Amidst all this lag, I feel like sneaking this topic in.

***Stats websites***

Everything you could ever imagine:
http://www.sc2k4.com

Sortable Table for Every Contest Match:
http://sc2k4.com/displaytable.php

Explanation of Extrapolated Standings:
http://sc2k4.com/extrapolated.php

Summer 2002 Extrapolated Standings:
http://sc2k4.com/excel/sc2k2_extrapolated.htm

Summer 2003 Extrapolated Standings:
http://sc2k4.com/excel/sc2k3_extrapolated.htm

Character comparisons Between Summer 2002 and Summer 2003:
http://sc2k4.com/summer_comparisons.php

Spring 2004 Extrapolated Standings:
http://sc2k4.com/excel/spc2k4_extrapolated.htm

SFF Adjusted Spring 2004 Extrapolated Standings:
http://sc2k4.com/excel/spc2k4_extrapolated_sff.htm

Summer 2002 Contest:
http://solarshadow2002.tripod.com

Summer 2003 Contest:
http://solarshadow-stats.tripod.com/2003/index.html

Spring 2004 Contest: (not currently updating)
http://solarshadow-stats.tripod.com/sp2004/index.html

***Stats topics***

Summer 2002 Contest:
http://solarshadow2002.tripod.com/page1.html

Summer 2003 Contest:
http://solarshadow-stats.tripod.com/archive/topic1p1.html
http://www.angelfire.com/games5/sum_contest/Page1.htm (See note)

2003-2004 Off-Season:
http://membres.lycos.fr/shindohikaru/stats1.htm (See note)
Note: Don't use the links in the topic to browse through the pages, change the page number in the URL.

Spring 2004 Pre-Season:
http://sc2k4.com/archive/04SpringPreSeason1.htm
http://sc2k4.com/archive/04SpringPreSeason2.htm
http://sc2k4.com/archive/04SpringPreSeason3.htm

Spring 2004 Contest:
http://sc2k4.com/archive/04SpringStats1.htm
http://sc2k4.com/archive/04SpringStats2.htm
http://sc2k4.com/archive/04SpringStats3.htm
http://sc2k4.com/archive/04SpringStats4.htm
http://sc2k4.com/archive/04SpringStats5.htm
http://sc2k4.com/archive/04SpringStats6.htm
http://sc2k4.com/archive/04SpringStats7.htm
http://sc2k4.com/archive/04SpringStats8.htm

Creativename's Links Page:
http://sc2k4.com/links.php

***Miscellaneous***

MMXcalibur's Prophet Sites:
http://prophetchallenge.hyperboards2.com/index.cgi
http://www.freewebs.com/mmxcalibur/

Poll Vote Total Updator:
http://sc2k4.com/update.php (add "?pollid=[4-digit poll number]" at the end of url to look at charts from past polls)

Summer 2002 Match Pictures:
http://sc2k4.com/frog/view.php?gid=15
http://sc2k4.com/frog/view.php?gid=15&page=1
http://sc2k4.com/frog/view.php?gid=15&page=2

Summer 2003 Match Pictures:
www.angelfire.com/games5/heroicmario0/contestpictures.htm

Spring 2004 Match Pictures:
http://sc2k4.com/frog/view.php?gid=17
http://sc2k4.com/frog/view.php?gid=17&page=1
http://sc2k4.com/frog/view.php?gid=17&page=2
http://sc2k4.com/frog/view.php?gid=17&page=3

Summer 2004 Match Pictures:
http://sc2k4.com/frog/view.php?gid=18
http://sc2k4.com/frog/view.php?gid=18&page=1
http://sc2k4.com/frog/view.php?gid=18&page=2

!yawA tsoP
---
Winner of the Spring 2004 'Best. Game. Ever.' Contest
++SCC GOD++ *Married to smitelf on 5/21/04*

The servers having some trouble I see.
---
/The Hunter - Log 10.023.7/
A considerable bounty will go to the unit who delivers Aran to Command. Dead or alive, it matters not.

*pokes servers with a stick*
---
"Fargus' pirate crew makes women smile and villains revile!" ~ Cap'n Fargus, Fire Emblem

tag
---
BtT: 3:48.52 | HRC: 51,246.1 ft OV aaaargh
I keep getting sig'd for the weirdest things lately - StW

I hope Mega keeps the lead for at least fifteen minutes, and get over 40% on crappy ol' Link.

Mega Man will be lucky to break 35%
---
Back then, Game Boy's screen was color, too—as long as you didn't want more than one color. - Reggie

The vote totals are incredibly ****ty right now, even for this point in the match, because of the damned lag. =/

Also, average votes per match in this contest are now 82,819 through Cloud vs. Sephiroth.

The Spring ended with an average of 82,603 votes.

Well at least it has done better than the Spring...
---
M-me? Queen ***** of the Universe?
This is the happiest day of my life. ~ smitelf

I hope Mega keeps the lead for at least fifteen minutes, and get over 40% on crappy ol' Link.

Has Link ever lost the board vote before? I know Cloud routinely does (loses for the first 5 - 15 seconds at least, or more depending upon the opponent)
---
M-me? Queen ***** of the Universe?
This is the happiest day of my life. ~ smitelf

Urgh and Samus is such a Lame Character what DOES she do? And where's the personality!?
---
Ooooh! You make me so angry ya big silly.
Crush out the crime , we're the supreme law!

If CATS can't keep Link from getting the board vote, no one can.
---
BtT: 3:48.52 | HRC: 51,246.1 ft OV aaaargh
I keep getting sig'd for the weirdest things lately - StW

*tag*

49 more hours until the real showdown of fate...
---
SC2k4: 124/128 Rank: T-78

yay finally back into the top 50 ^_^

---
Lancelot BT, gawdess of the Legends and Official owner of the "Hi, my name is (user name) and I'm a (user level)." Topic ®™

Link 66.02%
Mega Man 33.98%

*cringes*
---
Current score 115/128 :( Next match: Link

^ Go you!

Go Link!

Go me!

Seriously if this doesn't show Link has gained in power and is finally able to be Cloud Strife's equal, I don't know what will.
---
Hylian Knight Forever
Score: 126/128 Rank: 8th

Up you go.
---
Reggie: Kicking ass and taking names since E3 2004.
*creator of Clinkeroth*

I'll throw it in here, just cauz I am curious.

Assume I want all of these equal:

Link - 68
Mega Man - 32

Mega Man - 40
Sephiroth - 60

Link - ?
Sephiroth - ?

Obviously Link has to win, and he obviously needs to win with less than 68%, but what is it? Sorry, I refuse to think on Fridays, or else I would do it myself.

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SC2k4: 124/128 Rank: T-69

i hope megaman gains a couple points before the end of this thing
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http://boards.gamefaqs.com/gfaqs/gentopic.php?board=402

This makes me want to root for Cloud. Yes, she who had the sig anyone but Cloud for Summer 2004. Since Link seems to get over 60 on everyone.... I really dont care about any of the characters Cloud beat, but Link vs Crono and now Mega Man makes me sick.

Go Cloud!

---
Winner of Leebo's save the users tournament.
Chrono Cross points: 160

Assume I want all of these equal:

Link - 68
Mega Man - 32

Mega Man - 40
Sephiroth - 60

Link - ?
Sephiroth - ?

I think I did the calculations wrong, but I got Link wins with 62.5%

---
Summer 2004 Contest 117/128 Link vs. Mega Man

How much would Link be expected to get on Tidus, considering today's results? o_O
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"Samba is the father of pleasure,
samba is the child of pain"

I think somebody in the last topic said Tidus would get 23.XX%. 0_o

I'm checking to see if I can make an interesting bracket with Cloud and Link in the same division.
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"Fargus' pirate crew makes women smile and villains revile!" ~ Cap'n Fargus, Fire Emblem

Well, I lied. I got bored and ran through it. Assuming last year's MM/Sephy and this year's MM/Link (Link with 68%) are completely indicative of their true strength, then Link would get 58.62% on Sephiroth. Cloud did not. So unless Sephiroth would have beaten Mega Man by more this year than last, there is SFF in Link/MM, or there was reverse SFF in Cloud/Link... I think we have a winner.
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SC2k4: 124/128 Rank: T-69

There's SFF here, but where are you getting reverse SFF from?
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Wednesday 9/29/04
Showdown of Fate

And I'm rooting for Link at this point. What Cloud did to Sephiroth is simply unforgivable! GO LINK!
---
Wednesday 9/29/04
Showdown of Fate

Cloud only got 56% on Sephiroth. Using my numbers, Link would be expected to get 58.6% on him. So unless Cloud suffered from a 2.5% reverse SFF, he would not have a true strength that is equal to that of Link's. And yes, I know there is a lot of flaws in this, and the word "true strength" cannot stem from extrapolating a match from last year with a match from this year, but this is all just for discussion purposes.
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SC2k4: 124/128 Rank: T-69

This is just ugly. Megaman is doing worse than what Sonic did on Cloud for gods sake.

I hope Samus won't do that bad against Cloud so she could take Sonic and Ryu with her (Always look at the bright side of life)
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Sora and Andel both defeated me in the Summer Contest.104/112

The topic to choose the 4 seeds in my board bracket project is up:

http://boards.gamefaqs.com/gfaqs/genmessage.php?board=8&topic=16627494

The board picked Solid Snake, Zero, Magus and Aeris for the #3 seeds, and an (assuming the bracket went with seeding) elite 8 line-up of Link-Sonic, Cloud-Mario, Sephiroth-Crono, Samus-Mega Man.
---
Jon Thomson - today: Samus, tomorrow: Link - 104/120
Nominate Ridley for Summer Contest 2005

Again, I wouldn't put too much stock into this. Samus's first two matches had her beating Cloud with over 60% as well. I know we've actually seen what Mega Man is made of, but he's performed too inconsistently for me to definitely say Link will beat Cloud.
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Tennessee Volunteers: #8, 3-0
Next game: #9 Auburn Tigers (3-0)

Well I'm almost thinking that MM has gone down in the past year...nothing really points to it...but i've seen him dissapoint 3 matches in a row now.
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SC2K4 score: Matches: 55/61. Points: 128/136 GO SEAHAWKS
Future predictions: Cloud, Cloud

This is SFF people. Mega Man has gone up, but as you can see, Link is a MASTER at taking SFF and using it to his advantage.
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Wednesday 9/29/04
Showdown of Fate

SFF on what? One is nintendo, one is capcom. One does platformers, the other does adventure. I don't see it.
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SC2K4 score: Matches: 55/61. Points: 128/136 GO SEAHAWKS
Future predictions: Cloud, Cloud

I really have no problem believing that Link might have gone up, but not to the point of beating his 2003 self with 60%, as these results would indicate.

Sephiroth supposedly overperformed against Link in 2002. After all, this site belongs to FFVII, so it sorta makes sense. I think that Cloud could still win even if Link should be legitimately stronger.
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Tennessee Volunteers: #8, 3-0
Next game: #9 Auburn Tigers (3-0)

Well HM sure got shown, there's no question about it and I won that bet as well. Choices...so many choices. What should I have you do hmm?

i called this match 70-30 for Link weeks ago and was called stupid. Looks like that wasn't so stupid after all.
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<reptile-> The first time hypr opened a box of Cheerios and looked inside he yelled, "OH WOW! DONUT SEEDS!"
<hypr> wtf are donut seeds

"omg they aren't from the same company!!!"

Big deal. Mega Man spent the first part of his career on Link's system. So if you had Mega Man games, you had Zelda games. I don't see why SFF here is so unbelievable.


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Wednesday 9/29/04
Showdown of Fate

SFF on what? One is nintendo, one is capcom. One does platformers, the other does adventure. I don't see it.

So you've never met people who like both Zelda and Mega Man? The fanbases obviously overlap because they're both extremely popular. Being from different companie doesn't make a difference.
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Tennessee Volunteers: #8, 3-0
Next game: #9 Auburn Tigers (3-0)

hmmm....makes sense....oh well so much for getting a good readout on link's and cloud's strength for the finals.

But somehow I doubt we'll see the same type of SFF tomorrow. ;)
---
SC2K4 score: Matches: 55/61. Points: 128/136 GO SEAHAWKS
Future predictions: Cloud, Cloud

i called this match 70-30 for Link weeks ago and was called stupid. Looks like that wasn't so stupid after all.

One, I haven't seen you around, ever. Two, I guarantee you didn't predict that because of SFF. The only person who called that before the match that I know of is Link2dapast.
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Wednesday 9/29/04
Showdown of Fate

Cloud will break 60% on Samus tomorrow as well. Wait and see.
---
Tennessee Volunteers: #8, 3-0
Next game: #9 Auburn Tigers (3-0)

But somehow I doubt we'll see the same type of SFF tomorrow. ;)

No, but we'll see the same type of destruction none-the-less.
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Wednesday 9/29/04
Showdown of Fate

So you've never met people who like both Zelda and Mega Man? The fanbases obviously overlap because they're both extremely popular

Are you out of your mind?

Obviously ALL the contestants in the contest are popular in some way. The only basis you have on SFF is that both fanbases are fans of video games.

(1) Link
(2) Cloud Strife

(1) Sephiroth
(2) Samus Aran

(1) Mario
(2) Sonic the Hedgehog
(3) Magus Zeal

(1) Mega Man
(2) Crono
(3) Solid Snake
(6) Zero

How does that look?
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"Fargus' pirate crew makes women smile and villains revile!" ~ Cap'n Fargus, Fire Emblem

I agree that SFF will be next to non-existent with Samus and Cloud. Different companies, different genres, different consoles. We should get a true reading as to his strength, while I think the 63% Link put up on Crono was indicative of his true strength. Well, at least more so than any of the other matches he has taken part in.
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SC2k4: 124/128 Rank: T-69

The only basis you have on SFF is that both fanbases are fans of video games.

Try they were both on the same system.
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Wednesday 9/29/04
Showdown of Fate

Are you out of your mind?

Obviously ALL the contestants in the contest are popular in some way. The only basis you have on SFF is that both fanbases are fans of video games.

Okay, so I take it that there are very few people who like both Zelda and Mega Man then. Yeah, it's impossible for two extremely popular characters on this site to have fanbase overlap. Everyone who votes for Link doesn't like Mega Man, and vice-verse. Yeah, makes perfect sense.
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Tennessee Volunteers: #8, 3-0
Next game: #9 Auburn Tigers (3-0)

Everyone here is too quick to jump to conclusions after certain matches. Trigger happys sons of *******. If Cloud beats Link, everyone will be left scratching their heads.

"Why? But MM got OWNED, why did he lose again?"

Because following the stats like the holy bible will only get you so far and come back to bite you in the ass.

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Human beings are like rabbits: they're totally clueless, wander around aimlessly and reproduce like mad.

Leonhart, most of these guys are as stubborn as they get. Convincing does no good because nothing will get drilled into their heads to make them accept other ideas.

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Human beings are like rabbits: they're totally clueless, wander around aimlessly and reproduce like mad.

Try they were both on the same system.

I'm assuming you're joking. But just in case you aren't.

Sonic and Samus have been on the same systems!

Mario and Crono have been on the same systems!

Snake and Mega Man have been on the same systems!

Are we simply going to assume SFF everytime a character we like is blown away, based on the fact that they happened to both have games on the same console?

So Fourthdeus, I take it that you find it impossible for the majority of the voters to like both characters, and that one of the strongest characters on the site wouldn't benefit from that?
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Tennessee Volunteers: #8, 3-0
Next game: #9 Auburn Tigers (3-0)

There is a difference between being on the same system, and growing up on the same system. MegaMan threw up his first what... 6 games on the NES? Link's mantra was born on the NES. That is far different than the occasionally console-overlapping. Those titles were exclusive to the NES, and then the SNES. Like I mentioned before, when you take into consideration the late teen-early drinker demographic, this SFF definitely applies.
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SC2k4: 124/128 Rank: T-69

"Sonic and Samus have been on the same systems!

Mario and Crono have been on the same systems!

Snake and Mega Man have been on the same systems!

Are we simply going to assume SFF everytime a character we like is blown away, based on the fact that they happened to both have games on the same console?"

Sonic debuted and starred in his own systems for the longest time before making a switch. He had already established a seperate fanbase. Don't make stupid points.

Mario and Crono were on one system only because Crono only had one game and this point is once again irrelevant because no character knocked the other into the ground like in this match.

MM doesn't have a very big thing going on the playstation. His claim to fame is from Nintendo. End story. No more dumb points that are illogical.

MM, if he wasn't simply said to be from CAPCOM, is Nintendo as you can get, regardless of him appearing on some other systems from different companies. He is Nintendo and came to be known through Nintendo. Stop denying it.
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Human beings are like rabbits: they're totally clueless, wander around aimlessly and reproduce like mad.

Okay, so I take it that there are very few people who like both Zelda and Mega Man then.

Oh please. Your point is ridiculous and you know it.

Based on your "expert" analysis, I could easily say the only reason Sonic lost to Samus was because of SFF. I mean, Sonic games are popular, Metroid games are popular. Is it impossible to believe that Metroid fans can be Sonic fans as well? Obviously SFF there.

Link blew CATS away. I'm sure there are CATS fans who love the Zelda series, and vice versa. Obviously the only reason CATS lost was because of SFF.

Tanner was cheated SFF as well evidently. I mean, I love the Metal Gear series, and was a huge fan of the first Driver games as well, so I'm a perfect example. Tanner obviously is a powerhouse when SFF isn't in the way.

One, I haven't seen you around, ever. Two, I guarantee you didn't predict that because of SFF. The only person who called that before the match that I know of is Link2dapast.

Sorry, I only sporadically post in this topic series. But I honestly said 70-30 for Link and if you can't take me at my word, well then, no amount of arguing will change that.
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<reptile-> The first time hypr opened a box of Cheerios and looked inside he yelled, "OH WOW! DONUT SEEDS!"
<hypr> wtf are donut seeds

Has Link ever lost a match with his picture being adult Link?

Didn't think so. Cloud is going down.
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Currently Supporting: Link and Samus.
"I do read sometimes." Mat Cauthon, The Wheel of Time.

Yes, but Link originated on the NES, and that is the same system Mega Man both originated on, and spent many years on. This would lead to a higher chance of SFF than any of the other combinations you listed.
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Wednesday 9/29/04
Showdown of Fate

I have to say, after overperforming in every single one of his matches, Link is certainly looking like the favorite.
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"Fargus' pirate crew makes women smile and villains revile!" ~ Cap'n Fargus, Fire Emblem

And what happens if Cloud beats Link again? Did you eat your words? Yes. Did it make you sound like a close minded idiot who just jumps to conclusions in the process? Yes.

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Human beings are like rabbits: they're totally clueless, wander around aimlessly and reproduce like mad.

Oh please. Your point is ridiculous and you know it.

Then explain this to us out of your own wisdom because SURELY you have an explanation for this since you're treating the rest of us like we're idiots.

Explain how Link's performance against Crono puts him at 55% against his 2003 self, and then he suddenly shoots up to 60% on his 2003 self against Mega Man. Why don't you try telling us what happened instead of acting like we're morons for trying to explain what happened?
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Tennessee Volunteers: #8, 3-0
Next game: #9 Auburn Tigers (3-0)

MM doesn't have a very big thing going on the playstation. His claim to fame is from Nintendo. End story. No more dumb points that are illogical.

Oh PLEASE! The bulk of the Mega Man fanbase was grown from the PSX MMX titles. Hell, its been the PlayStation games that have SUSTAINED the Mega Man series. Don't give some bull that Mega Man is Nintendo.

And all the points you made on other characters are null and void. The fact remains that the point of SFF was made on the basis that Link and Mega Man were once on the same damn console, even though they are completley separate genres, and one is obviously FAR more popular than the other.

Oh PLEASE! The bulk of the Mega Man fanbase was grown from the PSX MMX titles.

And you know this...how? Obviously you've got some database full of knowledge that we're unaware of, so share with us.
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Tennessee Volunteers: #8, 3-0
Next game: #9 Auburn Tigers (3-0)

PSX MMX??? AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAH!!! You have just invalidated everything, what with you taking 1/2 of the series (the first half, mind you), and throwing it out the window. Perhaps you should just follow your theory...
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SC2k4: 124/128 Rank: T-69

that's it Leonhart, you tell it to him like it is. Add some insults along the way too trust me. They make you feel better and are condescending towards the target.

Ahh... nothing beats that. We need more people who accept all possible outcomes like us and not be so quick to believe one point and shut other possibilities out in the process.

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Human beings are like rabbits: they're totally clueless, wander around aimlessly and reproduce like mad.

Sorry, I only sporadically post in this topic series. But I honestly said 70-30 for Link and if you can't take me at my word, well then, no amount of arguing will change that.

Sorry for sounding rude, I don't doubt that you called 70-30 for Link, and for that I applaud you. What I'm saying is I doubt SFF was your reasoning behind this demolishing.
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Wednesday 9/29/04
Showdown of Fate

Explain how Link's performance against Crono puts him at 55% against his 2003 self, and then he suddenly shoots up to 60% on his 2003 self against Mega Man. Why don't you try telling us what happened instead of acting like we're morons for trying to explain what happened?

Its fairly obvious.

All of these goddamn extrapolated polls have failed you people AGAIN. This is what happens when you try to create set statistics and figures on something as subjective as human opinion. These are the obvious facts. Link and Mega Man have never faced off before. But based figures compiled by people such as yourself, it was determined that based on people preferences in comparing Sephiroth and Mega Man, OBVIOUSLY Mega Man wouldn't get completely dominated by Link.

You were all wrong. Dead wrong.

People on this website favor Sephiroth over Mega Man. They OVERWHELMINGLY prefer Link over Mega Man.

Its that simple.

fourthdeus, you're digging yourself into a deeper hole everytime you post. You're sounding more like an idiot in the process as well. Get out while you still can because you won't this argument. You have ZERO logical points.

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Human beings are like rabbits: they're totally clueless, wander around aimlessly and reproduce like mad.

It would take someone either extremely genius or extremely insane to think Link could slap up 70% after watching this contest unfold.

And as we all know, those two traits are rarely mutually exclusive.
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SC2k4: 124/128 Rank: T-69

I must say, I find it funny that both ForthDeus and cronton think the XS are BS, and yet are managing to be on opposite sides.
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"Fargus' pirate crew makes women smile and villains revile!" ~ Cap'n Fargus, Fire Emblem

They OVERWHELMINGLY prefer Link over Mega Man.

Take a guess at what you call that?


S
F
F
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Wednesday 9/29/04
Showdown of Fate

I have zero logical points?

How so?

I have the greatest point there is, the results. YOU all are the one playing with theories to try to justify Mega Man's poor performance, when the answer is a simple, "People here like Link a lot more than Mega Man."

People on this website favor Sephiroth over Mega Man. They OVERWHELMINGLY prefer Link over Mega Man.

Its that simple.

Yeah, that much is obvious. What should also be obvious is that people don't exclusively play Mega Man, Zelda, or FFVII and shut the other two out.

This is what happens when you try to create set statistics and figures on something as subjective as human opinion.

And why does it vary from poll to poll? Oh, could it be because the voters like both characters involved and just have to decide for one over the other?
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Tennessee Volunteers: #8, 3-0
Next game: #9 Auburn Tigers (3-0)

Regardless of what you care to say about the XS, the fact of the matter is in two different matches Link has found a way to go from 55% on himself to 60% from himself (a far cry from the 50% he threw up on Link in 2003). Your arguments are so off-base I am unsure of whether you could even fall out of a boat and get me to believe you hit water.
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SC2k4: 124/128 Rank: T-69

Take a guess at what you call that?


S
F
F

And Tails vs. Dante is SFF as well. I mean, they both had games on the PS2, and hey, they're MALE! Obviously SFF there.

There is nothing to justify n00b. MM is weak just like I called at the beginning of the contest as can be witnessed by the beating Sephiroth gave him last year. I'm not delusional like certain people believing he even has a shot at winning. But to deny there can be no SFF is absurdity because Link and MM have both come to be known on all the same systems pretty much. Like I said, if it wasn't heralded that MegaMan was from Capcom, he's as Nintendo as you can get.

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Human beings are like rabbits: they're totally clueless, wander around aimlessly and reproduce like mad.

And Tails vs. Dante is SFF as well. I mean, they both had games on the PS2, and hey, they're MALE! Obviously SFF there.

Yes, because characters absolutely MUST be alike for SFF to be involved.

The Spring Contest should be enough to tell you that SFF can exist across platforms. Super Mario World-Sonic 2, anyone?
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Tennessee Volunteers: #8, 3-0
Next game: #9 Auburn Tigers (3-0)

And Tails vs. Dante is SFF as well. I mean, they both had games on the PS2, and hey, they're MALE! Obviously SFF there.

Allright then, since I'm so delusional and you are so utterly brilliant, explain to me why Link is looking like such a powerhouse here. and don't say "People here like Link a lot more than Mega Man" because that can be used in ANY instance. You simply are looking at my point and missing it completely.
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It's.... over.

Those are both extremely popular platformers, of the same generation.

Zelda and Mega Man aren't even the same genre.

On another note, the Samus fans believing she has even somewhat a shot at beating Cloud are just as bad if not worse than the MM fans. I seriously can't wait until she loses tomorrow so all the Samus rants stop.

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Human beings are like rabbits: they're totally clueless, wander around aimlessly and reproduce like mad.

Do video gamers play games of different genres or not? Answer me that.
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Tennessee Volunteers: #8, 3-0
Next game: #9 Auburn Tigers (3-0)

You simply are looking at my point and missing it completely.

No. I see your point. Its just garbage.

Link is popular because the Zelda series is popular here. In the same way that Crono is popular because he represents Chrono Trigger.

Come on people, common sense.

Has Link ever lost a match with his picture being adult Link?

Didn't think so. Cloud is going down.

By your logic, has Link ever beaten Cloud?

Didn't think so. Link is going down.
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Current SC2K4 Score: 125/128
COWS are for Milking, not GAMES

Link is popular because the Zelda series is popular here. In the same way that Crono is popular because he represents Chrono Trigger.

Come on people, common sense.

Yes, and none of these are people who like Mega Man, but would switch their votes to Link or Crono should the opportunity arise.
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Tennessee Volunteers: #8, 3-0
Next game: #9 Auburn Tigers (3-0)

Do video gamers play games of different genres or not? Answer me that.

Of course.

But based on your "logic", EVERY match we've encountered is simply SFF in one way or another, so theorhetically, ALL the characters that lose are just underperforming due to SFF.

As much as I hate to admit it, Deus is right. Face up to it, people. That doesn't mean that the X-Stats don't work. But calling this SFF borders on stupidity.
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Edge Eblan faces his greatest challenge to date at www.rpgdl.com - getting a piece of Emerald WEAPON!

[This message was deleted at the request of a moderator or administrator]

But based on your "logic", EVERY match we've encountered is simply SFF in one way or another, so theorhetically, ALL the characters that lose are just underperforming due to SFF.

Underperforming or overperforming. Well, you just said that the stats are garbage because human opinion is subjective. So that means that people aren't machines and that they will switch votes based on the opponent? Whoa, hello there SFF.
---
Tennessee Volunteers: #8, 3-0
Next game: #9 Auburn Tigers (3-0)

The Legend of Zelda Nintendo 11/15/87

Rockman Capcom 12/17/87

Yep, no way that they could have the same fanbases, especially when both games released on the same system, about a month apart. Why in the world would they have the same fanbases after that???
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It's.... over.

I agree, if this is SFF, then Serious Sam VS Megaman was SFF in 2002.
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Sora and Andel both defeated me in the Summer Contest.104/112

Personally I can see where both sides are coming from.

I mean I love Link and Mega Man and would vote both of them all the way until they face each other, in which case I like Link a bit more so I vote Link, so Link gains a vote, and Mega Man looses one, and the more people do it, the worse SFF is, so I can see your logic there Leonheart.

As for Deus, I know what you mean by saying according to that every match has SFF, and according the explaination thats right I suppose. But I think there is a bit of SFF in every match it just depends on how big of a fanbase the two characters share to really make a difference.
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Current SC2K4 Score: 125/128
COWS are for Milking, not GAMES

It's interesting to note that there's only been two matches where a character has come from being behind in correct prediction percentage from the previous round to beat their opponent. Frog against Master Chief and Crono against Mario. Using that, it looks like come Sunday, Link = Instant Win :-)

Let's throw more random stuff out - who would win in a handicap match, Link & Cloud - Sephiroth, Mario, Mega Man, Crono and Samus? I know what I'd vote for, but I don't know who'd win...
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Jon Thomson - 128 and out
Nominate Ridley for Summer Contest 2005

How does the SFF explanation border on stupidity? Do you have a better explanation of why Link is destroying Mega Man like this, which would suggest an increase of what... 5-6% from last year??
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It's.... over.

"By your logic, has Link ever beaten Cloud?

Didn't think so. Link is going down."

This is a case of the irresistable force vs. the immovable object. One of the two axioms is going to prove true, while the other will prove false.

Can Cloud beat Link even though he's never lost with the adult Link pic?

Can Link beat Cloud even though he's never won against him?

We'll find out soon enough...
---
Currently Supporting: Link and Samus.
"I do read sometimes." Mat Cauthon, The Wheel of Time.

and Dark115, thank you, I could not have said it any better.
---
It's.... over.

good post irridian. No joke. More logic like that is needed to up the average IQ level of this place.

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Human beings are like rabbits: they're totally clueless, wander around aimlessly and reproduce like mad.

[This message was deleted at the request of the original poster]

nevermind, he had a Wind Waker pic against Cloud.
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It's.... over.

"Link had an OoT pic last year against Cloud IIRC."


Nope.


http://www.angelfire.com/games5/heroicmario0/sum03b61.jpg


---
Currently Supporting: Link and Samus.
"I do read sometimes." Mat Cauthon, The Wheel of Time.

Next time I would atleast like to see one pic of X next year.
---
Summer Contest2K4 Status: 123/128 Today's Pick: Mega Man
C'mon Rockman! You can do this!

and Dark115, thank you, I could not have said it any better.

No problem, and its completely true the more and more I think about it. Same thing is gonna happen with Link vs. Cloud, I'd vote both all the way to the end, but Cloud wins this one in my mind, so I'll be voting Cloud.

Then of course you still need to factor in bracket voters, I'd bet that alot more people have Link beating Mega Man, thus would vote for Link.

There's just tons of factors that affect a match.
---
Current SC2K4 Score: 125/128
COWS are for Milking, not GAMES

Sorry for sounding rude, I don't doubt that you called 70-30 for Link, and for that I applaud you. What I'm saying is I doubt SFF was your reasoning behind this demolishing.

My reasoning at the time was just a gut feeling. I believe I said it after MM's 2nd round match when Heroic Mario was still endlessly droning on about MM's chances. I don't believe much in these extrapolated stats as they require too much work for things to "fit" (SFF, no...reverse SFF, KHF, etc).

Even though i said this match would be this lopsided I still come away surprised that it actually happened. If you asked me why,having now seen this result, I would say that maybe it really is the pictures. That is to say, if the pics used in the 2k3 contest were non-WW Link he would have won that contest as well and blown away his competitors in bigger fashion as well.
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<reptile-> The first time hypr opened a box of Cheerios and looked inside he yelled, "OH WOW! DONUT SEEDS!"
<hypr> wtf are donut seeds

How does the SFF explanation border on stupidity? Do you have a better explanation of why Link is destroying Mega Man like this, which would suggest an increase of what... 5-6% from last year?

Every single match of Link's has indicated he has risen 5% since last year. This one actually indicates he'd get 60% on Link 2k3, which is why Leonhart tried to come up with an explanation. I don't agree with him, but at least he's trying to come up with something.
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"Fargus' pirate crew makes women smile and villains revile!" ~ Cap'n Fargus, Fire Emblem

I'm just going to interect something real quick...

Based on what we've seen, if Mario remained constant and this % holds then Mega Man remained rather constant as well, while Link rose. I'd say that nothing fishy needs to be going on, but it still doesn't explain Tidus.

Of course, there's always the possibility that Square vs. Nintendo matches are always closer than they should be, as if they defy statistics. It would make sense, of course, because people want to see the best match possible. For that Tidus could have gotten more than he should on Ganon, Ganon could have gotten more than he should have on Magus and, well, Magus got beat down, so I don't think it was too severe for him but he might have gotten more on him than he was supposed to. I'd lay most of the blame on the big G-D and his match with Magus. Some idiots probably thought it'd be terribly fun to see Ganon be murdered by Link and voted for him when they wouldn't have otherwise.
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And kudos to Chichiri for that little thingy on SS. That's why you people have every right to be "elitist". - Slowflake

Don't blame them. Look at how much fun it was watching Ganondorf get septupled by Link =)
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SC2k4: 124/128 Rank: T-69

I just don't see how he'd be that much stronger than he was last year. Maybe I'm wrong and there is no SFF. I just see it as highly more likely than Link getting that much of a boost.
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It's.... over.

You know what would be great? A 3rd place match. It would shut up all the people in favor of retiring Clink, we'd get to see a good inter-Noble Nine match, and it would help make the XS more accurate.
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"Fargus' pirate crew makes women smile and villains revile!" ~ Cap'n Fargus, Fire Emblem

" I would say that maybe it really is the pictures. "

Honestly, I completely agree. While pictures might not be as much of a factor for other characters, the different Links obviously have different popularity.

This could really explain how several things happening last year, namely the vaunted "Kingdom Hearts Factor." In my opinion, the KHF has been greatly exagerated. While it certainly increased the respective popularities of Cloud and Sephiroth, and other Square characters, KHF also included the percentage that Link decreased last year.

Because, let's face it, one of the most important structures of the X-Stats is based on Link staying equal between contest '02 and '03. I think Link's performance this year proves that he decreased last year rather than staying equal, and Link has now returned to his '02 popularity.

Cloud has stayed more or less equal to his '03 self. The question remains, can Cloud from '03 beat a Link that is perhaps slightly stronger than his '02 form?
---
Currently Supporting: Link and Samus.
"I do read sometimes." Mat Cauthon, The Wheel of Time.

FourthDeus, you are digging yourself into a whole. I explained in the last topic that SFF doesn't necessarily mean that they have to be from the same company. However, you have to admit that the matches are different outside of Square vs. Nintendo matches. Link and Mega Man DO share a fanbase.... It's not the same SFF that has been called before, but there are MANY MANY people who like both, and just prefer Link.

A LOT of these matches are the results of that. You just can't factor that in. You have to use common sense. The only characters who seem to have their own distinct fanbase are RPG characters, mainly Square.

Anyways, I explained it better in the last topic. I have to go to class soon.... But remember, this contest is RELATIVE, the stats can only be taken so far. They are VERY useful if you know how to account for factors that can't be determined through statistics.

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"There are only 10 kinds of people in this world, those that read binary and those that don't."

irriadin, I gave a FULL explanation about that topic for the 2k3 stats. I don't really agree with the Link staying constant thing. I gave a detailed reasoning but it mostly went ignored.... I really wanted to post it after the contest, but someone said what's the point of posting a theory or argument if I was gonna wait until I was proved right *coughRPGuycough*..... But I've already said that the different Link's DO draw a different opinion and he's probably the ONLY character who pic truly matters because of such an opinion.

I don't think X and Mega Man would make a different because both are extremely popular and really similar as well. Even if you don't agree, you HAVE to admit that there's a strong opinion about Cel shaded Link in Wind Waker or Nintendo wouldn't have "addressed" the issue like they said they did.
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"There are only 10 kinds of people in this world, those that read binary and those that don't."

You know what would be great? A 3rd place match. It would shut up all the people in favor of retiring Clink, we'd get to see a good inter-Noble Nine match, and it would help make the XS more accurate.

Good idea. I'd have Mega Man over Samus in my bracket if it was running for this one, but would pick Samus to win it now.
---
Jon Thomson - 128 and out
Nominate Ridley for Summer Contest 2005

I think you'd need to see Mega Man and Samus face each other, and then have the winner take on Sephiroth to see where they stand.
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It's.... over.

Seeing how Megaman's salad days were on NES and early SNES, I can see how the two fanbases can rejoin. But does the common segment between the two fanbases favor Link that much? That's a bit hard to swallow for some reason. After all, you can't get much more of a common fanbase between two powerhouses like Link and Mario, and Mario wasn't handicapped any despite his fanbase virtually being Link's as well. So why would Megaman suffer this much?
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SC2K4 Status - Points: 120/128 - Matches: 56/60 - Rank: 00433/33221 - Final 4: LINK, Megaman, CLOUD, Samus

"You know what would be great? A 3rd place match."

I have always thought that. Proposed the idea last year to use it as an extra tie breaker.
---
And kudos to Chichiri for that little thingy on SS. That's why you people have every right to be "elitist". - Slowflake

"But does the common segment between the two fanbases favor Link that much?"

I loved both series when I was younger. I voted Mega Man today because I wanted him to look better (not that my one vote does much) but I love the Zelda series much, much more and would have voted for Link if I thought Mega Man even had a shot at winning. The original Zelda was the first game to sell a million for a reason, in its day it was the best game around, bar none, and I don't think there was a game that could top it in that generation until Super Mario Bros 3.

So yaeh, if we're saying that there's a fairly large old school gamer sect that is a bit more casual than myself, they would deffinitely favor Zelda.
---
And kudos to Chichiri for that little thingy on SS. That's why you people have every right to be "elitist". - Slowflake

Ignoring all the flaming for a moment, does this mean that Crono > MegaMan?

---
If you add monster truck tires to the Pope-mobile, religion suddenly becomes funny - SSJ3 Popo

A third place match would be great. Look at last year too, Sephiroth v Link would have been fantastic.

---
SC2K4: 124/128
Todays Pick: Link

Ignoring all the flaming for a moment, does this mean that Crono > MegaMan?

In the extrapolated stats, I believe so. In reality, I doubt it. I see Crono as taking advantage of the "Not again, Ceej" factor, which may have artificially increased his power this contest. That's not to say that I don't think that the Silent Death isn't still Noble, but I'd pick Mega in a head-to-head match without hesitation.
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Edge Eblan faces his greatest challenge to date at www.rpgdl.com - getting a piece of Emerald WEAPON!

Hey, is Slowflake doing a winners/losers post anytime soon? I don't want to take his copyrighted work, but maybe I will write my opinions on the more significant characters in the contest...
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"There are only 10 kinds of people in this world, those that read binary and those that don't."

That's not to say that I don't think that the Silent Death

Sounds like an appropriate nickname for Link. O.o
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M-me? Queen ***** of the Universe?
This is the happiest day of my life. ~ smitelf

Link isn't exactly SILENT..... he just doesn't speak words... He does have a lot to say though. If that makes any sense.... o_O

Well actually, he does say "come on" in Wind Waker (-_-)

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"There are only 10 kinds of people in this world, those that read binary and those that don't."

I'll probably do one next week. And Ulti is doing the match-by-match perspective... so yeah, there's not much room left for originality, but opinions are always welcome.
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SC2K4 Status - Points: 120/128 - Matches: 56/60 - Rank: 00433/33221 - Final 4: LINK, Megaman, CLOUD, Samus

What kills me is that theoretically, every match has at least some level of SFF. Somewhere out there, there is some Joe who's played games belonging to both characters and happens to like both characters in any given match.

Statistically speaking, there will always be at least one person who could account for SFF, even if it's as insignificant in the long run as 0.00000000000001% of the vote total. People shouldn't be trying to argue whether SFF exists...people should be trying to decide what characters garner enough SFF to make it relevant enough to vary an outcome by a significant amount.

I'm familiar with every character here this year with the exception of Laharl and Tanner. That being said, I like the characters from each game listed with the exception of Squall. I think Megaman 2 is one of the best games ever. I voted for Megaman over Link. I have Link in my bracket. I like Sephiroth more than Cloud. I voted for Cloud with Cloud in my bracket as well. I also have Cloud beating Link and will vote for Cloud over Link, however I will vote for Samus over Cloud, despite having Cloud win my bracket. And in all cases, I'll vote for anyone over Squall because I absolutely hate him with a passion (and no, I won't go into any arguments as to why, because everyone's entitled to their own opinion).

So what does that make me? A prime example for 62 potential SFF votes (not counting Snake Vs. Tanner and Vyse vs. Laharl)...and also an example of potential reverse-SFF or even anti-vote (anyone against Squall). So why does SFF not exist again?

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"I don't know who you are but I thank you for arousing me." -- Terranigma

I guess I'm a little late for the discussion..

But if you can't see why there is Link/Megaman SFF, and use an example such as Snake/Tanner to "prove" every match has SFF, then you are VERY closed minded.

EVERY match has SFF to a degree, because there are people who like both. But in most matches, it simply doesn't make that big of a difference.

But in Link/Megaman, we have two VERY popular characters. Chances are, almost everybody here likes Link and likes Megaman. Therefor, there is a LOT of overlap between the fanbases.

Who cares WHAT its from, its not "system SFF" "game SFF" "series SFF" "era SFF" "genre SFF" its frickin POPULARITY. They are both extremely popular and have very conflicting fanbases. Is that too hard to imagine?



And can you also see that there would be more SFF in Link/MM than in Seph/MM? Stop nitpicking the stats and dates and systems, etc., because every person is different. Generalize the type of person who likes MM and Seph, what type of games they play, etc., and you SHOULD come to the conclusion that there is less overlap between Seph and MM than there is between Link and MM.



And yes, there is overlap between Tanner and Snake. But not a lot. That's one of the WORST arguments I've seen on these topics.



Tomorrow, Cloud will not "take" as much percent from Samus as Link is "taking" from Megaman.



The x-stats to me are no good besides seeing what characters are popular, not to predict down to the percent what a character will do. Every frickin match has some sort of new factor to it, can't anybody admit that stats aren't perfect, or even close to it? If everything is a new factor, combined with overperforming and underperforming, doesn't that just shout out to you "hey look, our stats suck!" I mean seriously, adjusting characters for overperformance? Thats like saying "well... IF he got a different percent, then it makes these other matches make sense. They don't actually make sense, but hey, lets just pretend the match happened in a way so everything would make sense, change the percents around, and then use it to (incorrectly) predict percentages next year!!!!"



That's my rant *puts up flame shield*
---
Score: 91/96
Link, Megaman, Cloud, Samus / Link, Cloud / Cloud

Link getting SFF on Mega?

lmao, riiiiiiiiiight....that MUST be it...Mega can't be getting crushed without something crazy going on....

And to say that Link won't beat Cloud because he never has before makes about at much sense as saying that Cloud won't beat Mario, for the same reason.
---
SC2K4 Score: 110/120 Next Tough Pick: Link over Sep...Cloud.
CATS is more well-developed than Cloud. ~ A very wise man, UltarEmpire.

I know quite a few more people that like Zelda + FF then Zelda + MM btw, so whoever wins that MUST be getting big SFF as well.
---
SC2K4 Score: 110/120 Next Tough Pick: Link over Sep...Cloud.
CATS is more well-developed than Cloud. ~ A very wise man, UltarEmpire.

To be honest with you guys, I won't put too much weight into this match.

MM has been the most INCONSISTENT performer this round, overperforming and underperforming at will.

Crono on the other hand, should be relatively constant, so I'll use that match to gauge Link's strength.

That said, if Cloud couldn't break 60% on Samus tomorrow, I'll concede that Link has the contest in the bag already.

Honestly, I really wish I have an accurate way to gauge Cloud's strength, so far he never had a "real" opponent.

---
September 29th, 2004: Once again, destiny(Cloud) has destroyed fate(Sephiroth).

Crono on the other hand, should be relatively constant,

Errrr did you see Crono v Mario III?

---
SC2K4: 124/128
Todays Pick: Link

Of course Crono is a much better opponent to gauge Link's strength against Cloud. That should be obvious. Crono is closer to Cloud as a character than anyone else in this contest. Squall is similar, but his popularity isn't at Cloud's level. Sephiroth is the villain from Cloud's game. Crono is the main protagonist of the second most popular Square RPG as seen in the Spring 2k4 contest, and that game came out right before Cloud's in the Square lineup. Speaking of which, I wonder how Crono would do against Sephiroth. That would be a SFF matchup that I would WANT to see.

And my argument isn't one that says the extrapolated rankings are useless, so I don't know why this is turning into a bandwagon against the stats. By the way, stats include EVERYTHING including vote totals, etc. My point is that you should have the common sense to factor in things that the stats can't factor in. The extrapolated rankings should be used as a guide, not as an instant decision.
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"There are only 10 kinds of people in this world, those that read binary and those that don't."

I think most of us agree that the XS should be used as guidlines, not for predicting a % to the hundreth. That's why we can still create a difficult bracket to predict.
---
"Fargus' pirate crew makes women smile and villains revile!" ~ Cap'n Fargus, Fire Emblem

Errrr did you see Crono v Mario III?

I did, and I believe that's mostly Mario dropping.

Mario benefits the most from the casual voters, with the huge decrease in casual votes in this contest, Mario's strength took a big hit.

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September 29th, 2004: Once again, destiny(Cloud) has destroyed fate(Sephiroth).

Mario made up 900 votes in the dead of the night last year. That is not the casual vote.
---
"Fargus' pirate crew makes women smile and villains revile!" ~ Cap'n Fargus, Fire Emblem

If Link does somehow continue this dominance against Link, I wonder if last years Wind Waker pics really screwed Link over now? I mean, all Link has been getting this year are his much better pics and he's been thoroughly destroying EVERYONE in his path. Of course, then this could mean that Frog did in fact do a ton better than he should have but who knows...

If it turns out that Cloud winning last year was in fact a fluke due to that, then yeah, I'm all for retiring Link and calling him the most popular character ever.
---
Chaos Knight-Cerebral Insomniac of the CoS
summoner? wtf! summoner=Yuna Taru=midgit GaryPayton LA

*If Link continues his dominance against Cloud
---
Chaos Knight-Cerebral Insomniac of the CoS
summoner? wtf! summoner=Yuna Taru=midgit GaryPayton LA

Man, it's just crazy that Link's getting more % on MM than Cloud did on Sonic.

...I mean, damn.

...damn.
---
"Thank you, Mario. But our princess is in another castle."
-Toad in Super Mario Bros.

Moltar's First Thoughts on: Link vs. Mega

Oh man, have I got alot to say here...

I wake up and see the awesome match pic this morning of Mega killing Link. I knew they're had to be another, so I refreshed twice and saw the Link one. I then voted and I was like O_O. Link was destroying Mega. I didn't think it would be this bad. Damn.

So let's see, did Link over-perform thus far? Well, he did 1% better on CATS, SFF'd Ganon and Yoshi into the ground. Beat Crono (who has possibly increased about 3% since last year) by about 4% more. Now he's beating Mega by almost 7% more than we would have last year. And what happens? People call SFF. Well, it's much easier to believe that happened then...

Tidus and Shadow falling down to the level between 2003 Sam and KOS-MOS, Zero falling between 2003 Auron and Zelda, Mega himself falling to Aeris's and Squall's levels, Snake falling to Auron and Dante, Frog's Triangle falling to Alucard...and the rest of them falling and ranking low. This also puts Link, Crono and Mario ahead of Mega in the stats. So...SFF or that?

I believe there is some kind of SFF here, but not as much as everybody is probably thinking. Is it so hard to believe that Crono is stronger than Mega Man? I think this is mostly Link's power here. The guy is somehow getting more popular here. If Cloud doesn't impress tomorrow, then Link has this thing won. His performance today is PERFECT championship material.

I think I covered all I want to say...now onto today's match pics!

http://gamefaqs.com/shared/sum04b61.php

(Mega's pic) WOW! Look at Mega Man. I like Link's expression as he's getting shot.

(Link's pic) I like the other slightly more, but this one is good to. This pic tells us how the match is going too.
---
Sephiroth vs. Sly - http://www.stripcreator.com/comics/Moltar
Link vs. Mega Man - Bracket: Link - Vote: Link (124/128)

Mario benefits the most from the casual voters, with the huge decrease in casual votes in this contest, Mario's strength took a big hit.


'Casual' on this site is different from being an average person. Most casual gamers dislike Mario, which is why they own a PS2. The loss of casual vote on this site should hurt characters like Cloud, Snake, and Tommy Vercetti. All characters that are extremely popular with the casual gamer, but neither Cloud nor Tommy have shown any real signs of loss.

Mario made up 900 votes in the dead of the night last year. That is not the casual vote.

That's what you call "cheat votes", he didn't do that against Sephy the next round, nor did he ever do that on any other opponent.

---
September 29th, 2004: Once again, destiny(Cloud) has destroyed fate(Sephiroth).

http://boards.gamefaqs.com/gfaqs/genmessage.php?board=8&topic=16631136

I've made updates up until this point for the match...

Link's best update this match:

"Updates Left: 78
Votes per update needed for Mega Man to catch up: 47.706
Link's % last update: 72.54%
Total Votes so far: 11109"

Mega Man's best update this match:

"Updates Left: 87
Votes per update needed for Mega Man to catch up: 18.828
Link's % last update: 60.30%
Total Votes so far: 5570"


Ouch. O.o

---
M-me? Queen ***** of the Universe?
This is the happiest day of my life. ~ smitelf

The best thing about all this is seeing the x-stats that some of you kiss and make love to at night being beaten down with the ugly stick like a fat kid in dodgeball.

That being said, here is another shameless plug for a Nobleless Nine Contest next year!

Ah, never mind...the fanboys will never allow such a thing, they will cry and not come to the site...for maybe 10 minutes, til their fanboy love brings them back...

Sad, eh?
---
Steve Illumina: The Elite Satirist of GameFAQ's
SC2K4: 135/144 MK Deception: Oct 5!

'Casual' on this site is different from being an average person. Most casual gamers dislike Mario, which is why they own a PS2. The loss of casual vote on this site should hurt characters like Cloud, Snake, and Tommy Vercetti. All characters that are extremely popular with the casual gamer, but neither Cloud nor Tommy have shown any real signs of loss.

First, I agree that casuals in GameFAQs is not what I would call an average person IRL.

But, compare the average vote totals between 2003 and 2004, you'll notice a huge difference.

There's only 2 possible explanation for that fact:
1. GameFAQs is dropping in popularity, resulting in less visits to the site, which turns to less vote totals.
2. Many "average person" was interested in the SC 2003, but are no longer interested in this year's SC.

Considering that I haven't notice the popularity of this site going down, I'd say that #2 is most likely reason.

Ask an average person out there, and more will recognize Mario than anybody else in this contest.

Their apparent lost of interest in this year's SC has hurt Mario big time.

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September 29th, 2004: Once again, destiny(Cloud) has destroyed fate(Sephiroth).

1. GameFAQs is dropping in popularity, resulting in less visits to the site, which turns to less vote totals.

This is correct, the site dropped a lot in poularity after the redesign.

---
SC2K4: 124/128
Todays Pick: Link

*popularity
---
SC2K4: 124/128
Todays Pick: Link

I don't think there is SFF in today's match; I just simply think Mega Man is underperforming.
---
Vote in my Pseudo SpC2K5 bracket: http://boards.gamefaqs.com/gfaqs/genmessage.php?board=8&topic=16613027
Feat: LttP, SoTN, Final Fantasy 8, Super Metroid

This is correct, the site dropped a lot in poularity after the redesign.

I really don't think so, if anything we now have GS users browsing here as well.

But we'll see, Cloud vs. Link will show us the light.

---
September 29th, 2004: Once again, destiny(Cloud) has destroyed fate(Sephiroth).

Ask an average person out there, and more will recognize Mario than anybody else in this contest.

Out of anybody, that's true, but on GameFAQs, a casual visitor is just as likely to recognize Cloud, Crono, Sephiroth, etc. Mario dropping because of the "casual vote" disappearing doesn't hold much water with me.
---
"Fargus' pirate crew makes women smile and villains revile!" ~ Cap'n Fargus, Fire Emblem

Tournament Semifinals: Final 4 - Match 62 – (1)Cloud vs. (2)Samus

Moltar’s Analysis

Cloud - Aeris, Tifa…nah… but Yuffie…>=)

Round 1 – vs. Duke (Cloud: 80.19% - Duke: 19.81%)
Round 2 – vs. Vyse (Cloud: 81.41% - Vyse: 18.59%)
Round 3 – vs. Squall (Cloud: 76.21% - Squall: 23.79%)
Round 4 – vs. Sephiroth (Cloud: 56% - Sephiroth: 44%)

Cloud performs much better against Seph this year. Watch out Link, Cloud’s ready to defend!

Samus - Still praying for that Suitless pic…

Round 1 – vs. Lara (Samus: 82.39% - Lara: 17.61%)
Round 2 – vs. Sam (Sam: 19.03% – Samus: 80.97%)
Round 3 – vs. Sora (Sora: 35.15% - Samus: 65.85%)
Round 4 – vs. Sonic (Sonic: 57.19% - Samus: 42.81%)

Nice job by Samus. Sonic put up a fight, but Samus is too much.

Wow, we were hoping for a possible Samus upset, but it doesn’t look like it will happen. Cloud got 66% on Sonic last year, and even if you factor in a Sonic increase, Samus would still have to get in the low 60’s to win. It shouldn’t mean Samus won’t put up a fight though.

Blargh, another boring analysis. I promise to make the finals interesting, maybe even funny!

Moltar’s Bracket says: Cloud will win

Moltar’s Prediction is: Cloud 55% - Samus 45%



Ulti's Analysis

As cool as it was to think Samus could win this, we all know that she won't. Still, it will be fun to see her nab the lead after a few seconds. How Samus does in this match will also be rather interesting. The better she does, the more likely it is that Link has the title wrapped up. Samus will do better than what Xsts say; it's a matter of how much.

Ulti's Bracket/Prediction - Cloud/Cloud with 58.28%

---
Sephiroth vs. Sly - http://www.stripcreator.com/comics/Moltar
Link vs. Mega Man - Bracket: Link - Vote: Link (124/128)

Again, I wouldn't put too much stock into this.

And you sir, would be an idiot to not put stock into a killing of this proportion. If you think Cloud has a snowball's chance in hell your insane.
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/The Hunter - Log 10.023.7/
A considerable bounty will go to the unit who delivers Aran to Command. Dead or alive, it matters not.

I think somebody mentioned that Link is doing better against Mega Man than Cloud did against Sonic. That is insane.
---
"Fargus' pirate crew makes women smile and villains revile!" ~ Cap'n Fargus, Fire Emblem

So you've never met people who like both Zelda and Mega Man? The fanbases obviously overlap because they're both extremely popular. Being from different companie doesn't make a difference.

You're doing nothing but pulling for anything you can make up now. You want to try to pass this off as some kind of odd SFF? Riight. Why don't we just call each match two overlapping fanbases? Of course they would have to meet your criteria of being "popular". This is the most asinine thing I've heard, seriously.
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/The Hunter - Log 10.023.7/
A considerable bounty will go to the unit who delivers Aran to Command. Dead or alive, it matters not.

ChichiriMuyo -
Of course, there's always the possibility that Square vs. Nintendo matches are always closer than they should be, as if they defy statistics.

Tidus vs Ganondorf
?Magus vs Link?
Squall vs Samus
?Sora vs Samus?

I have a feeling that it's not all Square vs Nintendo matches but mostly those with the Square character loosing that are off with the loosing character overperforming. It would explain Tidus and Squall dropping (to a certain extent), Magus being SFF'd to hell and Sora being closer to Samus than expected...
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SpC2k4 - Triple Crown Winner! (Spread Betting, Betting, Oracle),
SC2k4 Oracle Challenge - Topic ID : 16596072

Serious question for all:

The hell do we mean when we say underperforming and overperforming? This isn't college football. Opponents don't play down to the level of fodder, and mid-carders don't rise to the occasion against elites.

We use these terms to describe in our mind what makes the results make sense. I am not calling anyone out, as I no doubt have used these phrases on countless occasions also. But I am just curious as to what everyone thinks about the terms themselves. They theoretically fit, as they describe what we are witnessing. But in the context in which we use them, they make about as much sense as letting R. Kelly babysit.
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SC2k4: 124/128 Rank: T-69

Oops, ignore those Samus/Sonic numbers. I forgot to update them before I posted.
---
Sephiroth vs. Sly - http://www.stripcreator.com/comics/Moltar
Link vs. Mega Man - Bracket: Link - Vote: Link (124/128)

I use the terms over/underperforming when a character is doing better/worse than the XS predict. To me, that indicates a relative popularity shift if the performance is off far enough. I don't use the terms to say, well, Link is overperforming today so there must be SFF or something. I say Link is overperforming today, so his popularity in relation to Mega Man's must have gone up.
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"Fargus' pirate crew makes women smile and villains revile!" ~ Cap'n Fargus, Fire Emblem

The correct use should be Link fans are overperforming against Mega Man fans. Much easier to say Link overperformed =P
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SpC2k4 - Triple Crown Winner! (Spread Betting, Betting, Oracle),
SC2k4 Oracle Challenge - Topic ID : 16596072

I think anyone who honestly believes this match would have some sort of variation of SFF is trying as hard as they can to find a reason for how well Link's doing. I think it's a completely idiotic thing to believe, seriously. I'm shocked that there has been argument over it... just wow.
---
/The Hunter - Log 10.023.7/
A considerable bounty will go to the unit who delivers Aran to Command. Dead or alive, it matters not.

And you sir, would be an idiot to not put stock into a killing of this proportion. If you think Cloud has a snowball's chance in hell your insane.

I respect the hell out of you HM, but can you really expect anyone to take you seriously after spending the past two full months standing on your soapbox, preaching about how Mega Man can (not will, can) win this thing?

...and if you think this match, without seeing what Cloud does against Samus, shows us our champion you are either biased or narrow-minded.

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SC2k4: 124/128 Rank: T-69

I think that today's match has showed us at least one thing:
We don't know the hell what's going on here.
For all we know Cloud could triple Samus tomorrow or lose against her!

But yes, today's results are frightening...
---
SpC2k4 - Triple Crown Winner! (Spread Betting, Betting, Oracle),
SC2k4 Oracle Challenge - Topic ID : 16596072

So let me get this straight. Basically, everyone who is rooting for Cloud is justifying Link's killing of MM by blaming it on SFF? Is that the jist of it?

Link and Mega Man star in two entirely different genres that appeal to two entirely different fanbases. The SFF in this match is minimal at best. Cloud needs a small miracle at this point.
---
Winner of the Spring 2004 'Best. Game. Ever.' Contest
++SCC GOD++ *Married to smitelf on 5/21/04*

...and if you think this match, without seeing what Cloud does against Samus, shows us our champion you are either biased or narrow-minded.

Why would you even think there's a chance Link could lose after seeing that? This isn't just breaking 60% or even just a couple of percentage over. This is more than doubling Mega Man. Cloud has shown all contest to be constant against his opponents while Link has more than overperformed against all of them. Does that not tell you who is going to win this? I think it's foolish to believe that Link would lose. I, honestly, don't even expect this finals to be close.
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/The Hunter - Log 10.023.7/
A considerable bounty will go to the unit who delivers Aran to Command. Dead or alive, it matters not.

So let me get this straight. Basically, everyone who is rooting for Cloud is justifying Link's killing of MM by blaming it on SFF? Is that the jist of it?

Seems to be.
---
M-me? Queen ***** of the Universe?
This is the happiest day of my life. ~ smitelf

And you sir, would be an idiot to not put stock into a killing of this proportion. If you think Cloud has a snowball's chance in hell your insane.

And this is coming from somebody who thought MM would get 40%+ on Link...

Seriously HM, your nailing of that Tidus vs. MM match was just a fluke, you have been off in all of your "crazy" predictions ever since.

To be honest, I almost lost hope for Cloud as well, but I'll wait till tomorrow before I buy a coffin for him.

---
September 29th, 2004: Once again, destiny(Cloud) has destroyed fate(Sephiroth).

I respect the hell out of you HM, but can you really expect anyone to take you seriously after spending the past two full months standing on your soapbox, preaching about how Mega Man can (not will, can) win this thing?

First off, let me say thanks and that I do respect you, and everyone else here, as well. Secondly, I hope people would still listen to what I'm saying despite my prediction of Mega Man winning. It was worth a shot and didn't payoff. My choosing of Mega Man doesn't take away from what I talk about on other matchups not concerning him.
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/The Hunter - Log 10.023.7/
A considerable bounty will go to the unit who delivers Aran to Command. Dead or alive, it matters not.

HM, unless you plan on making making 200 forms of each subsection of SFF (company, genre, intergame, villain, etc...), then this match qualifies for SFF. And to be frank, God himself could not convince me otherwise. This is not the same SFF as Cloud/Sephiroth, or Yoshi/Link, but it is SFF. It would be more specific to say this SFF comes from the age of their gaming lineage (just as a Mario/Mega Man match would see), but it nevertheless comes from the result of similar fanbases (old school gamers). Is that 100% of the voting crop? No, but given I have not touched Wind Waker or any non-nintendo Mega Man game, I sure as hell qualify under this SFF, and you'd be irrational to think the number of voters just like me is immaterial.

Get this straight: I am not saying Mega Man is getting butt-raped by SFF, and without it would be 60/40. What I am saying is a couple percentage points is not outside the realm of possibility.
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SC2k4: 124/128 Rank: T-69

Link has overperformed in every single match he's been in. Cloud underperformed in one, was dead on in another, and overperformed against an apparently weakened Sephiroth. I don't see how you can not call Link the favorite. He's showing 2k2 levels of dominance, perhaps even more than 2k2.
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"Fargus' pirate crew makes women smile and villains revile!" ~ Cap'n Fargus, Fire Emblem

It's just hard to believe that Link has increased this much, making Mega's division look so weak without SFF.

Now I'm not saying there is any, because SFF between Link and Mega sounds wrong in just about every way, but it's still kind out hard to accept the fact that Mega, along with his division, is that weak.
---
Sephiroth vs. Sly - http://www.stripcreator.com/comics/Moltar
Link vs. Mega Man - Bracket: Link - Vote: Link (124/128)

He's showing 2k2 levels of dominance, perhaps even more than 2k2.

So most dominant contest contestants would go:

1. Link (2004)
2. Link (2002)
3. Final Fantasy VII (Spr. 2004)
4. Cloud (2003)

?
---
M-me? Queen ***** of the Universe?
This is the happiest day of my life. ~ smitelf

HM, unless you plan on making making 200 forms of each subsection of SFF (company, genre, intergame, villain, etc...), then this match qualifies for SFF.

I like both characters, I vote for one over the other. Technically there IS SFF in this match. Does it make a difference? Good gracious, no. I hope the people arguing for it don't believe it is ANYTHING close to significant.

Get this straight: I am not saying Mega Man is getting butt-raped by SFF, and without it would be 60/40. What I am saying is a couple percentage points is not outside the realm of possibility.

If anything there is "SFF" in every match, but I obviously wouldn't imagine much more than 1% of this "SFF" affecting this matchup. It certainly doesn't take away from how incredibly impressive this performance is.
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/The Hunter - Log 10.023.7/
A considerable bounty will go to the unit who delivers Aran to Command. Dead or alive, it matters not.

So there was no SFF in Link/Mario but there's a couple points in Link/Mega Man? That makes no sense to me.
---
"Fargus' pirate crew makes women smile and villains revile!" ~ Cap'n Fargus, Fire Emblem

SFF shouldn't be thrown around to explain variations of, like, 2% dammit. Each poll has a life of its own.

But it takes genuine SFF, as we have always known it, to shift a 60-40 match into a 70-30 one. And Link and Megaman don't strike me as a case of fanbase leeching or anything.
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SC2K4 Status - Points: 120/128 - Matches: 56/60 - Rank: 00433/33221 - Final 4: LINK, Megaman, CLOUD, Samus

Seriously HM, your nailing of that Tidus vs. MM match was just a fluke, you have been off in all of your "crazy" predictions ever since.

I've made two "crazy" predictions since then, both involving Mega Man. You'll also notice that each of my predictions is what he needed to get.
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/The Hunter - Log 10.023.7/
A considerable bounty will go to the unit who delivers Aran to Command. Dead or alive, it matters not.

I'll reserve judgement on Link's level of dominance until I see Cloud/Samus, but between this and Crono, I wouldn't be all that surprised if Cloud can't break 43.35% on Link. I still think it's somewhat farfetched, but Link more than doubling Mega Man and would almost triple Solid freaking Snake.
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"Fargus' pirate crew makes women smile and villains revile!" ~ Cap'n Fargus, Fire Emblem

Freaky, considering he struggled like hell to triple STRIDER HIRYU two years ago.
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SC2K4 Status - Points: 120/128 - Matches: 56/60 - Rank: 00433/33221 - Final 4: LINK, Megaman, CLOUD, Samus

I'll reserve judgement on Link's level of dominance until I see Cloud/Samus, but between this and Crono, I wouldn't be all that surprised if Cloud can't break 43.35% on Link. I still think it's somewhat farfetched, but Link more than doubling Mega Man and would almost triple Solid freaking Snake.

If that happened, maybe we should retire Link. O_o;;
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M-me? Queen ***** of the Universe?
This is the happiest day of my life. ~ smitelf

There is NO SFF in this match, never was and never will be.

It's simply Link boosting like crazy, and that MM might have decreased some as well.

I mean, he didn't perform too well on a much weaker Snake.

---
September 29th, 2004: Once again, destiny(Cloud) has destroyed fate(Sephiroth).

Might I add that this is before Zelda 10. Yes, before freakin' Zelda 10.
---
/The Hunter - Log 10.023.7/
A considerable bounty will go to the unit who delivers Aran to Command. Dead or alive, it matters not.

This is what I'm saying. WE ALL KNOW Link can not triple Snake. The stats may say that, but c'mon people...

Eh...there's no point trying to find out what's going on here.
---
Sephiroth vs. Sly - http://www.stripcreator.com/comics/Moltar
Link vs. Mega Man - Bracket: Link - Vote: Link (124/128)

Will you people get the hell off of Heroic Mario's back? He defended a character he likes and was wrong. Okay, who honestly gives a flying rat's ass?
---
Winner of the Spring 2004 'Best. Game. Ever.' Contest
++SCC GOD++ *Married to smitelf on 5/21/04*

Why is the idea of SFF in this match so idiotic when Link suddenly goes from 55% on his 2003 version to 60%? My goodness, polls have shown that at least 80% of the voters would vote for Link or Mega Man for some reason or another. If you don't think the fanbases overlap, you're crazy.

Old school voters grew up on NES and SNES Zelda and Mega Man games. It's not that farfetched. What? All of a sudden everyone only plays one genre of games? That's even more stupid than the idea that there is no SFF.
---
Tennessee Volunteers: #8, 3-0
Next game: #9 Auburn Tigers (3-0)

Eh...there's no point trying to find out what's going on here.

There will be months without a contest and over half the people posting on this board will leave, we may try to figure out this riddle out of pure boredom
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I'm safe until the next toss-up match, which is Bowser vs. Guybrush. ~SuperLuigiBros

I still don't believe there was no SFF in Mario/Link. Unfortunately, all we can base things on are future years affecting past data, and this is spotty at best.

I take nothing away from Link, and here at 4:10 CST pronounce him the current favorite to win this contest. But there is not a figure imaginable that would make me end this contest without seeing what his adversary puts up.

I am not in any place to start spouting out numbers to back my claims, because frankly the Mario/Link SFF theory was hurt by Link's ownage of Crono. But our annual data fluctuates so much based on so many different variables, that it is not adequate enough (for me, at least) to take 2k2 and 2k3 data and even take it within the degree of error. We saw Cloud put up what... a 10% increase? I was not around for 2k2, and was only your casual voter for 2k3, but I have assessed the results from both those contests and there are quite a few things that jump off the page as odd as hell. The same will be true for this contest. And we may never be able to explain these things. But I am not about to believe for one second that results from this year either confirm or deny hypothesi from one or two years ago. There are just too many variables outside of character strength across years to make it unreliable.
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SC2k4: 124/128 Rank: T-69

I mean, he didn't perform too well on a much weaker Snake.

Snake wasn't that much weaker...besides, you can't say Mega has increased and Snake has decreased. It's either one or the other.
---
Sephiroth vs. Sly - http://www.stripcreator.com/comics/Moltar
Link vs. Mega Man - Bracket: Link - Vote: Link (124/128)

This is what I'm saying. WE ALL KNOW Link can not triple Snake. The stats may say that, but c'mon people...

He's not suppose to come close to doubling Mega Man either, but he's doing it and then some. I wouldn't put it past him to triple Snake.
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/The Hunter - Log 10.023.7/
A considerable bounty will go to the unit who delivers Aran to Command. Dead or alive, it matters not.

Might I add that this is before Zelda 10. Yes, before freakin' Zelda 10.

Are we certain that the CE didn't help him at all? I know the MMAC doesn't seem to have helped MM that much right now, but I think the CE could have helped Link some. It did get out to people who hadn't played Zelda games before; people buying a Gamecube because it was $99 now and happened to come with a game.

How many bundles were sold? 2 million? I don't know why it isn't possible that a large number of those people hadn't played a Zelda game in the past... Meh.
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M-me? Queen ***** of the Universe?
This is the happiest day of my life. ~ smitelf

I am not jumping on HM's back. I am merely having a friendly disagreement with him about the prospects of our wonderful contest here =)
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SC2k4: 124/128 Rank: T-69

Quite frankly, if you think this is SFF, you're an idiot or a blind fanboy. They're different in so many ways it's not funny, Link is going to beat Cloud with at least 52%.
---
Contest Winner: Link

Why is the idea of SFF in this match so idiotic when Link
suddenly goes from 55% on his 2003 version to 60%? My goodness, polls have shown that at least 80% of the voters would vote for Link or Mega Man for some reason or another. If you don't think the fanbases overlap, you're crazy.

I'm living proof that the fanbases would overlap, however, it isn't anything significant at all. If you think this explains the drastic overperformance then your insane, but if your more like tnote and think it affected much lesser then it's more reasonable, although still out there. You seem to be arguing it like it was the reason for Link's domination today. It most certainly is not. If you believe it is, you're just pulling for anything you could think of.

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/The Hunter - Log 10.023.7/
A considerable bounty will go to the unit who delivers Aran to Command. Dead or alive, it matters not.

Link is going to beat Cloud with at least 52%.

And what if Cloud doubles Samus?
---
Sephiroth vs. Sly - http://www.stripcreator.com/comics/Moltar
Link vs. Mega Man - Bracket: Link - Vote: Link (124/128)

...I know I went out and bought my sister a Gamecube for the sole reason of it came with the Collector's Edition. That, and it was $99.

Ooh, and it has Skies of Arcadia. Poor Vyse =(

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SC2k4: 124/128 Rank: T-69

Mega Man/Crono no longer looks like a good Elite 8 match for my mock bracket...I'll have to work on that...
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"Fargus' pirate crew makes women smile and villains revile!" ~ Cap'n Fargus, Fire Emblem

Snake wasn't that much weaker...besides, you can't say Mega has increased and Snake has decreased. It's either one or the other.

If you read the line above that one carefully, you'll realize that I was thinking that BOTH dropped.

It's just that Snake's drop is somewhat more significant than MM's.

Note that I'm using Crono as my measuring stick, as IMO he has no reason to decrease or increase.

---
September 29th, 2004: Once again, destiny(Cloud) has destroyed fate(Sephiroth).

I'm not arguing for or against anything because Mega Man has been too inconsistent for me to know anything for certain. Don't be saying it's stupid for people to stick by Cloud until the end when you did it with Mega Man despite flying in the face of all statistics.
---
Tennessee Volunteers: #8, 3-0
Next game: #9 Auburn Tigers (3-0)

Ooh, and it has Skies of Arcadia. Poor Vyse =(

;_;

Damn you, Cloud!
---
M-me? Queen ***** of the Universe?
This is the happiest day of my life. ~ smitelf

On the whole picture discussion, what do you think would happen if Cloud's city walking picture was used? (The one with gigantic hands and no mouth)

Would it matter? It might, because these KH pictures of him and Sephiroth are pretty badong. And Link certainly seems to go up with a badass picture.
---
It's-a me! Mario!
SMW > SM64 > SMB.3 > SMB. > SMS > SMW 2: YI > SMB. 2 > SMB.: LL

And what if Cloud doubles Samus?

Mega Man is stronger than Samus, and I doubt Cloud will get that much. In any case, I could easily say Link will SFF Cloud! Think about it, they're both blonde, they both have blue eyes(end of FFVII anyway), they both use badass swords, and they both crossdress!
---
Contest Winner: Link

Are we certain that the CE didn't help him at all?

I'll say it again, this is before Zelda 10 comes close to releasing. We were expecting a boost out of him then, and if he's this dominant before it comes out can you imagine what it would be like when it actually does? Yes, even stronger than this.

I certainly think it could've helped though.
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/The Hunter - Log 10.023.7/
A considerable bounty will go to the unit who delivers Aran to Command. Dead or alive, it matters not.

If you read the line above that one carefully, you'll realize that I was thinking that BOTH dropped.

It's just that Snake's drop is somewhat more significant than MM's.

And let's not even talk about Tidus/Shadow's drops! WHOAMG! And Zero.....what is his situation?
---
Sephiroth vs. Sly - http://www.stripcreator.com/comics/Moltar
Link vs. Mega Man - Bracket: Link - Vote: Link (124/128)

Don't be saying it's stupid for people to stick by Cloud until the end when you did it with Mega Man despite flying in the face of all statistics.

I stuck by Mega Man without coming up with an off the wall excuse for his less than championship-like performance against Solid Snake.
---
/The Hunter - Log 10.023.7/
A considerable bounty will go to the unit who delivers Aran to Command. Dead or alive, it matters not.

Mega Man is stronger than Samus, and I doubt Cloud will get that much. In any case, I could easily say Link will SFF Cloud! Think about it, they're both blonde, they both have blue eyes(end of FFVII anyway), they both use badass swords, and they both crossdress!

I would say Link/Crono would have more SFF...I mean, they're practically half-brothers!
---
Sephiroth vs. Sly - http://www.stripcreator.com/comics/Moltar
Link vs. Mega Man - Bracket: Link - Vote: Link (124/128)

No doubt there is SFF in Cloud/Link, but...

a) I cannot fathom it being anything material
b) If it does, last year showed which way it swings
c) You are just mocking me and leonhart

Bastard.
---
SC2k4: 124/128 Rank: T-69

And let's not even talk about Tidus/Shadow's drops! WHOAMG! And Zero.....what is his situation?

I believe Tidus/Shadow end up around where Sam Fisher was last year, and Zero takes 2nd in 20XX, but he'll be behind Crono and Mario for sure.
---
"Fargus' pirate crew makes women smile and villains revile!" ~ Cap'n Fargus, Fire Emblem

Ummm.... I'm not using SFF as an excuse. In fact, throw out the term SFF for this. This match doesn't need any excuses. This is an explanation of why Mega Man is performing like this against Link. I never had a doubt that Link would perform as such in this contest. I also know that if anyone has ANY chance against Link, it would have to be Cloud, which likely won't be happening.

You can be blind and think that because one person's games are action/adventure and one person's games are platformers that they don't share the same fanbase. I think ChichiriMuyo explained it the best. If there's ANY genre that would have a completely different fanbase than any other it would have to be RPGs. That being said, it's likely that Link shares more fans with Mega Man than he does with Crono. This isn't why Mega Man is getting blown out, but it is why I wouldn't give him a CHANCE to beat Link. Think about it, do you know ANYONE who says for the most part they only play "platformers" or only play "adventure" games? Likely very few. Now how many people do you know that mostly play RPGs? I know quite a few myself.

I think this is the reason why Crono performed better against Link. He may or may not really be stronger than Mega Man in a straight up match. Once again, I say that each match is relative and that the results can vary from opponent to opponent. If you had a Round Robin between the top 10 characters this year, I can almost guarantee you that the results would disagree with each other based on an extrapolated ranking system.

---
"There are only 10 kinds of people in this world, those that read binary and those that don't."

A third place match would be great. Look at last year too, Sephiroth v Link would have been fantastic.

I believe you mean Link vs Mega Man?

*Looks at todays poll*
---
It's-a me! Mario!
SMW > SM64 > SMB.3 > SMB. > SMS > SMW 2: YI > SMB. 2 > SMB.: LL

And let's not even talk about Tidus/Shadow's drops! WHOAMG! And Zero.....what is his situation?

Again, I'm measuring them wrt Crono, that I consider to be the most consistent performer.

I admit Tidus/Shadow's drop is hard to believe, but if the facts points that way, what can I say?

---
September 29th, 2004: Once again, destiny(Cloud) has destroyed fate(Sephiroth).

Well, actually, if you compare what 2004 Link should get on 2003 Mega Man, it should be 65/35. That's not really too far off. Perhaps the Blue Bomber didn't change at all, and Snake just dropped.
---
Tennessee Volunteers: #8, 3-0
Next game: #9 Auburn Tigers (3-0)

c) You are just mocking me and leonhart

Thank you captain o.
---
Contest Winner: Link

I stuck by Mega Man without coming up with an off the wall excuse for his less than championship-like performance against Solid Snake.

Yeah, and you're jumping to conclusions about the championship without seeing what Cloud can do against Samus. I haven't seen anything yet from him that shows me he can't win.
---
Tennessee Volunteers: #8, 3-0
Next game: #9 Auburn Tigers (3-0)

Link [Mario]/Mega Man [2003] would be roughly 65/35, so it's kinda close. Link [Mario] would also get around 53% on Cloud [2003]
---
"Fargus' pirate crew makes women smile and villains revile!" ~ Cap'n Fargus, Fire Emblem

I think it is in all of our best interests if we just admit there is some degree in SFF in every match, and leave it at that. The majority of matches the SFF is so immaterial we don't even detect it. Then there are the SFF matches we don't know are SFF until they pimp-smack us in the second round of next year's tourney (no, I am not bitter about Prince Ryu getting treated like 13 year old tawainese hooker at a business convention). And finally, there are the obvious SFF matches where the end result can be backed out as a result of knowing that SFF occurred (Ganondorf/Link, Magus/Crono).

I am giving everyone the chance to just end the degenerative arguing going on about the SFF in this match. Leonhart and I think it exists in some material degree. Everyone else does not. We will never convince eachother, so let us turn our attention to what we think Cloud needs to slap up on the Metroid ho to make Sunday entertaining.

Personally, I think anything around 63% will make me anxious, while anything under 60% or over doubling will send me in thinking one or the other is a clear favorite.
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SC2k4: 124/128 Rank: T-69

I still believe Mega Man just underperformed. Or maybe, like Mario, lost votes from the casual voters when the new layout was released. I really don't know what's going on...
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Vote in my Pseudo SpC2K5 bracket: http://boards.gamefaqs.com/gfaqs/genmessage.php?board=8&topic=16613027
Feat: LttP, SoTN, Final Fantasy 8, Super Metroid

I believe Tidus/Shadow end up around where Sam Fisher was last year, and Zero takes 2nd in 20XX, but he'll be behind Crono and Mario for sure.

I knew about Tidus/Shadow, and Zero would end up a little ahead of '03 Auron. But it looked like he over-performed on Mega...yet he falls in the rankings...eh?
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Sephiroth vs. Sly - http://www.stripcreator.com/comics/Moltar
Link vs. Mega Man - Bracket: Link - Vote: Link (124/128)

Yeah, Zero would fall because Mega Man's underperformance outweighs his overperformance....by a lot.
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Tennessee Volunteers: #8, 3-0
Next game: #9 Auburn Tigers (3-0)

I admit Tidus/Shadow's drop is hard to believe, but if the facts points that way, what can I say?

So you would put half the 2003 field over Tidus/Shadow?
---
Sephiroth vs. Sly - http://www.stripcreator.com/comics/Moltar
Link vs. Mega Man - Bracket: Link - Vote: Link (124/128)

Link [Mario]/Mega Man [2003] would be roughly 65/35, so it's kinda close. Link [Mario] would also get around 53% on Cloud [2003]

That means if Mario is indeed constant, Cloud has to increase by 4% to even stand a chance?

That really sucks, but I'll wait and see what happens, it's too early to give up hope now.

---
September 29th, 2004: Once again, destiny(Cloud) has destroyed fate(Sephiroth).

Well, actually, if you compare what 2004 Link should get on 2003 Mega Man, it should be 65/35. That's not really too far off. Perhaps the Blue Bomber didn't change at all, and Snake just dropped.

Snake dropped 4% and Link still rose 3%? I dunno, that still just seems nuts to me. Snake did have a remake of MGS afterall, and 4% is quite a dive for someone who's remained fairly consistent both years.

This is all crazy, really.
---
/The Hunter - Log 10.023.7/
A considerable bounty will go to the unit who delivers Aran to Command. Dead or alive, it matters not.

So you would put half the 2003 field over Tidus/Shadow?

Not right now, but if Cloud hit 49%+ against Link, I certainly will.

---
September 29th, 2004: Once again, destiny(Cloud) has destroyed fate(Sephiroth).

Yeah, and you're jumping to conclusions about the championship without seeing what Cloud can do against Samus. I haven't seen anything yet from him that shows me he can't win.

He'd have to get around 65-66% on Samus in order for me to give him a shot at actually beating Link. Cloud doesn't looked to have changed at all while Samus has looked to increase. If anything I'm expecting Samus to break 40% come tomorrow.
---
/The Hunter - Log 10.023.7/
A considerable bounty will go to the unit who delivers Aran to Command. Dead or alive, it matters not.

I dunno, that still just seems nuts to me. Snake did have a remake of MGS afterall

You said it yourself when I brought this up, The Twin Snakes hasn't sold as well as it could. I myself just got it a few days ago, I have to say so far that Snake is definitely a favorate character of mine now...I have to get MGS2 and play that before Snake Eater comes out...
---
Contest Winner: Link

Leonhart and I think it exists in some material degree. Everyone else does not.

I guess I'm the Invisible Man then.... (-_-)

Seriously, has anyone even been reading my posts?
---
"There are only 10 kinds of people in this world, those that read binary and those that don't."

Look at three of the characters who had increases this year. Link, Samus, Master Chief. Notice anything in particular about these three characters. Oh yeah, they have games which are hyped THROUGH THE ROOF coming in the next year.

The CE might of helped but I can come up with only one solution to the reason Link has increased this much. E3. There were a lot of fans who were turned off of TWW by the looks and all those fans were instantly brought back into the fold. That means Cloud and company have always been playing with a weakend Link Well looks like he has got his strength back.

And for those saying Cloud could do the same thing to Samus. You are right he could. But unlike Link, there is no reason to think Cloud has increased above a minimial amount. The only character he did better againist was Sephiroth who looks to be weaker this year. The rest all the increasing/decreasing was minimal. We can't say that about Link. Even in SFF matches, he SFF'd WAY too much.

Though I wont say Cloud has no chance, I can't see him breaking 60 on a Samus who I think is as strong as Sephiroth this year. But maybe he will. This contest has proven to be weird enough.

You said it yourself when I brought this up, The Twin Snakes hasn't sold as well as it could. I myself just got it a few days ago, I have to say so far that Snake is definitely a favorate character of mine now...I have to get MGS2 and play that before Snake Eater comes out...

It only sold around 170,000 copies, yes, but it still seems unlikely to me that'd be take a drop of ~4% after getting that. I never believed it would have increased him much, if at all, but him dropping out of nowhere with Link still increasing? Sounds a little crazy to me. Then again, the explanations for this match are all crazy what with everyone dropping/rising.
---
/The Hunter - Log 10.023.7/
A considerable bounty will go to the unit who delivers Aran to Command. Dead or alive, it matters not.

Seriously, has anyone even been reading my posts?

... I do.

---
M-me? Queen ***** of the Universe?
This is the happiest day of my life. ~ smitelf

After doing some mathematical work...If Crono went up, Zero went up, and Snake went down, Mega Man stays the same, it says that Knuckles gets just over 40% on Snake. Not bad. It still results in Link overperforming by 3% though.
---
Tennessee Volunteers: #8, 3-0
Next game: #9 Auburn Tigers (3-0)

That means if Mario is indeed constant, Cloud has to increase by 4% to even stand a chance?

Hmm...let's see his match with Seph. Cloud got 51.89% on him. This year he got 56%. That's 4 points better...but WAIT!

Vivi[DK] would be expected to get 27.69 on 2003 Cloud. That means he would get 28.78% on Seph. Seph underpefroms by 2%

Auron would be expected to get 28.90% on 2003 Seph. Seph underperforms by 4%

I think some of the numbers might be off, but you catch the point. Cloud will have to put up impressive numbers against Samus.
---
Sephiroth vs. Sly - http://www.stripcreator.com/comics/Moltar
Link vs. Mega Man - Bracket: Link - Vote: Link (124/128)

I dont think Snake dropped all that much. That all can be explained with MM increasing a little and MC increasing a lot.

therealmnm -

My bad bro. I gathered from your messages that you felt there was some degree of fluctuation, but did not want to attribute it to SFF per se. I read your posts, but I guess I must not have completely understood your viewpoint. I assure you I am not ignoring your opinions

<(o_o)>

God my happy Kirby sucks.
---
SC2k4: 124/128 Rank: T-69

It only sold around 170,000 copies, yes, but it still seems unlikely to me that'd be take a drop of ~4% after getting that. I never believed it would have increased him much, if at all, but him dropping out of nowhere with Link still increasing? Sounds a little crazy to me. Then again, the explanations for this match are all crazy what with everyone dropping/rising.

I believe someone else explained this, there are 100% of voters...if someones % increases, someone elses must decrease. Why Snake? I don't know, MGS3 is another game being hyped through the roof and it looks to be awesome...but for whatever reason the hype hasn't helped him like it has Link and Samus and Master Chief.
---
Contest Winner: Link

Also to kind of explain Sephiroth decrease. Could the fact that he was not in the finals and a final match between Cloud vs Sephiroth could be kept close by people voting for the underdog, especially Link fans voting againist Cloud be anything to do with it?

I believe someone else explained this, there are 100% of voters...if someones % increases, someone elses must decrease.

Cloud increased, Link did not decrease.

Why Snake? I don't know, MGS3 is another game being hyped through the roof and it looks to be awesome...but for whatever reason the hype hasn't helped him like it has Link and Samus and Master Chief.

Which makes absolutely no sense.
---
/The Hunter - Log 10.023.7/
A considerable bounty will go to the unit who delivers Aran to Command. Dead or alive, it matters not.

Hmm...let's see his match with Seph. Cloud got 51.89% on him. This year he got 56%. That's 4 points better...but WAIT!

Vivi[DK] would be expected to get 27.69 on 2003 Cloud. That means he would get 28.78% on Seph. Seph underpefroms by 2%

Auron would be expected to get 28.90% on 2003 Seph. Seph underperforms by 4%

I think some of the numbers might be off, but you catch the point. Cloud will have to put up impressive numbers against Samus.

I agree, if he didn't get AT LEAST 60%+, I'll buy a coffin for him.

---
September 29th, 2004: Once again, destiny(Cloud) has destroyed fate(Sephiroth).

Actually MGS 3 hasnt had really big hype from what I can tell especially compared to Halo 2, Echoes, and Certainly Zelda X.

Actually MGS 3 hasnt had really big hype

What? It certainly has had lots of hype.
---
/The Hunter - Log 10.023.7/
A considerable bounty will go to the unit who delivers Aran to Command. Dead or alive, it matters not.

Also to kind of explain Sephiroth decrease. Could the fact that he was not in the finals and a final match between Cloud vs Sephiroth could be kept close by people voting for the underdog, especially Link fans voting againist Cloud be anything to do with it?

That sounds an awful lot like the West Division Factor. What is it with Sephiroth and overperforming?

By the way, a WDF of 4.78% nails Ryu, Samus, and Mega Man's 2k3 XS's nearly exactly.
---
"Fargus' pirate crew makes women smile and villains revile!" ~ Cap'n Fargus, Fire Emblem

Snake dropped 4% and Link still rose 3%? I dunno, that still just seems nuts to me. Snake did have a remake of MGS afterall, and 4% is quite a dive for someone who's remained fairly consistent both years.

It surprises me more that Mario keeps falling.
---
DEFENCE, DEFENCE
"Alas, History is nothing but a lie agreed upon" - Napoleon Bonaparte.

Actually MGS 3 hasnt had really big hype from what I can tell especially compared to Halo 2, Echoes, and Certainly Zelda X.

I've heard a lot of people commenting on how awesome the trailers are, how much they want it, etc. I've even seen someone post "I would give my first born child for MGS3" o-O
---
Contest Winner: Link

It surprises me more that Mario keeps falling.

Who said Mario fell?
---
/The Hunter - Log 10.023.7/
A considerable bounty will go to the unit who delivers Aran to Command. Dead or alive, it matters not.

Speaking of the Chief, he'll be one of the few who will have actually increased from this craziness (if Link wins). It won't be by much (just a little over 1%) but it's an increase none the less.
---
Sephiroth vs. Sly - http://www.stripcreator.com/comics/Moltar
Link vs. Mega Man - Bracket: Link - Vote: Link (124/128)

MGS3 is nowhere near the hype of Halo 2 or Zelda X. Xbox and GCN owners and even those without the consoles are drooling over the games. They have godlike levels of hype. MGS3 is nowhere near that. But neither is MP2: Echos IMO.
---
SC2k4 Winner: Link
Status: 58/64 Next Pick: Link

For PS2 games I put the hype for MGS 3 behind GTA:SA, GT4, KillZone, and FFXII.

I have actually been surprised by the lack of huge hype of MGS 3.

Could use some more opinions for the board bracket thing:

http://boards.gamefaqs.com/gfaqs/genmessage.php?board=8&topic=16627494

There's a 2-way tie at the moment for the last #4 seed that needs breaking, which could yet be made more complicated... cheers.
---
Jon Thomson - 128 and out
Nominate Ridley for Summer Contest 2005

I believe someone else explained this, there are 100% of voters...if someones % increases, someone elses must decrease.

That was me, or at least I did say something like that.

I DO believe that Link decreased in 2003, as his expected percentage decreased vs. Crono.

TWW simply isn't awesome enough, hence some of his fans started to abandon him.

---
September 29th, 2004: Once again, destiny(Cloud) has destroyed fate(Sephiroth).

For PS2 games I put the hype for MGS 3 behind GTA:SA, GT4, KillZone, and FFXII.

You'd be incredibly wrong. The only game on your list that is getting more hype than MGS3 would be GTA:SA.
---
/The Hunter - Log 10.023.7/
A considerable bounty will go to the unit who delivers Aran to Command. Dead or alive, it matters not.

jonthomson, not to insult what you're trying to do or anything, but it's much better to set up good matchups and worry about the seeds later. I don't see a very good bracket coming out of a tournament in which users pick seeds.
---
"Fargus' pirate crew makes women smile and villains revile!" ~ Cap'n Fargus, Fire Emblem

Again, I'm looking for more feedback on my Sc2k5 mock bracket.

http://boards.gamefaqs.com/gfaqs/genmessage.php?board=8&topic=16604459

Thanks!
---
Cloud786: What does wangsterbate mean?
Lawn Flamingo Lamp: It's from Pokemon.

I DO believe that Link decreased in 2003, as his expected percentage decreased vs. Crono.

...by 0.71%.
---
/The Hunter - Log 10.023.7/
A considerable bounty will go to the unit who delivers Aran to Command. Dead or alive, it matters not.

And all the fans he lost with the showing of TWW at E32002, he gained back at E32004.

Link has always been weakenend in these contests, he is just now coming back to full strength.

Well, let's just go with the base value to be expected of Cloud based on Samus's performance on a static Sonic:

Cloud- 60.24%

Samus- 39.76%

Keeping Link's strength constant with Crono, that would mean Cloud needs 62-63% tomorrow, roundabout.
---
Tennessee Volunteers: #8, 3-0
Next game: #9 Auburn Tigers (3-0)

So, the Link that got 56.65% against his strongest opponent who actually may have overperformed significantly was a weak Link?
---
"Fargus' pirate crew makes women smile and villains revile!" ~ Cap'n Fargus, Fire Emblem

Just curious, with Megaman getting beaten this badly, what percentage would Tanner be expected to get on Link, I'd find it funny if it was less than 1% lol.
---
"The N-Gage is a taco, the PSP is a hot pocket."- Simba Jones.

It looks like this could be Link's match with the highest vote totals, if it is able to continue catching up to Link vs. Yoshi. It is currently ahead of Link vs. Crono by a fair margin...
---
M-me? Queen ***** of the Universe?
This is the happiest day of my life. ~ smitelf

It makes more sense for Link to always be weak and to of just gained strength after E32004 then anything else.

Just curious, with Megaman getting beaten this badly, what percentage would Tanner be expected to get on Link, I'd find it funny if it was less than 1% lol.

Oh man, I had forgotten about that.

Right now, Tanner would be expected to get 3.35% on Link. And this is why nominations suck.
---
"Fargus' pirate crew makes women smile and villains revile!" ~ Cap'n Fargus, Fire Emblem

this match makes me hate Link more than I hate Cloud.
I never thought I would actually root FOR Cloud....
---
Winner of Leebo's save the users tournament.
Chrono Cross points: 160

It makes more sense for Link to always be weak and to of just gained strength after E32004 then anything else.

Link, weak? Do you mean relative to what he appears to be now? Because I can't ever imagine calling Link weak.
---
M-me? Queen ***** of the Universe?
This is the happiest day of my life. ~ smitelf

2002 Link was... weak? I don't know about anyone else, but I feel this sudden urge to go way the new Zelda trailer about a dozen times.

*runs off to watch*
---
/The Hunter - Log 10.023.7/
A considerable bounty will go to the unit who delivers Aran to Command. Dead or alive, it matters not.

Speaking of the Zelda trailer, can someone link me to it(I'm too lazy to look for it <_<)
---
Contest Winner: Link

I can't wait to next year. Zelda X Link will dismantle everyone.
---
SC2k4 Winner: Link
Status: 58/64 Next Pick: Link

The version of the trailer with the E3 music (with the voices and much more dramatic music) was kickass. =)

---
M-me? Queen ***** of the Universe?
This is the happiest day of my life. ~ smitelf

Zelda XI Link. The Minnish Cap comes out before the GCN Zelda.
---
"Fargus' pirate crew makes women smile and villains revile!" ~ Cap'n Fargus, Fire Emblem

priq, you can go to IGN or GameSpot for a video.

Or I could send it to you over AIM...
---
M-me? Queen ***** of the Universe?
This is the happiest day of my life. ~ smitelf

Who said Mario fell?

Mario vs. Crono
---
DEFENCE, DEFENCE
"Alas, History is nothing but a lie agreed upon" - Napoleon Bonaparte.

I meant weak in a relative sense. Yeah, next year going to be nasty if Link isnt retired.

http://www.gametrailers.com/gt_fanmovies/ft_zelda01.html
---
/The Hunter - Log 10.023.7/
A considerable bounty will go to the unit who delivers Aran to Command. Dead or alive, it matters not.

Mario didn't fall. Crono rised.

---
I am Lucid Faia's alternate account.
Number Of Days I Haven't Had To Deal With An Idiot: 0

For those who asked for me to repost my 2003 analysis, here it is:

http://boards.gamefaqs.com/gfaqs/genmessage.php?board=23044&topic=16622945&page=0

I read through it again as I was posting it, and honestly, it isn't all that good. But hey, it was the first time I ever did something along those lines. After a couple of college writing classes, I've gotten a lot better =)

Either way, it's there. Hopefully creative archives it. He hasn;t been around at all lately, and the last match pic he archived was Cloud/Squall.
---
Winner of the Spring 2004 'Best. Game. Ever.' Contest
++SCC GOD++ *Married to smitelf on 5/21/04*

For those who asked for me to repost my 2003 analysis, here it is:

Thank you. =)
---
M-me? Queen ***** of the Universe?
This is the happiest day of my life. ~ smitelf

What does everyone think we'll see in the match pic tomorrow? I think we'll either get FFVII Cloud coming down with the final strike of Omnislash or KH Cloud doing his basic charging attack on Super Metroid Samus, and SSBM Samus blasting FFT Cloud.
---
Tennessee Volunteers: #8, 3-0
Next game: #9 Auburn Tigers (3-0)

I still think 2k3 Link was the exceptions. There were a lot of factors going on. I made a comment that no one addressed in an earlier topic. If it's true that Crono actually had 3000 cheat votes, then he increased SIGNIFICANTLY between 2k2 and 2k3. Yes 3000 votes is a significant gap with the low 2k2 vote totals. So can someone answer this....

If KHF is the reason why Squall, Cloud, and Sephiroth increased in 2k2, then why did Crono increase in 2k3?
---
"There are only 10 kinds of people in this world, those that read binary and those that don't."

Meh, I want Samus to have an advantage in this match....

How about KH Cloud about to slash JUSTIN BAILEY Samus and MP or SSBM Samus firing a missile at Block Cloud (FF7 field).
---
"There are only 10 kinds of people in this world, those that read binary and those that don't."

^Actually how about Block Cloud in vegetable state in his wheel chair with Mako poisoning....
---
"There are only 10 kinds of people in this world, those that read binary and those that don't."

I think the reason that Crono rised was because how well he did in the contests. If you asked me if we never had a character contest before CT would've lost to LttP and maybe FFVI
---
Summer 2004 Contest 117/128 Link vs. Mega Man

That ALttP match was just crazy. I had hope throughout that entire match that ALttP would be able to pull through.
---
/The Hunter - Log 10.023.7/
A considerable bounty will go to the unit who delivers Aran to Command. Dead or alive, it matters not.

Hmm... just thought of something, the Samus losing to Cloud pic will probably have a Samus out of her suit pic.

I wonder how the casuals who doesn't know Samus' gender will react to that revelation?

"Dude! I've been playing as a chick!? OMGWTFBBQ!!!"

---
Also, the women all have beards. Either that, or there are no dwarven women. Yeah, I could see that. This is Suikoden after all. -http://videogamerecaps.com

true, but I think they would know when she dies that she was a girl
---
Summer 2004 Contest 117/128 Link vs. Mega Man

Just for kicks, based on current results, this would be how the Noble Nine stands, based on Samus's estimate against Cloud tomorrow. The first number is Link's, the second number is Cloud's.

Link- 50, 52.95
Cloud- 47.05, 50
Sephiroth- 41.40, 44
Samus- 37.42, 39.76
Crono- 37.18, 39.51
Mario- 34.77, 36.95
Mega Man- 32.00, 34.00
Sonic- 31.8, 33.79
Snake- 27.4, 29.11

Look how close Crono and Samus are. That's kinda surprising.
---
Tennessee Volunteers: #8, 3-0
Next game: #9 Auburn Tigers (3-0)

Assuming Mega Man ends with 32%, the standings will look something like this.

Link 50.00%
Crono 37.18%
Mario 34.77%
Mega Man 32.00%
Zero 28.15%
Solid Snake 27.40%
Frog 26.64%
Master Chief 26.64%
Liquid Snake 26.61%
Tidus 22.54%
Magus 22.47%
Shadow 22.18%
Knuckles 22.17%
Tommy 21.49%
Bowser 20.41%
Kefka 18.86%
Yoshi 18.26%
Luigi 16.62%
Conker 16.37%
Max Payne 16.35%
Protoman 15.92%
Crash Bandicoot 15.60%
CATS 12.17%
Ganondorf 12.10%
JC Denton 11.45%
Earthworm Jim 10.89%
Pac-Man 10.73%
Alucard 10.37%
Ryo 8.62%
Luca Blight 8.52%
Guybrush 6.94%
Tanner 3.12%
---
SC2K4 Score: 120/128
Today's Pick: Link

Looks like Tidus didn't do that bad, he's still ahead of half of the contestants.

---
September 29th, 2004: Once again, destiny(Cloud) has destroyed fate(Sephiroth).

He's also ahead of Magus, heh heh.
---
Tennessee Volunteers: #8, 3-0
Next game: #9 Auburn Tigers (3-0)

Ganondorf losing to Max Payne looks so wrong...

---
Also, the women all have beards. Either that, or there are no dwarven women. Yeah, I could see that. This is Suikoden after all. -http://videogamerecaps.com

Erm.. Can somebody start setting the poll to load on Firefox? I have to get off for a bit. =/
---
M-me? Queen ***** of the Universe?
This is the happiest day of my life. ~ smitelf

Ganondorf losing to Crash Bandicoot looks even worse.
---
SC2K4 Score: 120/128
Today's Pick: Link

Alucard losing to Pac-Man and JC Denton is pretty bad, too.
---
Tennessee Volunteers: #8, 3-0
Next game: #9 Auburn Tigers (3-0)

I can't wait for Cloud vs. Samus...

---
September 29th, 2004: Once again, destiny(Cloud) has destroyed fate(Sephiroth).

Ulti, your analysis was great, but what the hell, it goes from Mario/Shadow to Ryu/Dante. And the prediction % for Link/Cloud was just

Prediction Percentage - 13.37%

ECKS. FRICKIN'. DEE.

Tidus 22.54%
Magus 22.47%

I hate you all.
---
BtT: 3:48.52 | HRC: 51,246.1 ft OV aaaargh
I keep getting sig'd for the weirdest things lately - StW

I'd just like to take a look at Mega's division. The number in parenthesis is how much they have fallen/risen since 2003, and the last thing is who we could compare them too in 2003.

Mega Man............32.00% - (-5.35%) - Between Aeris and Squall
Zero..............28.15% - (-4.06%) - Between Zelda and Auron
Solid Snake...........27.40% - (-7.34%) - Between Auron and Dante
Frog....................26.64% - Right around Alucard
Master Chief.............26.64% - (+0.49) - Right around Alucard
Liquid Snake...........26.61% - Right around Alucard
Tidus................22.54% - (-10.60%) - Between Sam and KOS-MOS
Shadow................22.18% - (-11.61%) - Between Sam and KOS-MOS
Knuckles.............22.17% - (-3.45%) - Between KOS-MOS and Lara
Tommy...............21.49% - (-3.27%) - Between Ramza and Sora
Kefka.............18.86% - (+3.36) - Between Bomberman and Vyse
Max Payne...........16.35% - (-0.33%) - Between Max Payne and Kefka
Protoman.............15.92% - Between Max Payne and Kefka
Crash Bandicoot...............15.60% - (-1.29%) - Right above Kefka
Earthworm Jim................10.89% - Between Raiden and Pikachu
Tanner...............3.12% - Heh...

This division got REVERSE WDF'D...
---
Sephiroth vs. Sly - http://www.stripcreator.com/comics/Moltar
Link vs. Mega Man - Bracket: Link - Vote: Link (124/128)

Given that analysis by Moltar, I don't know how anyone can deny that Link has gotten stronger this year.
---
"Fargus' pirate crew makes women smile and villains revile!" ~ Cap'n Fargus, Fire Emblem

You mean because only two characters increased. Master Cheif who had every reason to increase and Kefka which uh... can someone explained Kefka to me?

Everybody decreased except for Kefka, who was hit by SFF last year against Crono, and MC, whose gain was pretty negligible.
---
"Fargus' pirate crew makes women smile and villains revile!" ~ Cap'n Fargus, Fire Emblem

I have a feeling that Sora going to end up taking that ninth spot.

Well DUH @ Link being stronger than last year

My issue is with Link being said to have stayed the same last year when I believe that he decreased. I don't see one trailer and a collector's edition of games people are already familiar with making that drastic of a jump for Link. If Link actually decreased in 2k3, then that lessens the Square/KH/voter increase factor. (Until someone can give me a vaild reason on why Crono increased last year in addition to Cloud/Seph/Squall, I will believe that Square characters benefitted as a whole in proportion to their popularity....) Plus adding in the Planet Gamecube fiasco doing a number of Cloud's numbers explaining another part of Cloud's increase.... Ahhh, there are so many factors! I'm gonna get this down sooner or later....
---
"There are only 10 kinds of people in this world, those that read binary and those that don't."

It looked obvious before, but it's pretty undeniable after seeing that.
---
/The Hunter - Log 10.023.7/
A considerable bounty will go to the unit who delivers Aran to Command. Dead or alive, it matters not.

I think a 2% to 4% increase for Link against his old self would be about right.

---
September 29th, 2004: Once again, destiny(Cloud) has destroyed fate(Sephiroth).

Actually, from what I can tell, Ryu will take the 9th spot, barely ahead of Zero.
---
Tennessee Volunteers: #8, 3-0
Next game: #9 Auburn Tigers (3-0)

Just one trailer... You fail to mention that it perhaps the biggest trailer in gaming history...

That's what I thought during my trip from university as well. This has all the makings of a WDF #2, and suddenly it makes so many possible matches so much more unpredictable.
---
SC2K4 Status - Points: 120/128 - Matches: 56/60 - Rank: 00433/33221 - Final 4: LINK, Megaman, CLOUD, Samus

Leonhart, you are right. I forgot Ryu was ahead of Sora.

And Link approaches 68%. :-)


---
Fourth topic of the [This message was deleted by a GameFAQs moderator] petition. http://boards.gamefaqs.com/gfaqs/genmessage.php?board=7&topic=16397550 (1213 Signs!)

My issue is with Link being said to have stayed the same last year when I believe that he decreased.

The absolute best case you could make is he decreased 0.71% instead of Crono increasing.
---
/The Hunter - Log 10.023.7/
A considerable bounty will go to the unit who delivers Aran to Command. Dead or alive, it matters not.

Link has been "approaching" 68% for several hours now.
---
Tennessee Volunteers: #8, 3-0
Next game: #9 Auburn Tigers (3-0)

Just one trailer... You fail to mention that it perhaps the biggest trailer in gaming history...

Hearing how loud that crowd got at E3 was enough to bring a smile to anyone's face. =)
---
/The Hunter - Log 10.023.7/
A considerable bounty will go to the unit who delivers Aran to Command. Dead or alive, it matters not.

[This message was deleted at the request of the original poster]

You just answered your own question, Tai. Use common sense.
---
Tennessee Volunteers: #8, 3-0
Next game: #9 Auburn Tigers (3-0)

How loud exactly was it, HM?

And for all intents and purposes, I don't see why Link 2002 wouldn't = Link 2003. After all, he's almost in the middle of the list of increases and decreases.
---
SC2K4 Status - Points: 120/128 - Matches: 56/60 - Rank: 00433/33221 - Final 4: LINK, Megaman, CLOUD, Samus

Tai considering Sora beat one of them, I think I mean the SFII Ryu.

[This message was deleted at the request of the original poster]

Many "OH MY GOD!!!", "WOOHOO!!!!!", "WHO'S THE MAN?!", and then just intense clapping. It took everyone a while to realize what exactly they were seeing too. It was about the part where Link was riding across Hyrule Field where people finally got just what they were watching. I went insane upon seeing it, just because of how the press-conference ended.

They just wrapped up talking about the Nintendo DS and Reggie had said: "I hope you've all enjoyed your stay, but before you leave I'd like you to take one more step into the world of Nintendo GameCube."

So, awesome.
---
/The Hunter - Log 10.023.7/
A considerable bounty will go to the unit who delivers Aran to Command. Dead or alive, it matters not.

It would of been a bigger surprise for me if I wasn't a reg at the IGN Boards too. Matt ruined it... :(

You guys are forgetting the basis of SFF. Sure the voters can like both characters, but what's important is that that shared fanbase will OVERWHELMINGLY prefer one character. Heroic Mario should be a fine example that SFF doesn't favor Link that much.
---
SC2K4 ~ 57/59 ~ 115/120
So close yet so far.

Matt gave a tiny hint, I remember commenting on it the night before. =p

A picture of Link from SCII with some wording, heh.
---
/The Hunter - Log 10.023.7/
A considerable bounty will go to the unit who delivers Aran to Command. Dead or alive, it matters not.

No it was a picture of SW2000 Zelda. And it said Hot or Not. Matt had already given clues he knew a big surprise of a game that would rank up with RE4 and MP2 on his most wanted list.

Actually, that was it. A picture of Link from SW, I knew it had something to with "Hot" as well, but like I said it was a hint.
---
/The Hunter - Log 10.023.7/
A considerable bounty will go to the unit who delivers Aran to Command. Dead or alive, it matters not.

Reggie is Awsome.

---
SC2K4 ~ 57/59 ~ 115/120
So close yet so far.

...And Mario is now ranked quite a bit higher than Mega Man, even though Mega Man was supposed to be stronger than last year. What the heck?

Oh, and if Link with finishes with 68%, Link is expected to beat Knuckles with 77.83%. Now, if the Knuckles/Sonic proportion is the same as last year, Link would beat Sonic with...70.75%. Yes, you heard me correctly.

In other words, Cloud will theoretically need to win with against Samus with 65.58% against Samus. So...if Cloud gets 64-67% on Samus, would could assume a 50/50 final.

Blame it on over-and-under-performances all you want. I just say that the voters behave quite a bit differently this year. Barring SFF stuff, I'm sure this year's extrapolationed standings will help predict for next year better than '02 or '03 would.

Also, anyone who thinks Link decreased more than 1% from 2002 to 2003 has no idea what they're talking about. If anything, Link INCREASED from '02 to '03. Overall, the extrapolated values of the characters in 2003 actually decreased from 2002 (though they mostly appeared systematic from the '02 West). Of course, I believe in the WDF and that Link stayed about the same.

---
"Ah, a party! We haven't had one of those. It could be fun! So...what is a party?"
"Well, you drink punch and eat CAKE! ...I think."

What is exactly is the West Division Factor? How did it happen, and why did it happen?
---
Vote in my Pseudo SpC2K5 bracket: http://boards.gamefaqs.com/gfaqs/genmessage.php?board=8&topic=16613027
Feat: LttP, SoTN, Final Fantasy 8, Super Metroid

At least Mega Man is refusing to drop below 32%. But, doubling Mega Man...wow...
---
"Fargus' pirate crew makes women smile and villains revile!" ~ Cap'n Fargus, Fire Emblem

West Division Factor (WDF) is used to explain the massive drop in 2k3 from almost every character from the West Division in 2k2. The explanation, which sucks, is that Sephiroth, the West Division champ, overperformed against Link for whatever reason, artificially raising everybody in the West Division's extrapolated rankings. The math looks like this:

Char. Name : Losing % : Link % : 2k3 XS : Least Square Difference
Sephiroth : 38.57 : 38.57
Samus : 47.36 : 36.53 : 36.72 : 0.03
Sonic : 49.98 : 36.52 : 33.79 : 7.45
Ken : 34.69 : 25.35 : 21.01 : 18.81
Ryu : 42.15 : 30.80 : 30.69 : 0.01
CATS : 19.21 : 11.83 : 13.52 : 2.85
Tidus : 41.17 : 30.07 : 34.25 : 17.48
Mega : 49.49 : 38.18 : 38.60 : 0.18
Crash : 18.48 : 14.26 : 17.46 : 10.27

Sum of the LSD's: 57.07

Basically, the table says that if Seph would have gotten 38.57% against Link, the sum of the differences between the characters in the West Division's 2k2 and 2k3 XS values are a minimum. Also note that the value is dead on for Samus, Ryu, and Mega Man's 2k3 XS value.
---
"Fargus' pirate crew makes women smile and villains revile!" ~ Cap'n Fargus, Fire Emblem

No explanation on WHY it happened, but it's theorized that Sephiroth overperformed greatly against Link in 2002, overrating the entire West Division. Reasons for that theory is that nearly every character in that 2002 divisision dropped in 2003.

Obviously there are probably other matches with messed up results like that (i.e. Mega Man vs. Tidus, perhaps), but Sephiroth vs. Link matters a lot, as it affects an entire division.

The only other theory that I think could possibly work to take care of that would be assuming Mario suffered drastic SFF against Link, and that Link grew drastically from 2002 to 2003. I find it funny that there are people who think Mario suffered SFF AND think Link decreased from '02 to '03. Ugh.

---
"Ah, a party! We haven't had one of those. It could be fun! So...what is a party?"
"Well, you drink punch and eat CAKE! ...I think."

Basically, the table says that if Seph would have gotten 38.57% against Link, the sum of the square of the differences between the characters in the West Division's 2k2 and 2k3 XS values are a minimum. Also note that the value is dead on for Samus, Ryu, and Mega Man's 2k3 XS value.

Sorry about that.
---
"Fargus' pirate crew makes women smile and villains revile!" ~ Cap'n Fargus, Fire Emblem

WDF is a mathematical anomaly that caused pretty much all the 2002 West characters, to the notable exceptions of Tidus and Sephiroth (KH anyone?), to decrease massively for no good reason. Even Samus lost ground despite getting her first games in 8 years, one of which was one of the great hits of this generation.

We could be seeing the same thing today if Link fails to destroy Cloud.
---
SC2K4 Status - Points: 120/128 - Matches: 56/60 - Rank: 00433/33221 - Final 4: LINK, Megaman, CLOUD, Samus

first:
MGS3 is nowhere near the hype of Halo 2 or Zelda X. Xbox and GCN owners and even those without the consoles are drooling over the games. They have godlike levels of hype. MGS3 is nowhere near that. But neither is MP2: Echos IMO.

Just to comment on Halo 2 hype, according to EGM magazine for...november I believe, or the "november" issue anyways, halo itself rose back to the number eight spot.

Next: SFF, in this match? Sorry, I really don't agree with that, do I have a reason? No, but that just isn't...I don't know right? I can't recall anyone, EVER, saying there would be link/mega sff, and slowflake said it best with mario/link sff. why would it affect megaman more?

Also, don't count cloud out until after Samus, I mean we haven't seen him yet, but I do feel somewhat better, or at least not worse, with having Link as my winner.
---
Today's Survivor topic can be found here, Please vote : )http://boards.gamefaqs.com/gfaqs/genmessage.php?board=8&topic=16070956

I should've gotten a clue with the PotD before the nominations that gave Link as outright favorite for the championship despite Cloud being the defending champion and FF7 winning the spring contest three weeks earlier. All I could think back then was, "What are they thinking?"

Now it's "What was I thinking?".
---
SC2K4 Status - Points: 120/128 - Matches: 56/60 - Rank: 00433/33221 - Final 4: LINK, Megaman, CLOUD, Samus

Yeah, Link was the outright favorite by a wider margin last year, too. That doesn't mean too much. It's just who people think will win, not who they want to win.
---
Tennessee Volunteers: #8, 3-0
Next game: #9 Auburn Tigers (3-0)

I stated many times that it certainly said something about Link heading into this contest, but most commented on how Sephiroth was taking away from Cloud's votes or something. <<

Heh. It'd probably be good to look at that poll next year, I know I will...
---
/The Hunter - Log 10.023.7/
A considerable bounty will go to the unit who delivers Aran to Command. Dead or alive, it matters not.

All the more frightening. If people genuinely thought Link was going to take it despite Cloud and FF7 winning the previous two contests...
---
SC2K4 Status - Points: 120/128 - Matches: 56/60 - Rank: 00433/33221 - Final 4: LINK, Megaman, CLOUD, Samus

Again, it still says nothing about who people plan to vote for.
---
Tennessee Volunteers: #8, 3-0
Next game: #9 Auburn Tigers (3-0)

Indeed. That poll was taken not to long after FF7 won, combined with Cloud winning last year. Must've been E3... ;)
---
/The Hunter - Log 10.023.7/
A considerable bounty will go to the unit who delivers Aran to Command. Dead or alive, it matters not.

*watches Zelda XI trailer again*
---
"Fargus' pirate crew makes women smile and villains revile!" ~ Cap'n Fargus, Fire Emblem

Speaking of the new Zelda, Cube-Europe reported that, from inside sources, that they could say with confidence that the Japan release date would be May 22nd at the latest. Merely a rumor for now, but quite interesting...
---
/The Hunter - Log 10.023.7/
A considerable bounty will go to the unit who delivers Aran to Command. Dead or alive, it matters not.

Seriously how much did Wind Waker sell? I expect almost twice for Zelda XI. I know about 10 people who are just buying Gamecubes for Zelda XI and Resident Evil 4.

The Wind Waker sold 3.1 million copies.
---
/The Hunter - Log 10.023.7/
A considerable bounty will go to the unit who delivers Aran to Command. Dead or alive, it matters not.

20XX Division Factor anyone?
---
Vote in my Pseudo SpC2K5 bracket: http://boards.gamefaqs.com/gfaqs/genmessage.php?board=8&topic=16613027
Feat: LttP, SoTN, Final Fantasy 8, Super Metroid

I meant in the US...

1.49 million copies.
---
/The Hunter - Log 10.023.7/
A considerable bounty will go to the unit who delivers Aran to Command. Dead or alive, it matters not.

It needs to sell more than twice as much as WW to make a nice splash in the market IMO. IIRC OoT sold 7.5 million copies give or take a few hundred thousand. The new Zelda has to sell more, becoming the highest selling Zelda game to be a success within the series.

Personally I think if you ommit the sailing WW played very well but it didn't sell well. This one has to be a pure system seller.
---
"The N-Gage is a taco, the PSP is a hot pocket."- Simba Jones.

I wish I had the verbal skill of ChichiriMuyo, but this is in essence his take on Zelda X and what it needs to boost Link:

I has to sell over 8 million copies. It must sell the Gamecube like no game before. In essence, it must become the next Ocarina of Time, eclipsing even Ocarina of Time in terms of hype and gameplay. The detail of the game must bring back fans lost on before the Wind Waker as well as Ocarina of Time. It must appeal to old school as well as newer fans. It must change the way that people perceive and play games, just as its predecessor did. It must become the dominant game of the generation and live up to hype in every way.
---
SC2K4 ~ 58/60 ~ 123/128
So close yet so far.

The new Zelda has to sell more, becoming the highest selling Zelda game to be a success within the series.

Since when does a game have to sell more than 7.6 million copies in order to become a success? I'd definitely bank on it selling far more than TWW however.
---
/The Hunter - Log 10.023.7/
A considerable bounty will go to the unit who delivers Aran to Command. Dead or alive, it matters not.

It wont sell 7.5 and it doest need too. Only two games for one system have sold that much this generation and they both start with Grand Theft and end with Auto.

It sell around 3.5 mil and maybe 6 worldwide

See that's a major boost for Link. If he gets a major boost we'd never see him stop dominating...
---
/The Hunter - Log 10.023.7/
A considerable bounty will go to the unit who delivers Aran to Command. Dead or alive, it matters not.

I guess I speak more on personal idea HM. I think that while WW was a great game, my first GCN game and it sold me the GCN, I feel that is was not the best game in the series and the system and the actual game itself has to do with it. To be a success I feel it needs to sell more than OoT and virtually sell the cube to more people than OoT (for the N64) or even LttP(for the SNES *though it did have other quality titles*) did.
---
"The N-Gage is a taco, the PSP is a hot pocket."- Simba Jones.

That's what Chichiri said he needed to even put him above Cloud.
---
SC2K4 ~ 58/60 ~ 123/128
So close yet so far.

Chichiri is a little crazy if he thinks that what Link would need to make up 2%. In fact, he made that up and then some without the game.
---
/The Hunter - Log 10.023.7/
A considerable bounty will go to the unit who delivers Aran to Command. Dead or alive, it matters not.

Link made that up with a freaking 1 minute trailer and a Collector's Edition that lacked LttP. I shudder to think what an OoT like game would do to his opposition.
---
"We ask for your strength...Thee who fear'eth the night and stand 'gainst the darkness." ~ Frog

In other news, I think this safely rules out Samus taking the contest in 2005.
---
SC2K4 ~ 58/60 ~ 123/128
So close yet so far.

At this point in the contest what would Cloud get on this seemingly new and improved Link? Also can Advent Children make up this much, I mean who besides a FF7 fan will buy it. Not many I think, but the same could be said about Zelda 10 so who knows.
---
"The N-Gage is a taco, the PSP is a hot pocket."- Simba Jones.

Chichiri is a little crazy if he thinks that what Link would need to make up 2%. In fact, he made that up and then some without the game.

But he posted that much earlier during the contest.
---
SC2K4 ~ 58/60 ~ 123/128
So close yet so far.

I just dont see AC doing the damage needed especially since by that time there will be hand-on impressions and a whole bunch of footage of the new Zelda.

If this game even comes close to living up to the hype, we wont see a non-Link winner in a long, long time.

Link would be expected to beat Cloud with 53%.
---
Tennessee Volunteers: #8, 3-0
Next game: #9 Auburn Tigers (3-0)

To compare vote totals of Mario/Crono (96500) to Link/Mega Man right now here's what we get:

Link/Mega Man at 19:20:58 = 81770
Mario/Crono at 19:21:05 = 85566

That's about 3796 votes behind a match that almost hit 100,000.
---
/The Hunter - Log 10.023.7/
A considerable bounty will go to the unit who delivers Aran to Command. Dead or alive, it matters not.

Hmm..thanks. Yeah I can assume even with Advent Children Cloud would still lose to Link in 2k5, question is, will Sephiroth do better?
---
"The N-Gage is a taco, the PSP is a hot pocket."- Simba Jones.

But he posted that much earlier during the contest.

I would've called it crazy then if that's what I knew he was talking about. I could have swore he meant something to separate himself from Cloud, not just get above him. The game is going to lock him a win for that year even if it didn't sell as much as 5 million copies.
---
/The Hunter - Log 10.023.7/
A considerable bounty will go to the unit who delivers Aran to Command. Dead or alive, it matters not.

Bump
---
"The N-Gage is a taco, the PSP is a hot pocket."- Simba Jones.

You could have 47 Zelda sequels and 47 offshoots/sequels/prequels/movies/cartoons of FFVII...

One precept remains...no character will ever beat Link or Cloud for the forseeable future except themselves beatin eachother.

They both must be retired after this contest, and Sephy too. They are the top tier of the Nine. The other six can still be matched up in slightly different matches...aka... Mario vs Mega Man, or Sonic vs Crono...not the same tired stuff like Mario vs Crono or Samus vs Sonic.

I would like all 9 of them out to make the bracket a tougher challenge so there are less 'high' scores, but I know that aint too likely on FanFAQs!

---
Steve Illumina: The Elite Satirist of GameFAQ's
SC2K4: 135/144 MK Deception: Oct 5!

Umm guys, maybe Mario increased as well as Crono.

Samus and Link have obviously increased, why couldn't Mario increase as well?
---
"I'm waaaa-aaaiting."--Sonic the Hedgehog

I'm gonna start making a bracket without Clinkeroth. If anyone has any suggestions I'm willing to listen. It will will probably be done tonight or tomorrow night.
---
Cloud786: What does wangsterbate mean?
Lawn Flamingo Lamp: It's from Pokemon.

Umm guys, maybe Mario increased as well as Crono.

Mario should no signs of an increase...I could see decrease, but increase?
---
Sephiroth vs. Sly - http://www.stripcreator.com/comics/Moltar
Link vs. Mega Man - Bracket: Link - Vote: Link (124/128)

I can't even see a decrease for Mario.
---
/The Hunter - Log 10.023.7/
A considerable bounty will go to the unit who delivers Aran to Command. Dead or alive, it matters not.

Before we consider taking out Clinkeroth, let's consider what happens if we change the seeding around.

Let's look at it from an Elite 8 and on standpoint, because no 1 seed should be challenged by an 16, 8, or 4.

(1) Link
(2) Noble Nine
---Bad match
(1) Seph
(2) Noble Nine
---Bad match
(1) Cloud
(2) Noble Nine
---Bad match
(1) Noble Nine
(2) Noble Nine
---Good match

(1) Link
(1) Seph
---Good match
(1) Cloud
(1) Noble Nine
---Bad match

(1) Link
(1) Cloud
---Good match.

If we seed that way, we get 3 good matches and 4 bad matches. Surely there's a better way.

(1) Link
(2) Cloud
---Good match
(1) Sephiroth
(2) Samus (post Echoes and Hunters)
---Good match?
(1) Noble Nine
(2) Noble Nine
---Good match
(1) Noble Nine
(2) Noble Nine
---Good match

(1) Cloud/Link
(1) Samus/Seph
---Good match?
(1) Noble Nine
(2) Noble Nine
---Good match

(1) Clink
(1) Noble Nine
---Bad Match

Under this, we get 4 good matches, 2 questionables, and 1 bad match. All we need to do is play with the seeding a bit and we can have an exciting Elite 8 and Final 4.
---
"We ask for your strength...Thee who fear'eth the night and stand 'gainst the darkness." ~ Frog

(1) Link
(2) Cloud
---Good match
(1) Sephiroth
(2) Samus (post Echoes and Hunters)
---Good match?
(1) Noble Nine
(2) Noble Nine
---Good match
(1) Noble Nine
(2) Noble Nine
---Good match

Excellent.
---
/The Hunter - Log 10.023.7/
A considerable bounty will go to the unit who delivers Aran to Command. Dead or alive, it matters not.

I'm going to change my bracket to reflect that once the XS from this year come out and I can get a decent grasp on what inter Noble Nine matches would be the least predictable. My point is that you don't need to retire Clinkeroth to make a good Elite 8/Final 4, even if the championship match suffers.
---
"We ask for your strength...Thee who fear'eth the night and stand 'gainst the darkness." ~ Frog

So far for my Clinkeroth-less bracket I have

1- Mario vs. 2 - Sonic
1- Samus vs. 2- Magus (?)
1- Crono vs. 2 - Solid Snake/ 3 - Aeris
1- Mega Man vs. ?????

Who should go in the last #2 spot? I'm leaning towards Zero right now, but then should I move Magus/Zero? I'm trying to avoid all SFF.
---
Cloud786: What does wangsterbate mean?
Lawn Flamingo Lamp: It's from Pokemon.

there's no Noble 9 Zero has beat Solid Snake and it wasn't a little like Magus did to Sonic
---
Summer 2004 Contest 117/128 Link vs. Mega Man

HM, when do you want to follow through with the bet, now or after Link vs MegaMan is done?

Doesn't matter to me.
---
/The Hunter - Log 10.023.7/
A considerable bounty will go to the unit who delivers Aran to Command. Dead or alive, it matters not.

Who should go in the last #2 spot? I'm leaning towards Zero right now, but then should I move Magus/Zero? I'm trying to avoid all SFF.

For 2K5? Master Chief seems a good fit, or maybe SF Ryu.
---
Edge Eblan faces his greatest challenge to date at www.rpgdl.com - getting a piece of Emerald WEAPON!

To do another quick comparison in the vote totals of Mario/Crono and Link/Mega Man we get this:

Link/Mega Man at 21:06:53 = 88183
Mario/Crono at 21:06:53 = 91447

The last check had them at a 3796 vote difference; they are now at a 3264. This should end around 93000 votes when everything is said and done. We still wait for that 100,000 vote match.
---
/The Hunter - Log 10.023.7/
A considerable bounty will go to the unit who delivers Aran to Command. Dead or alive, it matters not.

OK, 1s vs. 2s are set. They will be

1- Mario vs. 2- Sonic
1- Samus vs. 2- Solid Snake.
1- Crono vs. 2 - Zero
1- Mega Man vs. 2- Master Chief.

Now 3s/6s
3- Ryu (SF) vs. 6- Bowser
3- Magus vs. 6 - Squall (SFF?)
3- Aeris vs. 6- ??????
3- ???? vs. 6- Tidus

Again, trying to avoid SFF, and correct seeding isn't nearly as important as making good matchups.
---
Cloud786: What does wangsterbate mean?
Lawn Flamingo Lamp: It's from Pokemon.

Why didn't Ganondorf get the same boost as Link? If the bulk of Ganondorf's popularity is "leeched" off of Link, shouldn't he have gone up too? He did about 3% worse than expected against Alucard. Perhaps Alucard also went up substantially, impossible to say for certain since Ganondorf got SFF'd by Link. Zelda isn't present so went can't analyze her strength either.
---
"Those whose memories fade seek to carve them in their hearts..."
"All dreams are but another reality. Never forget..."

Well, everybody from Alucard's half division overperformed, so maybe there was something fishy there last year, and not a Gdorf decrease.
---
"We ask for your strength...Thee who fear'eth the night and stand 'gainst the darkness." ~ Frog

3- Aeris vs. 6- Knuckles
3- Dante vs. 6- Tidus

Not the best seeding in the world, but passable matches, I'd say.
---
Edge Eblan faces his greatest challenge to date at www.rpgdl.com - getting a piece of Emerald WEAPON!

I put Ganondorf against Aeris. I'm thinking about Dante as a #4 right now.
---
Cloud786: What does wangsterbate mean?
Lawn Flamingo Lamp: It's from Pokemon.

because no 1 seed should be challenged by an 16

Y halo there starcraft?
---
BtT: 3:48.46 | HRC: 51,246.1 ft OV aaaargh
I keep getting sig'd for the weirdest things lately - StW

3s vs. 6s are set

3- Ryu (SF) vs. 6 - Bowser
3- Magus vs. 6- Squall
3- Aeris vs. 6- Ganondorf
3- Tidus vs. 6- Liquid Snake

On to 4s vs. 5s

4- Frog vs. 5 Kirby (Kirby vs. 12- Vincent Valentine)
4- Auron vs. 5 ?????
4- Sora vs. 5- Shadow the Hedgehog
4- Dante vs 5- Alucard (I know he's higherthan G-Dorf, but its for the best match)
---
Cloud786: What does wangsterbate mean?
Lawn Flamingo Lamp: It's from Pokemon.

because no 1 [legitimate] seed should be challenged by an 16
---
"We ask for your strength...Thee who fear'eth the night and stand 'gainst the darkness." ~ Frog

Switch Kirby and Alucard. Make Yoshi the other 5.
---
BtT: 3:48.46 | HRC: 51,246.1 ft OV aaaargh
I keep getting sig'd for the weirdest things lately - StW

I'm looking forward to see the next match picture.
---
Crypptic completely owned me and showed me the light. Solid Snake is indeed the Best. Character. Ever.

I'll switch Kirby and Alucard, but I have Yoshi set for an 8/9 against Knuckles that I don't want to change.
---
Cloud786: What does wangsterbate mean?
Lawn Flamingo Lamp: It's from Pokemon.

But then you are seriously underrating Yoshi...

I know that, but still, its set up for the best match possible.

On another note, would Vivi/Auron have SFF? Because I'm considering Vivi for the last 5 seed
---
Cloud786: What does wangsterbate mean?
Lawn Flamingo Lamp: It's from Pokemon.

Well if you aren't giving Yoshi that spot... Zelda, maybe?

I am going to make a bracket without any of the Noble Nine...a challenging one too that is full of deserving characters (new ones, returning ones, and snubs from 2003) and appropriate levels of 'worthy' fodder. Look for it here tomorrow.

---
Steve Illumina: The Elite Satirist of GameFAQ's
SC2K4: 135/144 MK Deception: Oct 5!

tag

---
then...
*runs around like a madman*

I seriously think a Worst. Character. Ever. Contest would be awesome.

I seriously think a Worst. Character. Ever. Contest would be awesome.

I think it could be cool, but people would probably not pay attention and end up voting for their favorites.
---
"I'm waaaa-aaaiting."--Sonic the Hedgehog

I think it would be terribly boring.
---
Crypptic completely owned me and showed me the light. Solid Snake is indeed the Best. Character. Ever.

Maybe, but come on who wouldn't die seeing a Tingle vs Cait-Sith final?

Tingle would be the Link of the Worst. Character. Ever. contest.

Problem is it would probably get horrible vote totals, and imagine trying to make good match pictures for characters that are supposed to suck.
---
Current score 115/128 :( Next match: Link

Fine shoot down all my ideas.

Why dont you shoot down my HOPES AND DREAMS while you are at!!

Bullies.

Okay, I have the top 6 for each division so far done.

Division 1 (Mushroom Division)

1- Mario
2- Sonic
3- Ryu (SF)
4- Frog
5- Alucard
6- Bowser

Division 2 (Zebes Dvision)
1- Samus
2- Snake
3- Magus
4- Auron
5- Zelda
6- Squall

Division 3 (Epoch Division?)
1- Crono
2- Zero
3- Aeris
4- Sora
5- Shadow the Hedgehog
6- Ganondorf

Division 4 (20XX Division?)
1- Mega Man
2- Master Chief
3- Tidus
4- Dante
5- Kirby
6- Liquid Snake

NEXT! 7s vs. 10s!
7- Viewtiful Joe vs. 10- Serge
7- Ness vs. 10- Protoman
7- Yoshi vs. Knuckles
7- Vivi vs. 10- ????


---
Cloud786: What does wangsterbate mean?
Lawn Flamingo Lamp: It's from Pokemon.

Throwing out the entire "Noble Nine" is a terrible idea, especially considering that Zero, and possibly others, could finish high in the standings.
---
Winner of the Spring 2004 'Best. Game. Ever.' Contest
++SCC GOD++ *Married to smitelf on 5/21/04*

Let's analyze this and see if a non Clinkeroth bracket can hold it's own with a well designed Clinkeroth inclusive bracket, looking at the Elite 8 and on:

1- Mario
2- Sonic
---Good match
1- Samus
2- Snake
---Bad match
1- Crono
2- Zero
---Bad match
1- Mega Man
2- Master Chief
---Bad match

1- Mario
1- Samus
---Good match
1- Crono
1- Mega Man
---Good match

Championship
---Good match

So, let's see here. 4 good matches and 3 bad matches. And I was being generous with Mario/Samus and Mario/Sonic. What would an ideal Clinkeroth bracket have? 5/6 good matches and 1/2 bad matches. So what does retiring Clinkeroth solve, exactly?
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"We ask for your strength...Thee who fear'eth the night and stand 'gainst the darkness." ~ Frog

http://gamefaqs.com/shared/sum04b62.php

Samus with the picture advantage in both? Heh.
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Crypptic completely owned me and showed me the light. Solid Snake is indeed the Best. Character. Ever.

1- Mario
2- Sonic
---Good match
1- Samus
2- Snake
---Bad match
1- Crono
2- Zero
---Bad match
1- Mega Man
2- Master Chief
---Bad match

1- Mario
1- Samus
---Good match
1- Crono
1- Mega Man
---Good match

Championship
---Good match

Okay. Assume we switch Snake and Crono. Would Snake/Zero and Samus Crono make better Elite 8 Matches, leading to Mario/Samus and Mega Man/(Snake/Zero) or Mario/(Snake/Zero) and Samus/Mega Man in the final four?
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Cloud786: What does wangsterbate mean?
Lawn Flamingo Lamp: It's from Pokemon.

Protoman does not deserve a 10 seed by any means. Leon and Kerrigan would be good 10 seeds.

http://gamefaqs.com/shared/sum04b62.php

Not as good as today's...but meh.

(Cloud winning) Cloud looks ugly in that pic, while Samus...is kinda suitless

(Samus winning) Nice Samus pic there and Cloud...is meh. I guess Samus does have the advantage in both, but it still isn't as good as todays.
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Sephiroth vs. Sly - http://www.stripcreator.com/comics/Moltar
Link vs. Mega Man - Bracket: Link - Vote: Link (124/128)

1- Mario
2- Sonic
---Good match
1- Samus
2- Crono
---Bad match
1- Snake
2- Zero
---Good match
1- Mega Man
2- Master Chief
---Bad match

1- Mario
1- Samus
---Good match
1- Snake/Zero
1- Mega Man
---Bad match

Championship
---Good match

Looks like the same number of good/bad matches. I could be wrong on Samus/Crono, but I don't think Samus would have much of a problem there.
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"We ask for your strength...Thee who fear'eth the night and stand 'gainst the darkness." ~ Frog

I have Leon at an 8 and Kerrigan at a 13, although Kerrigan could take the last 10 spot vs. Vivi.
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Cloud786: What does wangsterbate mean?
Lawn Flamingo Lamp: It's from Pokemon.

Protoman might deserve it. He got screwed this year, Zero was the worst opponent for him.
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BtT: 3:48.46 | HRC: 51,246.1 ft OV aaaargh
I keep getting sig'd for the weirdest things lately - StW

Well we finnaly got Samus outside of her suit...

The only pic that was good today was Link standing above Mega Man. MM's advantage pic wasn't that good at all.
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Winner of the Spring 2004 'Best. Game. Ever.' Contest
++SCC GOD++ *Married to smitelf on 5/21/04*

Yeah but we dont know about him. I give him a 12/13 again to see how he could do without SFF.

I wouldn't go so far as to say she has the pic advantage in both. She's completely unrecognizable in one picture. You need to search for the J's before you can even begin to claim TJF.
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Reggie: Kicking ass and taking names since E3 2004.
*creator of Clinkeroth*

And again, I ask you, what does retiring Clinkeroth solve?
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"We ask for your strength...Thee who fear'eth the night and stand 'gainst the darkness." ~ Frog

Come on Samus blasting Vegetable Cloud would of been so funny...

CJayC missed out on the perfect pic opportunity.