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Squall Leonhart's Road to the Summer Contest 2005 Championship
Round 1: (7) Geno

I'm giving 16.62% to Jin.


~RPGGamer~

15.23

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Explicit Content.
Cheer Up Emo Kids.

For the record, Sonic would be expected to get 81.10% on Kazuya. They shouldn't be far apart, though I wouldn't be surprised if Tekken has dropped even further since then.
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Squall Leonhart's Road to the Summer Contest 2005 Championship
Round 1: (7) Geno

Magus > Squall > Knuckles > Magus
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The King of all Cosmos' route to summer victory:
Round 1: (0) Voters

Squall Leonhart for the Devil Division championship!
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Squall Leonhart's Road to the Summer Contest 2005 Championship
Round 1: (7) Geno

Bowser > Snake
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For the sake of simplicity, I'm going to refer to Gordon Freeman versus Tanner as Schrodinger's Match. -Phoenix Flattener