Joking or not, I remember being dismissed for the same thing you just stated a LONG time ago (I like to think I was even the first to accuse the four-pack, though I don't remember well enough to say for sure): those SvsN matches make things look a lil' suspicious sometimes, and the chain we had could have affected something more than we first thought. I no longer put so much credit into that though, despite still thinkin' there's something wrong with how that four-pack turned out...

...I've heard people make theories about how Frog supposedly did so good against Solid Snake due to his fairy-tale run. To those who believe that, do you think Magus got that same benefit? Granted, none of his matches were that close, but Magus is arguably more popular than Frog and he was still greatly under-estimated from gettin' out of his four-pack to face Link...who was the returning champ. If people believe Frog gained steam on his way to Solid, then those same people should believe Magus gained steam against Link. Just a theory.


As for Shadow, yeah, he gets votes for looking like Sonic...even when he's not facing Mario. I don't think him facing Mario made even more people vote for him simply because he's "Sonic" in the match.
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Serious Reminder: Vote for Dr. Robotnik
"What awaits each person in Heaven is eternal peace, divine rest, and $10,000." --Cartman

I'll take S&K over any of them, including S&K2 or S&K3.
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Serious Reminder: Vote for Dr. Robotnik
"What awaits each person in Heaven is eternal peace, divine rest, and $10,000." --Cartman

Take it from me. Suggesting SFF between Mario and Sonic is ludicrous.

Simply put, no, it is not ludicrous. It may not be likely and one can easily disagree with it; but it is not ludicrous. One can definitely see how the demographic overlap could lead to non-linearity of performance.
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www.SC2K5.com

The thing is and I dont know if the stats were done like this on purpose or not, but with Gannondorf adjusted to be close to Magus it put Alucard almost exactly where he has a year before.

So was Magus adjusted based on Alucard or are we assuming Alucard dropped too?
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"You can't hide from the Grim Reaper. Especially when he's got a gun" - Manny Calavera

Emphasis on the "could".
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www.SC2K5.com

*drops in randomly, congratulaes CS/D on having 132 be done by the best alt ever*

*swears about MGS4 being on the likely gawdawfully expensive PS3*

*makes generic comment about Chichi Muyo being a god*

*leaves*
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"I don't care about your instrument! My god is communicating with me!"
- Ludwig van Beethoven

The Sonic/Mario agrument if correct, basically means a good portion of characters based on genre or generation COULD SFF each other. Im talking about significant SFF, every match has some SFF. Its just not noticeable.
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"You can't hide from the Grim Reaper. Especially when he's got a gun" - Manny Calavera

Kefka: 50.00%
Mithos: 36.02%
Wesker: 29.63%
Luca Blight: 23.86%

Thanks be to shadow8021 (see, there was a point Phediuk, he knew he was saving some one {Me} time by doing that part himself)

Luca (Adjusted Kefka): 10.12
Luca (Unadjusted Kefka): 9.11

Magus (Adjusted Kefka): 26.69
Magus (Unadjusted Kefka): 24.02

Ganon by way of Magus (Adjusted Kefka): 26.53
Ganon by way of Magus (Unadjusted Kefka): 23.88
Ganon by way of Alucard (Adjusted Sephiroth): 27.43

Specualtion? I can't form a coherent thought for at least 5 minutes.
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The greatest trick the devil ever pulled was convincing over half of the brackets that Ridley could win. - Harrich

No Harrich, I was joking abou the pic factor, not the SvN matches.
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The greatest trick the devil ever pulled was convincing over half of the brackets that Ridley could win. - Harrich

" it put Alucard almost exactly where he has a year before."

No, it did not, it put him up by over 2.5% if Seph was correct and over 4.5% if you adjust Sephiroth. It did in no way put Alucard anywhere close to what he should have been, even giving the biggest possible benefit of the doubt for variance.
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The greatest trick the devil ever pulled was convincing over half of the brackets that Ridley could win. - Harrich

every match has some SFF. Its just not noticeable.

We have no way of knowing in this case. This is why so many have speculated that the whole Spring Contest bracket was riddled with all sorts of SFF because of the generational divisions--demographic overlap is a big thing.

The fact that the 128 division seemed to be the strongest overall supports this; it would indicate that the fanbases for the older divisions are smaller, and more likely to be the same sorts of people ("old-schoolers" and such).

"Modern" gamers are more likely to be a wider slice of fanbases than supporters of 8 bit and 16 bit games.
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www.SC2K5.com

The fact that the 128 division seemed to be the strongest overall supports this; it would indicate that the fanbases for the older divisions are smaller, and more likely to be the same sorts of people ("old-schoolers" and such).

Which is why I'd take the upset pick of SSBM over SMB3; they aren't that far off, I'd expect SFF to be minimal, and SSBM is much newer. SMB3 would have to be the favorite, but, I'd take my chances there and not think any more than twice about it. =)
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Serious Reminder: Vote for Dr. Robotnik
"What awaits each person in Heaven is eternal peace, divine rest, and $10,000." --Cartman

The SFF corrected stats have Alucard at 27.74 in 2k4 and 27.56 in 2k3. Im I missing something here?
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"You can't hide from the Grim Reaper. Especially when he's got a gun" - Manny Calavera

I'm wondering, could Luca actually have gained by facing Magus instead of someone else? It seems like there is some possibiltiy that CT fans would jump ship if they liked SuiII to support Luca.

Going by Magus based on Ganon-Alucard-2k4Seph (27.6) Luca should only have recied 18.33% of the vote, not the 18.96% he got. Damn that huge over-performance by Luca for screwing it all up.

The real thing that bothers me though is this: That's against Adjusted Kefka. If we went by Unadjusted Kefka then Luca should have gotten 16.5% on Magus. Of course people are going to scream "Angel Kefka" and I can only half blame them since Kefka beat Wesker by more than he was expected to beat Luca by, but the fact that things only really line up when we se the adjusted Kefka stat bohters the hell out of me right now. Of course, we'll see soon. If Ganon gets doubled then I've been on the right track the whole time, if he takes over 38% there may be some crow to eat.
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The greatest trick the devil ever pulled was convincing over half of the brackets that Ridley could win. - Harrich

"Im I missing something here?"

Yep, the difference between 2k3 Link and 2k4 Link.
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The greatest trick the devil ever pulled was convincing over half of the brackets that Ridley could win. - Harrich

It's not impossible for Luca to have over-performed against Magus, I guess; I'm not sure if Laharl has ever lost to Magus on this board, after all, even though Magus is almost always much more supported.
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Serious Reminder: Vote for Dr. Robotnik
"What awaits each person in Heaven is eternal peace, divine rest, and $10,000." --Cartman

To note, I'm not saying our board is always something to go by.
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Serious Reminder: Vote for Dr. Robotnik
"What awaits each person in Heaven is eternal peace, divine rest, and $10,000." --Cartman

We are only talking about 1500 votes here, jsut to make the difference from what Luca did to what unadjusted Kefka says he should do. Of course, that's also supposing it's Luca's fault... no blame on Kefka or Wesker for being irregular.
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The greatest trick the devil ever pulled was convincing over half of the brackets that Ridley could win. - Harrich

Of course, that's also supposing it's Luca's fault... no blame on Kefka or Wesker for being irregular

Someone forgot their Metamucil in that 4 pack.
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O, flesh, flesh, how art thou fishified! ~Mercutio

I'm pretty firmly set on blaming this small prob on Kefka or Luca if it's anything more than normal variation, though with it being fodder/fodder, you could blame the Wesker/Luca match itself for having two mondo-sized contest-*****es in the same match.
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Serious Reminder: Vote for Dr. Robotnik
"What awaits each person in Heaven is eternal peace, divine rest, and $10,000." --Cartman

As a side-note, I think Ansem has had a small advantage with the day-vote here.
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Serious Reminder: Vote for Dr. Robotnik
"What awaits each person in Heaven is eternal peace, divine rest, and $10,000." --Cartman

Shouldn't be enough to matter. The match should close out pretty close to what it's like now.
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The greatest trick the devil ever pulled was convincing over half of the brackets that Ridley could win. - Harrich

Yep, Ganondorf was at 75.78% 1 hour and 45 minutes ago. Now it's 75.38% at the moment. Kingdom Hearts is stealing the after-school vote, as expected.
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Hi,I'm partystar. ^_^
Or maybe I'm Leonhart. That's for you to decide.

I dont see how Link getting stronger againist everyone specifically affects Alucard.
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"You can't hide from the Grim Reaper. Especially when he's got a gun" - Manny Calavera

...as expected? You're kidding, right?
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Spring Contest 2005 - Points: 24/28 - Matches: 19/22 - Rank: 00848/24748 - Today: Ganondorf - Tomorrow: Kuja

No, I'm not kidding. This was the time of day Ansem started destroying CATS. This was when Kingdom Hearts took over the match against Soul Calibur as well.
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Hi,I'm partystar. ^_^
Or maybe I'm Leonhart. That's for you to decide.

Wait nevermind, I went stupid. I got it.
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"You can't hide from the Grim Reaper. Especially when he's got a gun" - Manny Calavera

Oh, and this was the time of day Sora was around his peak against HK-47 and Hayabusa.
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Hi,I'm partystar. ^_^
Or maybe I'm Leonhart. That's for you to decide.

Yeah, but it's the Legend of Zelda we're talking about here. Not CATS or Soul Calibur or HK-47 or Hayabusa.
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Spring Contest 2005 - Points: 24/28 - Matches: 19/22 - Rank: 00848/24748 - Today: Ganondorf - Tomorrow: Kuja

And Chrono Trigger loses the day vote to just about everybody. What's your point? Just because you're strong doesn't mean you can't lose a portion of the vote to a weaker character. Besides, it's not like Kingdom Hearts is hated here.
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Hi,I'm partystar. ^_^
Or maybe I'm Leonhart. That's for you to decide.

With regard to Kefka, I prefer to think that he's enjoying large increases every year, and that adjusting him through Luca up to Dante-levels is the way to go. That doesn't screw up Magus at all, and it means that 20XX wasn't overrated. At least there's only a few more days until Ruin vs. Ganon, so we might be able to find out something then.

"and that adjusting him through Luca up to Dante-levels is the way to go"

I'm afraid we don't have a padded room available for you at the moment sir, but we'll be sure to set one up for you as quaickly as possible.
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The greatest trick the devil ever pulled was convincing over half of the brackets that Ridley could win. - Harrich

The problem is, Zelda is strong with the day vote, among the strongest there is, even. Not CT.
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Spring Contest 2005 - Points: 24/28 - Matches: 19/22 - Rank: 00848/24748 - Today: Ganondorf - Tomorrow: Kuja

Adjusting Kefka to DANTE LEVELS!?

*does a double take*

http://www.ytmnd.com/site_data//61000/61567/sound.wav
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Moltar's Comics - http://www.stripcreator.com/comics/Moltar (GAC)
Ganondorf vs. Ansem - Bracket: Ganon - Vote: Ganon (24/28)

Kefka suddenly being comparable to Dante would make his progression over the years absolutely insane, even compared to the likes of Samus and Crono. Three years from now he'll be the champ.
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Spring Contest 2005 - Points: 24/28 - Matches: 19/22 - Rank: 00848/24748 - Today: Ganondorf - Tomorrow: Kuja

And Kingdom Hearts has shown it's not too shabby with the day vote either. Even Sonic characters lose the day vote sometimes, too. Not all that surprising.
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Hi,I'm partystar. ^_^
Or maybe I'm Leonhart. That's for you to decide.

THAT'S IT! That's what I was looking for! Thanks Moltar!
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Spring Contest 2005 - Points: 24/28 - Matches: 19/22 - Rank: 00848/24748 - Today: Ganondorf - Tomorrow: Kuja

Uh, you're welcome.
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Moltar's Comics - http://www.stripcreator.com/comics/Moltar (GAC)
Ganondorf vs. Ansem - Bracket: Ganon - Vote: Ganon (24/28)

Three years from now he'll be the champ.

That's exactly what I'm saying. Kefka's just that good.

...as expected? You're kidding, right?

It was expected that Ansem would benefit from the after-school vote. I even said last night that he should normally be expected to benefit from the day vote, not Ganon--and certainly not a pig-Ganon. I think the pig pic might be costing Ganon a couple points.
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www.SC2K5.com

I have a question...
Without SFF, if Robotnik/MH get 40% on Ganon on the next round, where in the stats would they be placed?
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RPG/Square character /= instant win. Robotnik has proved such and owned my ass.

"I think the pig pic might be costing Ganon a couple points"

By a couple points you mean a couple votes, like 2-3, right? When you have a name as big as "Ganondorf" most of the peopel that are going to mindlessly throw votes at you don't need a pic to know who you are.
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The greatest trick the devil ever pulled was convincing over half of the brackets that Ridley could win. - Harrich

27.77% on 2003 Link, between Dante and Knuckles. No way Robotnik is that high.

Just for those curious, if Robotnik gets 34.35% on Ganondorf, he's equal to Tails.
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Hi,I'm partystar. ^_^
Or maybe I'm Leonhart. That's for you to decide.

You guys shouldn't think too much about CATS' performance boost in this contest. It's been known for awhile now that fodder strength can greatly fluctuate depending on the opponent.

Fodder always looks worse when it faces strong characters. You could go so far as to call it another type of SFF.
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"Thank you, Mario. But our princess is in another castle."
-Toad in Super Mario Bros.

and obviously Master Hand isn't that high too...well thanks.
Oh and another question, who would you pick in Tails Vs. Robotnik? just curious...
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RPG/Square character /= instant win. Robotnik has proved such and owned my ass.

I would take Tails. Seeing Sin rank in the upper half of the stats is too wrong for words.
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Hi,I'm partystar. ^_^
Or maybe I'm Leonhart. That's for you to decide.

By a couple points you mean a couple votes, like 2-3, right? When you have a name as big as "Ganondorf" most of the peopel that are going to mindlessly throw votes at you don't need a pic to know who you are.

Incidentally, Ganondorf's sprite is second only to his Wind Waker appearance.
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"I don't care about your instrument! My god is communicating with me!"
- Ludwig van Beethoven

Robotnik or MH, do you say?
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"I don't care about your instrument! My god is communicating with me!"
- Ludwig van Beethoven

Praying and hoping for Robotnik. Other than that, I'm not sure. All I can say for certain is...Unless Master Hand takes the lead from the start, we won't be able to say who'll win until at least halfway through the poll.
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Can't keep a good man down, baby!

I would take Tails over Robotnik.

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“But though we strike at you from the shadows, do not think that we lack the courage to stand in the light.”
- Zeratul