I'm not responding to anything else charmander6000 has to say on the matter.... I think him being blinded by his opinion is apparent.

I'm saying all this and I don't even like Vincent. I hope Magus rips him a new one. But I'm not oblivious to what other people think about a character....
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Graduation: April 30, 2005 "There are only 10 kinds of people in this world, those that read binary and those that don't."

Tifa > Vincent >or= Aeris...and I suspect Tifa'll get about 48% on Sonic, so they should be pretty close together.
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Hillary Clinton: We need to treat violent video games the way we treat tobacco or alcohol.
Lewis Black: Namely as valued contributors to our re-election fund.

You were implying that Vincent isn't as popular because he supposedly needed a campaign to get into the contest, which is an absolute load of bull. That has absolutely NOTHING to do with contest strength.

It may not affect much, but it is a small indicator of strength.


Shows how little you know. Kerrigan got 3 times as many board noms as Vincent. He would have made it without any of those 24 noms, guatenteed.

What does this have to do with anything?


Uh, show me the "big Board 8 campaign" please.

Leonhart's campaign, urging everyone to nominate Kerrigan, Lloyd, Vincent, Tifa, and Ocelot. He got a lot of nominations from that.

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SC2k5: 18/19 (Curse you Ness!)
Today: Crono vs. Zidane

Kerrigan, Lloyd, Leon Kennedy, Tifa, and Ocelot

Fixed.
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Summer 2005 Contest - 17/19 points
Current Match Prediction: Crono vs. Zidane

Draco wins.
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Dp eats poop.

Leonhart didn't campaign for Vincent.
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Hillary Clinton: We need to treat violent video games the way we treat tobacco or alcohol.
Lewis Black: Namely as valued contributors to our re-election fund.

Charmander, your defense of Vincent's weakness is extremely flimsy. Comparing him to Freeman or Pac-Man is ridiculous, for one thing. They have little or no appeal as characters. They get more votes for representing their games than anything else.

Ok that was a little too extreme, but you understand me.

And banking on the idea that Vincent isn't popular because people either don't know or don't care enough to get him is ludicrous. There's simply no other way to say it. It's not that hard to get Vincent!

Could any regular player get him without using a guide?
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I've been Pwned by KoaC. He really is the king of all cosmos.

I still think Vincent will be stronger than Tifa and Aeris. He'll still job out to Crono, mind you, and he'd still lose to Sonic, but I really think he would beat Tifa if they ever fought. Aeris...well.....I'm not quite as sure...that match would probably be wierd as hell, so Aeris might be a little stronger than Vincent, its kinda hard to call.
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WWEGSB Hardcore Legend Masa
"Masa, everytime I talk to you, my urge for hot pockets rises. Damn you" - Linky.

Vincent was never one of the characters I campaigned for. Nominations and getting into contests have nothing to do with contest strength, unless you want to tell me you'd take Pac-Man over Tifa or Vincent, since he's been in all of the contests.
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Squall Leonhart's Road to the Summer Contest 2005 Championship
Round 1: (7) Geno

"What does this have to do with anything?"

You're a damn fool for thinking that Vincent had a big campaign going on here on B8. If any FF7 chara was being campaigned here it was Tifa who doubled up on Vincent. In short, you don't know what you're talking about.
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Have you ever seen a Turtle get down?

And I still cannot believe there are people harping on that ridiculous idea that Vincent is going to be hurt in large by being an optional character in the most popular game at GameFAQs. My God, he has had so much publicity recently to say that is simply being a moron.

Vincent is in the instruction manual to the game, Vincent is playing a prominent role in Advent Children, Vincent is the main character in his OWN game, Vincent is in the most popular game at GameFAQs (the contest is, GASP, taking place here), Vincent is in a game that has been out for eight years, Vincent is in a game that has been popular on the general Internet for a long time, Vincent has been shown to have been voted third in two FFVII character polls (one on the site and one off the site), Vincent has a "badass" look, Vincent can be found about halfway through Disc 1, Vincent is not hard to acquire.

Now, anyone who wants to do something stupid and say his optional status will hurt him enough to lose to Dante, I would gladly like you to stand up and keep the garbage coming out of your mouth. Because that's all your spewing.

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Mario's Path to Victory: Round 2 - (4) Ness
http://img129.imageshack.us/img129/135/cunningplan32kw.jpg

Well crap then. Magus, don't screw up.

---
SC2k5: 18/19 (Curse you Ness!)
Today: Crono vs. Zidane

Could any regular player get him without using a guide?

It's possible, but "any regular player" isn't opposed to using a guide.
---
Squall Leonhart's Road to the Summer Contest 2005 Championship
Round 1: (7) Geno

Leonhart's campaign, urging everyone to nominate Kerrigan, Lloyd, Vincent, Tifa, and Ocelot. He got a lot of nominations from that.

Brett, I would like to inform you that you need to replace "Vincent" with "Leon Kennedy."

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Mario's Path to Victory: Round 2 - (4) Ness
http://img129.imageshack.us/img129/135/cunningplan32kw.jpg

"Could any regular player get him without using a guide?"

I will sit here and say "yes" to that question all day long.
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Have you ever seen a Turtle get down?

Nominations and getting into contests have nothing to do with contest strength, unless you want to tell me you'd take Pac-Man over Tifa or Vincent, since he's been in all of the contests.

Notice I said a small indicator of strength. Jeez, you're overeacting.

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SC2k5: 18/19 (Curse you Ness!)
Today: Crono vs. Zidane

I just DMC3 will give Dante a big enough boost to take down Vincent.
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Summer 2005 Contest - 17/19 points
Current Match Prediction: Crono vs. Zidane

Could any regular player get him without using a guide?

Yes.
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Dp eats poop.

Yes, I realized that already. Now I'm scared of Vincent/Magus.

---
SC2k5: 18/19 (Curse you Ness!)
Today: Crono vs. Zidane

I'm not responding to anything else charmander6000 has to say on the matter.... I think him being blinded by his opinion is apparent.

We'll see in a few days.
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I've been Pwned by KoaC. He really is the king of all cosmos.

Notice I said a small indicator of strength. Jeez, you're overeacting.

The only problem is that it's not true. It has NO bearing on strength.
---
Squall Leonhart's Road to the Summer Contest 2005 Championship
Round 1: (7) Geno

Just because he's listed and people read about him doesn't mean people will vote for him. Look at Freeman or even Pac-Man.

That comparison holds absolutely no ground whatsover.

Majority of people that go to the FAQs are looking to get pass a tough spot and most people don't read the whole FAQ either.

So you're telling me if they are unable to figure out the safe combination, they are just going to ignore it and move along? Yes, right, that makes sense. Vincent isn't tucked away so far that you can skip right by him without even realizing it. Vincent is right there in the Shinra Mansion on the visit to Nibelheim. Anyone who bothers to actually venture around the Mansion will easily run into a safe. Now figuring out that combination can be tough if you don't read Hojo's notes. Which is why there's a FAQ.

Hell, this game didn't just come out either. If people hadn't heard of Vincent by now, they aren't the majority by any means. Most people would have heard or seen him at this point and could have checked a FAQ to figure out where you find him. These reasons for weakness are absolutely absurd.

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Mario's Path to Victory: Round 2 - (4) Ness
http://img129.imageshack.us/img129/135/cunningplan32kw.jpg

Especially since Pac Man seems to be here simply because he's "grandfathered" in.
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Have you ever seen a Turtle get down?

HM knows his ****, and basically is the reason I put Vincent > Magus. It just makes sense. Magus and Vincent are both pretty similiar. Sure you don't fight Vincent and he's never really an enemy, but there archetypes are similiar. Factor in some Square SFF, and the fact that FF7 stuff always beats CT stuff in these contests, and bam, Vincent over Magus is a pretty good pick. Not only that, but HM talks about Vincent's mom all the time <_<
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WWEGSB Hardcore Legend Masa
"Masa, everytime I talk to you, my urge for hot pockets rises. Damn you" - Linky.

Thanks HM... I got tired of playing as you. Nice to see the one and only come give the argument himself. ;)
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Graduation: April 30, 2005 "There are only 10 kinds of people in this world, those that read binary and those that don't."

Could any regular player get him without using a guide?

Yes, they could. Anyone can find Vincent without any trouble. But the very same players you're mentioning are bound to be using a FAQ in the first place.

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Mario's Path to Victory: Round 2 - (4) Ness
http://img129.imageshack.us/img129/135/cunningplan32kw.jpg

TAG
---
The line below is false.
The line above is true.

Zidane doing better here than I and others expected he would after the early vote. Consolation prize I guess.


From: ChichiriMuyo | Posted: 8/7/2005 4:31:55 PM | Message Detail | #118
I've been regretting not having Vincent over Magus for awhile now.

That's weird, because for the past week I've been regretting having Vincent over Magus >_>

Originally I thought Vincent>Magus was a good pick because of Vincent's upside.

However lately I've been thinking that there's a lot more room for Vincent to fit in between Dante and Magus, than above Magus...there's only so high he can go. Since it's tough to see him at Crono level, there's not much space for him to squeeze into and be above Magus, yet still be at a believable level.

I hope your latest feelings are correct.
---
www.SC2K5.com
www.sc2k5.com/gallery

Look, I'm not saying it has a big impact or really maters, big at least getting into the contest shows that you can compete in it to some extent. Unless you're Tanner.

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SC2k5: 18/19 (Curse you Ness!)
Today: Crono vs. Zidane

I'm not saying that Dante will beat Vincent 60/40 it will be a close match, but even being in the most popular game on this site he'll rank below Aeris and Tifa just because (I know people are going to hate me for this) he's optional. I'm also banking on a DMC3 boost.
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I've been Pwned by KoaC. He really is the king of all cosmos.

I already said I think Vincent's as stronger or stronger than Aeris, but I'm still skeptical on how he'll do on Dante and Magus (I have Magus over Vincent for my Division Final, mind you); I just see his ceiling and floor being higher and lower than most. His upcoming match against Kerrigan worries me none right now though, and will only worry me if he lets Kerrigan get within 45%...something I truly don't buy happening.
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Hillary Clinton: We need to treat violent video games the way we treat tobacco or alcohol.
Lewis Black: Namely as valued contributors to our re-election fund.

HM knows his ****

Hey, I know my **** too. ;_; But seriously, about a year ago, I couldn't fathom how Vincent could possibly be more popular than Aeris or Tifa. HM and ChichiriMuyo, and even Ulti gave me these arguments, and I figured out that my thoughts about Vincent were probably anecdotal. I started to look around and realized that the average FF7 fan LOVES Vincent....
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Graduation: April 30, 2005 "There are only 10 kinds of people in this world, those that read binary and those that don't."

"I hope your latest feelings are correct."

My feeling is that we may have vastly overrated Magus. That match with Link was good... but it doesn't fit in the big picture all that well, ya know? I'm thinking Magus vs. Dante wouldn't be as one sided as we expect, so I'm seeing less room than you.
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Have you ever seen a Turtle get down?

His upcoming match against Kerrigan worries me none right now though, and will only worry me if he lets Kerrigan get within 45%...something I truly don't buy happening.

because you don't see Kerrigan being stronger then Diablo, which I agree with.
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I've been Pwned by KoaC. He really is the king of all cosmos.

*Thumbs up to realmnm too*
---
WWEGSB Hardcore Legend Masa
"Masa, everytime I talk to you, my urge for hot pockets rises. Damn you" - Linky.

"I started to look around and realized that the average FF7 fan LOVES Vincent...."

The all-caps love there makes me think you've been reading some doujinshi...
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Have you ever seen a Turtle get down?

Kerrigan being even as STRONG as Diablo is just absurd. Seriously.
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WWEGSB Hardcore Legend Masa
"Masa, everytime I talk to you, my urge for hot pockets rises. Damn you" - Linky.

Out of curiosity, how much would 2k4 Ryu be projected to get on Villains Contest Sephiroth (the one you guys dropped)?
---
Summer 2005 Contest - 17/19 points
Current Match Prediction: Crono vs. Zidane

However lately I've been thinking that there's a lot more room for Vincent to fit in between Dante and Magus, than above Magus...there's only so high he can go. Since it's tough to see him at Crono level, there's not much space for him to squeeze into and be above Magus, yet still be at a believable level.

Heh, or maybe Magus could be... I don't know... somewhat OVERRATED? And there could be the slight chance that Vincent may have some SFF on his side ya know? FF7 IS the most popular game on this site. It might be possible for a lot of people to like the FF7 resident badass more than the CT resident badass.
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Graduation: April 30, 2005 "There are only 10 kinds of people in this world, those that read binary and those that don't."

I also have questions.

What would Aeris get on Vyse?
What would Yuna get on Ryu?

---
SC2k5: 18/19 (Curse you Ness!)
Today: Crono vs. Zidane

Vincent will have the majority of the SFF. End of story. However I have a feeling there will be mass stuffing in that match....
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WWEGSB Hardcore Legend Masa
"Masa, everytime I talk to you, my urge for hot pockets rises. Damn you" - Linky.

So you're telling me if they are unable to figure out the safe combination, they are just going to ignore it and move along? Yes, right, that makes sense. Vincent isn't tucked away so far that you can skip right by him without even realizing it. Vincent is right there in the Shinra Mansion on the visit to Nibelheim. Anyone who bothers to actually venture around the Mansion will easily run into a safe. Now figuring out that combination can be tough if you don't read Hojo's notes. Which is why there's a FAQ.

Hell, this game didn't just come out either. If people hadn't heard of Vincent by now, they aren't the majority by any means. Most people would have heard or seen him at this point and could have checked a FAQ to figure out where you find him. These reasons for weakness are absolutely absurd.

Meh I know tons of people that played this game and never even heard of Vincent, but since this is GameFAQs it's different. Yes FFVII won the best game ever contest, yes Cloud, Sephiroth and Aeris have performed well, but until I see Vincent's first match I'm going to stand by my point.
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I've been Pwned by KoaC. He really is the king of all cosmos.

A close match will always have a lot of stuffing, especially between high profile characters.
---
Squall Leonhart's Road to the Summer Contest 2005 Championship
Round 1: (7) Geno

A close match will have stuffing, period. Vercetti/Kefka is proof of that.

---
SC2k5: 18/19 (Curse you Ness!)
Today: Crono vs. Zidane

Meh I know tons of people that played this game and never even heard of Vincent

...Who do you hang around? I can't think of ANYBODY who hasn't at least heard of him, and most have gotten him in the game.
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Squall Leonhart's Road to the Summer Contest 2005 Championship
Round 1: (7) Geno

From: ChichiriMuyo | Posted: 8/7/2005 5:10:50 PM | Message Detail | #183
My feeling is that we may have vastly overrated Magus. That match with Link was good... but it doesn't fit in the big picture all that well, ya know? I'm thinking Magus vs. Dante wouldn't be as one sided as we expect, so I'm seeing less room than you.

I too wasn't entirely convinced at Magus' strength, which is why I placed Vincent>Magus. But while I think Magus may be similar to Frog in terms of anomalies, all that means is that his fanbase should be more stable. And he did beat Ganon; you can't take that away from him.

Vincent vs. Magus is a tough match to analyze. (assuming it will happen)

On a side note, I wonder if Samus vs. Frog will be similar to Link vs. Magus.
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www.SC2K5.com
www.sc2k5.com/gallery

...Who do you hang around? I can't think of ANYBODY who hasn't at least heard of him, and most have gotten him in the game.

Casual gamers, you know the kind that loves Halo and GTA.
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I've been Pwned by KoaC. He really is the king of all cosmos.

The optional thing for Vincent is a valid argument, really. He could've just gotten in by a group of hardcore fans, but when it comes time to vote he slips up (Vyse and Laharl anyone?).

I oubt it'll mean much, though.

---
SC2k5: 18/19 (Curse you Ness!)
Today: Crono vs. Zidane

because you don't see Kerrigan being stronger then Diablo, which I agree with.

Correct. Kerrigan may or may not be all that far off from Diablo, but I can't see Kerrigan BEATING Diablo.


HM knows his ****

HM definitely knows his stuff, but I stay alot more skeptical on him than most users when it involves characters I know he likes. No offense to the guy, of course; there's alot of times he's still right despite being biased. It's just that he's been on the other side of that field, too.



I just got to thinkin'; I don't even like Vincent all that much...but I like him better than any character he'll end up facing and will give him my vote. Meh.
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Hillary Clinton: We need to treat violent video games the way we treat tobacco or alcohol.
Lewis Black: Namely as valued contributors to our re-election fund.

Am I the only one who doesn't think of FFIX as getting entirely "New-School Square" support?
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http://www.cbs.com/primetime/bigbrother6/_polls/amc_poll.shtml
VOTE FOR KAYSAR!