Once the 50th topic gets filled, we will have 25000 posts of stat discussion. My kind of group right there =)

Stats websites:

Everything you could ever imagine:
http://www.sc2k4.com

Summer 2002 Contest:
http://solarshadow2002.tripod.com

Summer 2003 Contest:
http://solarshadow-stats.tripod.com/2003/index.html

Spring 2004 Contest: (not currently updating)
http://solarshadow-stats.tripod.com/sp2004/index.html

Stats topics:

Summer 2002 Contest:
http://solarshadow2002.tripod.com/page1.html

Summer 2003 Contest:
http://solarshadow-stats.tripod.com/archive/topic1p1.html
http://www.angelfire.com/games5/sum_contest/Page1.htm (See note)

2003-2004 Off-Season:
http://membres.lycos.fr/shindohikaru/stats1.htm (See note)
Note: Don't use the links in the topic to browse through the pages, change the page number in the URL.

Spring 2004 Pre-Season:
http://sc2k4.com/archive/04SpringPreSeason1.htm
http://sc2k4.com/archive/04SpringPreSeason2.htm
http://sc2k4.com/archive/04SpringPreSeason3.htm

Spring 2004 Contest:
http://sc2k4.com/archive/04SpringStats1.htm
http://sc2k4.com/archive/04SpringStats2.htm
http://sc2k4.com/archive/04SpringStats3.htm
http://sc2k4.com/archive/04SpringStats4.htm
http://sc2k4.com/archive/04SpringStats5.htm
http://sc2k4.com/archive/04SpringStats6.htm
http://sc2k4.com/archive/04SpringStats7.htm
http://sc2k4.com/archive/04SpringStats8.htm

MMXcalibur's Prophet Sites:
http://prophetchallenge.hyperboards2.com/index.cgi
http://www.freewebs.com/mmxcalibur/

!yawA tsoP
---
Winner of the Spring 2004 'Best. Game. Ever.' Contest
*Married to smitelf on 5/21/04* ++SCC GOD++

Tagged for future reference.

Go Tidus!
---
Squall Leonhart's Road to the Summer Championship
2nd Round: (5)Kirby

Nothing is stopping Mega Man.
---
SC2k4 Winner: Mega Man
Ken Masters; the fighting king clothed in blazing fire.

Tagged for future reference..

---
SC2K4 Winner: Cloud Strife
Next Target: Vyse

I'd be very happy if Snake did.

Go Magus!

Oh, nuts...Come back next year with a 3 seed, dammit!
---
Current Pick: Crono; Current Vote: Magus; Points: 33/36
SFF, yo!

Tag.
---
I am the Angel of Death. The day of purification has come.

*tag* Go Clinkeroth!
---
I'm a Czar! Whee!

okay, so #50 isn't full yet, put i'm posting this right away. some of this looks just plain disturbingly wrong.
-_-


Top 10 Biggest Blowouts (difference in percentage)

1) 88.60% - Solid Snake over Tanner
2) 75.80% - (ii) Link over Ganondorf
3) 75.66% - Link over CATS
4) 72.74% - Sephiroth over Sly Cooper
5) 67.08% - Mario over J.C. Denton
6) 65.98% - Bowser over Guybrush Threepwood
7) 65.96% - Megaman over Eartworm Jim
8) 64.78% - Samus Aran over Lara Croft
9) 62.08% - Magus over Luca Blight
10) 61.68% - Sonic the Hedgehog over Terry Bogard

Top 10 Biggest Vote Gaps (difference in votes)

1) 69759 - Solid Snake over Tanner
2) 66655 - (ii) Link over Ganondorf
3) 65362 - Sephiroth over Sly Cooper
4) 62319 - Link over CATS
5) 55813 - Megaman over Earthworm Jim
6) 54178 - Samus Aran over Lara Croft
7) 53705 - Cloud over Duke Milk'em
8) 52337 - Mario over J.C. Denton
9) 49299 - Sonic the Hedgehog over Terry Bogard
10) 49079 - Bowser over Guybrush Threepwood

Top 10 Closest Matches (difference in percentage)

1) 0.04% - Ryu Hayabusa over Jill Valentine
2) 0.10% - Frog over Liquid Snake
3) 1.62% - Tidus over Shadow the Hedgehog
4) 8.96% - (ii) Yoshi over Luigi
5) 9.60% - Tails over Viewtiful Joe
6) 10.16% - Ness over Jak
7) 10.86% - Sam Fisher over Gordon Freeman
8) 12.94% - Vivi over Donkey Kong
9) 14.32% - Ganondorf over Alucard
10) 14.92% - Knuckles over Kefka

Top 10 Smallest Vote Gaps (difference in votes)

1) 27 - Ryu Hayabusa over Jill Valentine
2) 93 - Frog over Liquid Snake
3) 1546 - Tidus over Shadow the Hedgehog
4) 6769 - (ii) Yoshi over Luigi
5) 7397 - Ness over Jak
6) 7673 - Tails over Viewtiful Joe
7) 8163 - Sam Fisher over Gordon Freeman
8) 11105 - Vivi over Donkey Kong
9) 12358 - Knuckles over Kefka
10) 12533 - Ganondorf over Alucard

Top 10 Most Popular Polls (by vote totals)

1) 95122 - Tidus vs. Shadow the Hedgehog
2) 90064 - Auron vs. Scorpion
3) 89848 - Sephiroth vs. Sly Cooper
4) 88953 - Cloud vs. Duke Milk'em
5) 87935 - (ii) Link vs. Ganondorf
6) 87733 - Frog vs. Liquid Snake
7) 87557 - Ganondorf vs. Alucard
8) 85781 - Vivi vs. Donkey Kong
9) 84625 - Megaman vs. Earthworm Jim
10) 84379 - KOS-MOS vs. Ryu

Top 10 Least Popular Polls (by vote totals)

1) 68808 - Vyse vs. Laharl
2) 70413 - Ryu Hayabusa vs. Jill Valentine
3) 70495 - Magus vs. Luca Blight
4) 72863 - Ness vs. Jak
5) 74039 - Dante vs. Ratchet
6) 74383 - Bowser vs. Guybrush Threepwood
7) 75219 - Sam Fisher vs. Gordon Freeman
8) 75307 - Luigi vs. Pac-Man
9) 75533 - (ii) Luigi vs. Yoshi
10) 77021 - Master Cheif vs. Crash Bandicoot

---
That's it. I have reached my threshold of pain. I am going home and I am going to play Megaman, eat snack cakes, and do my woman.

Top 10 Highest Individual Votes

1) 77605 - Sephiroth
2) 77295 - (ii) Link
3) 74251 - Solid Snake
4) 72344 - Link
5) 71329 - Cloud
6) 70219 - Megaman
7) 68889 - Samus Aran
8) 65184 - Mario
9) 64615 - Sonic the Hedgehog
10) 62375 - Crono

Top 10 Lowest Individual Votes

1) 4492 - Tanner
2) 10025 - CATS
3) 10640 - (ii) Ganondorf
4) 12243 - Sly Cooper
5) 12652 - Guybrush Threepwood
6) 12847 - J.C. Denton
7) 13367 - Luca Blight
8) 14406 - Earthworm Jim
9) 14602 - Ratchet
10) 14721 - Lara Croft

Top 10 Most Impressive Losers (by votes)

1) 46788 - Shadow the Hedgehog
2) 43820 - Liquid Snake
3) 37512 - Alucard
4) 37338 - Donkey Kong
5) 36102 - Viewtiful Joe
6) 35220 - Lettuce Kefka
7) 35193 - Jill Valentine
8) 34382 - (ii) Luigi
9) 33528 - Gordon Freeman
10) 32733 - Jak

Top 10 Least Impressive Winners (by votes)

1) 35220 - Ryu Hayabusa
2) 40130 - Ness
3) 41151 - (ii) Yoshi
4) 41440 - Vyse
5) 41691 - Sam Fisher
6) 43775 - Tails
7) 43913 - Frog
8) 47578 - Knuckles
9) 48239 - Tommy Vercetti
10) 48334 - Tidus

Top 10 Easiest Matches to Predict (based on entrants choosing the winner)

1) 98.79% - Link over CATS
2) 98.28% - Mario over J.C. Denton
3) 97.97% - Cloud over Duke Milk'em
4) 97.47% - Megaman over Earthworm Jim
4) 97.47% - Sonic the Hedgehog over Terry Bogard
6) 97.37% - Sephiroth over Sly Cooper
7) 97.27% - Solid Snake over Tanner
8) 96.07% - (ii) Link over Ganondorf
9) 95.00% - Bowser over Guybrush Threepwood
10) 93.43% - Crono over Conker

Top 10 Hardest Matches to Predict (based on entrants choosing the winner)

1) 35.13% - Vivi over Donkey Kong
2) 43.05% - Knuckles over Kefka
3) 43.86% - (ii) Yoshi over Luigi
4) 44.33% - Frog over Liquid Snake
5) 46.30% - Tails over Viewtiful Joe
6) 48.56% - Ryu Hayabusa over Jill Valentine
7) 54.16% - Ness over Jak
8) 63.02% - Ganondorf over Alucard
9) 65.22% - Sam Fisher over Gordon Freeman
10) 66.71% - Vyse over Laharl

---
That's it. I have reached my threshold of pain. I am going home and I am going to play Megaman, eat snack cakes, and do my woman.

Mega Man's breaking 60%? That's news to me.

Actually, I think Mega can do it now. A strange hunch, but I think Mega will get somewhere in the low 60's.
---
MC vs. Crash - http://www.stripcreator.com/comics/Moltar
Magus vs. Crono - Bracket: Crono - Vote: Magus (34/36)

Yeah, calling it a "strange hunch" sounds about right.
---
Squall Leonhart's Road to the Summer Championship
2nd Round: (5)Kirby

Yes! People are believing!
---
SC2k4 Winner: Mega Man
Ken Masters; the fighting king clothed in blazing fire.

If Mega Man doesn't break 65%, it doesn't matter. He won't win if that happens and you know that.
---
Squall Leonhart's Road to the Summer Championship
2nd Round: (5)Kirby

I've been sayin' all along that Mega Man ought to get about 60% on Tidus, give or take a percent.
---
Supporting both Earthworm Jim AND Mega Man in 2004
Spring Contest Score: 151/192

"If Mega Man doesn't break 65%, it doesn't matter. He won't win if that happens and you know that."

Oh yeah, because Tidus can't be any stronger this year or anything, right?

Fail'd
---
True love is a fairy tale. I'm damaged, so how would I know? - Plummet: Damaged

He doesn't need to break 65%. He just needs to come close, because obviously it doesn't have to be to an exact tee.

Prepare to witness the event on Tuesday, Leonheart.
---
SC2k4 Winner: Mega Man
Ken Masters; the fighting king clothed in blazing fire.

I see Megaman gaining a huge early lead quite easily. He may very well be the board's most favorite character among the group called "Board Favorites", along with characters like Vivi, HK-47, Frog, Protoman and Magus. But there just seems to be so much Megaman fanboyism here. It's kinda irritating really, I mean it is a good series but I think it's getting too popular while not having enough anti-fanboyism directed to it (a la FFVII and OoT). Tidus, on the other hand, is one of the most hated characters here, and will get almost no board support.

But when the dust clears, I fully expect to see Tidus with a solid 45% and an enjoyable day of Megaman fanboys whining that Meg Ryan is getting 45% on their savior.
---
Man is equally incapable of seeing the nothingness from which he emerges and the infinity in which he is engulfed. -Blaise Pascal

Heroic Mario doesn't believe he is.
---
Squall Leonhart's Road to the Summer Championship
2nd Round: (5)Kirby

"Tidus, on the other hand, is one of the most hated characters here, and will get almost no board support. "

False. The same was to be said of Tidus vs. Shadow and Tidus still won the first 15 minutes.
---
True love is a fairy tale. I'm damaged, so how would I know? - Plummet: Damaged

Sorry, I was taking a nap before beating my friend in Madden with the Vikings. Just to let everyone know, virtually every stat topic vet marks post counters.

As for this division, we're getting 4 blowouts in a row. With all of the pre-match hype for Yoshi/Luigi, I consider that match a complete dud.
---
Winner of the Spring 2004 'Best. Game. Ever.' Contest
*Married to smitelf on 5/21/04* ++SCC GOD++

Yes! People are believing!

Eh, Mega's still getting his ass owned by Link.
---
MC vs. Crash - http://www.stripcreator.com/comics/Moltar
Magus vs. Crono - Bracket: Crono - Vote: Magus (34/36)

But when the dust clears, I fully expect to see Tidus with a solid 45% and an enjoyable day of Megaman fanboys whining that Meg Ryan is getting 45% on their savior.

Mega Man will never fall below 60% on this faithful day. And when everything is over I'll be at #1 with "Mega Man" as my winner. ;)
---
SC2k4 Winner: Mega Man
Ken Masters; the fighting king clothed in blazing fire.

Shadow is hated here as well. Megaman is loved MUCH more than Shadow.
---
Man is equally incapable of seeing the nothingness from which he emerges and the infinity in which he is engulfed. -Blaise Pascal

And I've been trying to say for a long time that Tidus might benefit from Final Fantasy X-2, but everyone's been shooting it down because he's "not in the game enough." I'm one of the few who actually believes the potential is out there. Still...I doubt it's enough to give him a significant boost, and it would be highly irregular for Tidus and Shadow to gain in almost exact proportion.
---
Squall Leonhart's Road to the Summer Championship
2nd Round: (5)Kirby

Ulti, don't forget Samus/Lara before this division started. That's FIVE in a row if you count Yoshi/Luigi as one.
---
Supporting both Earthworm Jim AND Mega Man in 2004
Spring Contest Score: 151/192

Mega Man will never fall below 60% on this faithful day. And when everything is over I'll be at #1 with "Mega Man" as my winner. ;)

I shall have to see it to believe it.
---
Man is equally incapable of seeing the nothingness from which he emerges and the infinity in which he is engulfed. -Blaise Pascal

"Shadow is hated here as well."

Wow, through the course of this board you must have talked almost exclussively to Slow and Samberdog... Shadow isn't hated, Sonic is loved on this board and Shadow gathers so much of that love. Why in the world do you think that this board would favor Shadow when common sense went against him? Tidus hate wasn't the only factor, I assure you.
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True love is a fairy tale. I'm damaged, so how would I know? - Plummet: Damaged

You will see it. I've never doubted it for a second and I'll finally get some damn people to listen on this board when I speak of Mega Man's chances.
---
SC2k4 Winner: Mega Man
Ken Masters; the fighting king clothed in blazing fire.

Shadow is hated here as well

*loads shotgun*

Please....give names....
---
MC vs. Crash - http://www.stripcreator.com/comics/Moltar
Magus vs. Crono - Bracket: Crono - Vote: Magus (34/36)

"and it would be highly irregular for Tidus and Shadow to gain in almost exact proportion."

There's little reason to expect that Shadow wouldn't go up due to SH, clearly Tidus went up more or Shadow was overrated. Either way, it looks like Tidus has stepped up a bit.
---
True love is a fairy tale. I'm damaged, so how would I know? - Plummet: Damaged

Yeah, you never doubted Joe would beat Tails either. Utmost confidence is great, but it doesn't give you the desired result.
---
Squall Leonhart's Road to the Summer Championship
2nd Round: (5)Kirby

Tidus would not have had to gain at all to be able to beat Shadow.
---
Squall Leonhart's Road to the Summer Championship
2nd Round: (5)Kirby

And from the looks of it, people won't let me live that down.
---
SC2k4 Winner: Mega Man
Ken Masters; the fighting king clothed in blazing fire.

Wow, through the course of this board you must have talked almost exclussively to Slow and Samberdog... Shadow isn't hated, Sonic is loved on this board and Shadow gathers so much of that love.

You will have to trust me on this. I'm a huge Shadow fanboy, easily among the strongest on the board, and whenever I went into any topic expecting to see Shadow support it would almost always be anti-Tidus. I would always look for genuine Shadow support and would hardly ever find it.

Why in the world do you think that this board would favor Shadow when common sense went against him? Tidus hate wasn't the only factor, I assure you.

But it was the primary factor. Common sense came in the form of Square being stronger then Sega, and look at the prediction percentage for Kefka vs Knuckles.
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Man is equally incapable of seeing the nothingness from which he emerges and the infinity in which he is engulfed. -Blaise Pascal

You put yourself out there on the line and it backfires, that tends to happen. I was just making a point anyway. You can never doubt it all you want, but it won't always go like you expect.
---
Squall Leonhart's Road to the Summer Championship
2nd Round: (5)Kirby

Of course not HM, becuase if you make one mistake you're obviously incompetant and should cease breathing... So anyway, anyone who is going to jump on another person's back for missing a single match so far be so kind as to remind us of YOUR perfect bracket or shut the hell up.
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True love is a fairy tale. I'm damaged, so how would I know? - Plummet: Damaged

Getting away from the main discussion for a bit, we currently have four stat topics on the board right now, with 3 of them at 500 posts. We've been on a record pace as of late.
---
Winner of the Spring 2004 'Best. Game. Ever.' Contest
*Married to smitelf on 5/21/04* ++SCC GOD++

Excuse me. I'm not allowed to bring up a similar situation to make a point? Duly noted.
---
Squall Leonhart's Road to the Summer Championship
2nd Round: (5)Kirby

Exponential increase... befor eyou know it these topics will be filling up within seconds of being made.
---
True love is a fairy tale. I'm damaged, so how would I know? - Plummet: Damaged

Not like it matter that the topics are used up quickly.
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Man is equally incapable of seeing the nothingness from which he emerges and the infinity in which he is engulfed. -Blaise Pascal

"Excuse me. I'm not allowed to bring up a similar situation to make a point? Duly noted."

If it's used as means to attack someone else then you should at the very least expect some reaction to it.
---
True love is a fairy tale. I'm damaged, so how would I know? - Plummet: Damaged

"Not like it matter that the topics are used up quickly."

Considering that we had all of what, 3 or 4 topics for the 2k3 contest, I think it does mena something.
---
True love is a fairy tale. I'm damaged, so how would I know? - Plummet: Damaged

Almost too quickly; I go out for a few hours and have to read pages upon pages (what with me having 50-post pages, no less)

Which is awesome in one regard, but... dayum.
---
"All in all, sometimes it's a wonder that pesants[sic] actually live long enough to learn how to farm....."-mysterygilgamesh4
{34}

Here's one I've been thinking about lately:

Would Kefka beat anyone else from FFIV? He's the only one who has gotten enough nominations but from the looks of the polls lately and the finals last year villains don't beat main characters. But does the lack of FFIV having a main character affect anything? Would Kefka beat Terra, Celes or Locke?
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Man is equally incapable of seeing the nothingness from which he emerges and the infinity in which he is engulfed. -Blaise Pascal

Yeah, I was caught up before I went to work this mornaing and had to read like 4 pages to catch up on this... dare I say it... slow day.
---
True love is a fairy tale. I'm damaged, so how would I know? - Plummet: Damaged

That was hardly an attack on Heroic Mario's competence. Goodness, if Mega Man breaks 60% on Tidus, I'll be facing the same situation. I have the utmost confidence in whatever I do, but it doesn't mean I'm never wrong.
---
Squall Leonhart's Road to the Summer Championship
2nd Round: (5)Kirby

Yeah, I hate that. Go to sleep, then school, check the stats topic and BAM...

250 posts for me to read... ;_;
---
MC vs. Crash - http://www.stripcreator.com/comics/Moltar
Magus vs. Crono - Bracket: Crono - Vote: Magus (34/36)

"Would Kefka beat Terra, Celes or Locke?"

Maybe, maybe not. I think we need to see Locke and Shadow in the contest.
---
True love is a fairy tale. I'm damaged, so how would I know? - Plummet: Damaged

JonPen - It's FFVI, not IV. Unless you made typo twice. O_o
---
M-me? Queen ***** of the Universe?
This is the happiest day of my life. ~ smitelf

To answer the Kefka question, we don't know.
---
Winner of the Spring 2004 'Best. Game. Ever.' Contest
*Married to smitelf on 5/21/04* ++SCC GOD++

JonPen - It's FFVI, not IV. Unless you made typo twice. O_o

No, I just totally suck with roman numerals. They hate me. I ended up buying FFVIII as my first PSX RPG instead of FFVII (which was the one I wanted to buy) because I can't use them.
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Man is equally incapable of seeing the nothingness from which he emerges and the infinity in which he is engulfed. -Blaise Pascal

Just to throw this out there, Cloud in 2005 is going to be a ***** to beat.
---
SC2k4 Winner: Mega Man
Ken Masters; the fighting king clothed in blazing fire.

Bart Simpson: "Rocky V plus Rocky II equals Rocky VII!"
Now that's Roman Numerals.
---
"All in all, sometimes it's a wonder that pesants[sic] actually live long enough to learn how to farm....."-mysterygilgamesh4
{34}

Cloud vs. Link is almost a lock matchup in the Finals next year if both of their big releases are put out before the 2005 contest.
---
Squall Leonhart's Road to the Summer Championship
2nd Round: (5)Kirby

After buying FFVIII and believing it was FFVII, the still ignorant me tried to argue to my friend that Squall was the main character of FFVII.

Good times, good times.
---
Man is equally incapable of seeing the nothingness from which he emerges and the infinity in which he is engulfed. -Blaise Pascal

Just to throw this out there, Cloud in 2005 is going to be a ***** to beat.

Because of what you've heard about AC?
---
M-me? Queen ***** of the Universe?
This is the happiest day of my life. ~ smitelf

Just because I am really, really bored... the T-Note Fall 2k4 character brackets!!

Cubs Division

1 Cloud
16 Ryo Hazuki
8 Tails
9 Sam Fisher
5 Shadow
12 Jak
4 Magus
13 Pac-Man
3 Crono
14 Kain
6 Dante
11 Ness
7 Frog
10 Vyse
2 Sonic
15 Luca Blight

Yankees Division

1 Mega Man
16 CATS
8 Donkey Kong
9 Kefka
5 Tommy Vercetti
12 Laharl
4 Auron
13 Duke Nukem
6 Vivi
11 Scorpion
3 Tidus
14 Sly Cooper
7 Liquid Snake
10 Conker
2 Mario
15 Guybrush Threepwood

Cardinals Division

1 Link
16 Tanner
8 Knuckles
9 Alucard
5 Zero
12 Bomberman
4 Ryu (SF)
13 Protoman
6 Luigi
11 KOS-MOS
3 Ganondorf
14 Ratchet
7 Ryu Hayabusa
10 Viewtiful Joe
2 Samus
15 JC Denton

Red Sox Division

1 Sephiroth
16 Terry Bogard
8 Jill Valentine
9 Sora
5 Bowser
12 Crash Bandicoot
4 Master Chief
13 Earthworm Jim
6 Kirby
11 Max Payne
3 Squall Leonhart
14 Lara Croft
7 Yoshi
10 Gordon Freeman
2 Solid Snake
15 HK-47

Let me know what you think. I did my best to avoid ridiculous amounts of SFF, and I also tried to avoid any previous matches.

---
Anxiously awaiting... FROG vs. Master Chief

February 15, 2005 for Cloud. Link's is projected to be June 2005, so hopefully Nintendo doesn't delay it until the holiday season.
---
SC2k4 Winner: Mega Man
Ken Masters; the fighting king clothed in blazing fire.

After buying FFVIII and believing it was FFVII, the still ignorant me tried to argue to my friend that Squall was the main character of FFVII.

Good times, good times.

If only Final Fantasy VIII had been released when FFVII was...Squall could take his rightful place as the dominant force of this contest.
---
Squall Leonhart's Road to the Summer Championship
2nd Round: (5)Kirby

Because of what you've heard about AC?

Oh yes. I cannot wait for this movie. I've been looking forward to it since they released information last year, but now after reading that summary... =p
---
SC2k4 Winner: Mega Man
Ken Masters; the fighting king clothed in blazing fire.

Nintendo not delaying a Zelda game? O_o
---
M-me? Queen ***** of the Universe?
This is the happiest day of my life. ~ smitelf

Shame, Leonhart.

Squall already plans on winning the contest as is.
---
Man is equally incapable of seeing the nothingness from which he emerges and the infinity in which he is engulfed. -Blaise Pascal

Just giving a small hint as to what would probably happen. =\
---
SC2k4 Winner: Mega Man
Ken Masters; the fighting king clothed in blazing fire.

Heh heh, the time will come.
---
Squall Leonhart's Road to the Summer Championship
2nd Round: (5)Kirby

How much could Cloud actually benefit from AC? If it went to theatres, which I think I saw mentioned in that thread of yours, I would assume there would be a boost... But I couldn't expect as much of a boost if it was just on DVD/UMD.

?
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M-me? Queen ***** of the Universe?
This is the happiest day of my life. ~ smitelf

Renewed interest in the game, Cloud playing a more favorable role and changing some minds. Anybody who even just likes Final Fantasy VII will be eating this up.
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Squall Leonhart's Road to the Summer Championship
2nd Round: (5)Kirby

It could go to theatres, like you said, but either way Square plans to market the sucker like crazy. So it won't be this thing that simply looks to appeal to existing Final Fantasy 7 fans. Hopefully plenty of people go out there and get it.

Either way, from the way things are looking Cloud would have my vote against everyone but Mario and Mega Man.
---
SC2k4 Winner: Mega Man
Ken Masters; the fighting king clothed in blazing fire.

Let's see here... much better than ceej, no doubt.

I think Tails would kill Sam, relatively speaking (you know, Tails winning = instant killing)

Jak still sucks too much for a 12 seed.

Crono still deserves a 2 seed.

Dante and Ness are probably both a tad low.

Frog is likely too low.

Tommy is too high, even if he retains 2k3 strength in full.

Alucard is underseed by no less than 3 and as many as 5 while Knux is overseeded.

Protoman is probably underseeded.

Terry is underseeded, there are still characters weaker than him.

Master Chief is highly overseeded.

Lara's performance agaisnt Samus make sher look over seeded

Gordon, despite significant boosts this year, still appears overseeded.

You also had a Kirby/Squall repeat.

Better than ceej... still not great.
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True love is a fairy tale. I'm damaged, so how would I know? - Plummet: Damaged

"Squall could take his rightful place as the dominant force of this contest."

I don't think so. For more reasons then I can name I must say FF7 is the only game that could have done what it did. The timing may have been right, but there is a lot more to FF7 then just te timing.
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True love is a fairy tale. I'm damaged, so how would I know? - Plummet: Damaged

There is always the possiblity that the story they have for the movie isn't as great as what people are expecting, isn't there? The action scenes sound incredible, though.
---
M-me? Queen ***** of the Universe?
This is the happiest day of my life. ~ smitelf

Here's the problem with the appeal. We've already seen a computer-generated Square movie that featured a storyline that more or less ripped off from Final Fantasy VII. It has hyped like you wouldn't believe for a long time, and was met with crushing disappointment once everyone saw it. It nearly bankrupted Square.

Now we're seeing another movie, this time it IS Final Fantasy VII, and I've yet to see any evidence whatsoever that it will be any different.

Perhaps it's just those bad memories of TSW that prevent me from getting excited over this. =\

---
"Those who can't, emulate." - MegaPowerNinja
Official World Record Holder: Solstice, Super Mario World

"more or less ripped off from Final Fantasy VII"

I saw no resemblance between Spirits Within and FF7. Are you on crack, or did you not actually watch the movie?
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True love is a fairy tale. I'm damaged, so how would I know? - Plummet: Damaged

I agree with that, but I think some of the hate for FFVIII in general comes from the fans who started with FFVII and were disappointed when they realized it was a different game with new characters.

I think Squall would probably be an elite if it had been released at that particular time.
---
Squall Leonhart's Road to the Summer Championship
2nd Round: (5)Kirby

I saw no resemblance between Spirits Within and FF7. Are you on crack, or did you not actually watch the movie?

I saw it the day it came out, fool. You're telling me the "lifestream" from FF7 and the "Gaia" from TSW aren't similar?

---
"Those who can't, emulate." - MegaPowerNinja
Official World Record Holder: Solstice, Super Mario World

Link vs Tanner?

Dear god have mercy...
---
BtT: 3:57.10 | HRC: 50,053.8 ft OV aaaargh
Crash.

There is always the possiblity that the story they have for the movie isn't as great as what people are expecting, isn't there?

There's the possibility, but it just keeps getting better and better everytime Square releases information on the plot to Advent Children.

Here's the problem with the appeal. We've already seen a computer-generated Square movie that featured a storyline that more or less ripped off from Final Fantasy VII.

The Spirits Within. If you've read any of the summaries thus far you'll notice that all of them commented on how Square has totally redeemed their ability to make movies based off of the 24 minutes they got to see. GameSpot, 1UP.com, etc. have all commented on how extremely well-done it looks.

It has hyped like you wouldn't believe for a long time, and was met with crushing disappointment once everyone saw it. It nearly bankrupted Square.

As 1UP.com put it, "If Hironobu Sakaguchi worked on Advent Children instead of The Spirits Within he'd probably still have a job."

Now we're seeing another movie, this time it IS Final Fantasy VII, and I've yet to see any evidence whatsoever that it will be any different.

Nearly everyone can tell the difference.
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SC2k4 Winner: Mega Man
Ken Masters; the fighting king clothed in blazing fire.

I think a new game would almost by default, well wait, a new excellent game, would do more for Link than a movie for Cloud. I can't really see too many people buying AC without having played FF7 first. And isn't it kinda short for a theater release? or is it longer than the hour for some reason I thought it was. The main thing to get a boost for the ff7 characters is going to have to be to attract a new audience to them, and I don't know how successful they're going to be in that. Unless, they don't really bill the movie as a ff7 thing at least in previews, or at least as somethign that you don't have to play the game to get. or maybe it will inspire hoards of people to go buy ff7, but as of right now I"m expecting a bigger boost for Link than Cloud.
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Today's Survivor topic can be found here, Please vote : )http://boards.gamefaqs.com/gfaqs/genmessage.php?board=8&topic=16070956

*reads HM's post*

Okay then. I guess I can look forward to that.

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"Those who can't, emulate." - MegaPowerNinja
Official World Record Holder: Solstice, Super Mario World

The hate comes from a main character that noone can connect to, both players and characters in the game, because his attitude makes him to be so unlikeable. Most people (characters or real) that try are continuously rebuffed. He doesn't want you to like him, so most don't.

The hate comes from a heroine that isn't as likable as the scum on Aeris's boots or the spit in Tifa's hair. She's annoying to many, uninspired to more, and as a whole doesn't manage to redeem herself at all

The hate comes from a broken plot with more holes than my swiss cheese. A villain with no puprose or background. In fact, you could get halfway through disc 3 and you still wouldn't know who the real villain is.

The hate comes from a system that is absolutely backwards. You're trying to tell me it's bad to level? You're trying to tell me that there is no drawback for summoning and you actually get rewarded? You're telling me using magic can have a serious detriment on you stats?

The hate for FF8 doesn't come from FF7 fans (I hated FF8 before I allowed myself to like FF7), it comes from people that have, you know... standards. FF8 failed to reach the standards of RPG fans in terms of plot, characters, and system so many times and so badly that it should be no wonder at all that it is voted least favorite FF.
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True love is a fairy tale. I'm damaged, so how would I know? - Plummet: Damaged

"You're telling me the "lifestream" from FF7 and the "Gaia" from TSW aren't similar?"

Ooooh, one aspect that was clearly invented by Feng Shui before our fantasies became final. Yeah, there's a HUGE conneciton.
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True love is a fairy tale. I'm damaged, so how would I know? - Plummet: Damaged

Advent Children is looking really good, I don't think i'll be disappointed.

At the very worst, I could rent the dang movie and still not be disappointed.

There's one thing that reassures me, though. Advent Children cannot be as bad as the utter crap that Anchorman: The Legend of Ron Burgundy was. Oh my gosh, I can't believe I wasted 6 bucks on that piece of crap.

Sorry for rambling. Either way, I think Cloud and Link should both get small boosts from their respective hypes next year.

So, what do y'all think of the Frog/Master Chief match?

Personally I think it'll go to Frog, because its easier to think of it as this: Would Liquid Snake beat Master Chief? I think he would.

Go Frog!
---
Sc2k4: 33 of 36
Next Match: Mario vs. Bowser

I think a new game would almost by default, well wait, a new excellent game, would do more for Link than a movie for Cloud.

Considering the new game might not even come out within the timeframe of the contest things could look better for Cloud. Should the two go head-to-head the game should obviously give the nod.

I can't really see too many people buying AC without having played FF7 first. And isn't it kinda short for a theater release?

Nomura said it could very well exceed 90 minutes (1 hour and 30 minutes).

or maybe it will inspire hoards of people to go buy ff7, but as of right now I"m expecting a bigger boost for Link than Cloud.

It'll certainly get a renewed interest in Final Fantasy 7 and it'll have plenty of time to sink in prior to the contest. Now, what remains the mystery is whether or not Zelda 10 will release in time.
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SC2k4 Winner: Mega Man
Ken Masters; the fighting king clothed in blazing fire.

Squall is easy to connect to and relate to once you understand why he does the things he does, but that's another matter entirely.

And I speak from experience when I say how disappointed I was when I realized FFVIII was not a continuation of FFVII, the one I started with. Of course, then I played the game and that changed everything. I personally love it to death, but I'm aware that the style isn't for everyone.
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Squall Leonhart's Road to the Summer Championship
2nd Round: (5)Kirby

[This message was deleted at the request of a moderator or administrator]

If Link gets his game before he faces Cloud, not even 5 AC will be able to save him.

I know who has my vote in a match between the two.

Zach.

Wait, wait, wait. What about Zack?
---
SC2k4 Winner: Mega Man
Ken Masters; the fighting king clothed in blazing fire.

Final Fantasy VIII isn't anywhere close to the least liked FF. Some people are just so vocally against it that they make it seem that way. It would have been in the Spring Contest if it weren't for the "one game per series per division" rule, after all.

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"Those who can't, emulate." - MegaPowerNinja
Official World Record Holder: Solstice, Super Mario World

Wait, so THAT'S why Sakaguchi doesn't have a job with them anymore? No wonder Square's games have sucked lately.
---
Winner of the Spring 2004 'Best. Game. Ever.' Contest
*Married to smitelf on 5/21/04* ++SCC GOD++

Yeah. He's got his own company whose name escapes me at the moment, to work on a new RPG for the next-gen consoles.
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SC2k4 Winner: Mega Man
Ken Masters; the fighting king clothed in blazing fire.

It's called "Mist Walker".
---
SC2k4 Winner: Mega Man
Ken Masters; the fighting king clothed in blazing fire.

Wait, so THAT'S why Sakaguchi doesn't have a job with them anymore? No wonder Square's games have sucked lately.

Yeah. That's news to me as well. It makes sense, though. The only Square game since Sakaguchi left that I really liked was FFX. That's it.

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"Those who can't, emulate." - MegaPowerNinja
Official World Record Holder: Solstice, Super Mario World

Peer from IGN put it nicely, "If you screw up in corporate Japan, you get the 'window seat'."

Much like Gumpei Yokoi and the Virtual Boy.
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SC2k4 Winner: Mega Man
Ken Masters; the fighting king clothed in blazing fire.

"Final Fantasy VIII isn't anywhere close to the least liked FF."

Which is why it more than doubled the nearest opponent the last time a least favorite FF poll was held, right? In fact, all of it's opposition combined was only capable of doubling it... Sure, FFX-2 will change that, but FF8 is still capable of gathering more heat than any game other than that one.

"It would have been in the Spring Contest if it weren't for the "one game per series per division" rule, after all."

Yeah, and so would Majora's Mask, no doubt, so what's your point?
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True love is a fairy tale. I'm damaged, so how would I know? - Plummet: Damaged

Which is why it more than doubled the nearest opponent the last time a least favorite FF poll was held, right? In fact, all of it's opposition combined was only capable of doubling it... Sure, FFX-2 will change that, but FF8 is still capable of gathering more heat than any game other than that one.

Got a link to this poll?

Yeah, and so would Majora's Mask, no doubt, so what's your point?

That it's popular. Duh.

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"Those who can't, emulate." - MegaPowerNinja
Official World Record Holder: Solstice, Super Mario World

There's a difference between least-liked and most-hated.

FF8 is the latter, but not the former.
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The only reason this is here is because posts without sigs look ugly.

FF8 may be the most hated on this board, but I'd be willing to put it over any Square Enix game other then FF7 and FF6 in the Spring Contest.
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SC2K4 Winner: Link defeats Sephiroth
SC2K4 Score: 34/36 (Yoshi) Pick: Crono over Magus

First off. CM, I love you. That is exactly what I have been preaching about FFVIII for so many years.

Second off, HM. The plot point with Zack just was... weak. Its basically using an amnesia plot point, which is always a bad idea. Second, it just doesn't make much sense if you really think about it. I don't care what excuse they gave in the game. Any normal human being would of asked Cloud, how the hell he knew all this crap when he wasn't even there. And if your Cloud you wouldn't be, "Hey there is a span of time in my memories which goes from one point to another and I can't remember doing the stuff to acheive the later point." It requires a few of the characters to basically be complete idiots and just was the first of the many potholes the story ran over. The plot holes of important items being one of the other big ones.

"Got a link to this poll?"

Jesus, do I have to provide that link every 4-5 topics? It's like 900 something, go look for yourself. It's there.

"There's a difference between least-liked and most-hated."

A diffence, sure, but not a very big one. It's the most polarizing game in the series after FF7... the two are set apart by the fact that FF7 has more lovers and less haters than 8.

"FF8 may be the most hated on this board"

Not this board, fool, this site. I'd easily put FFX over FFVIII as well as VI and VII.
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True love is a fairy tale. I'm damaged, so how would I know? - Plummet: Damaged

Hmm, naw. FF8 would defeat 10 on GameFAQs.

For a game that "everybody hates" it sure does have a lot of fans, too.
---
SC2K4 Winner: Link defeats Sephiroth
SC2K4 Score: 34/36 (Yoshi) Pick: Crono over Magus

Not everyone hates it.

Just anyone who enjoys GOOD games, hates it.


Sorry Leonhart.

Second off, HM. The plot point with Zack just was... weak. Its basically using an amnesia plot point, which is always a bad idea.

*SPOILERS*

Woo.

Yay.

If you ask me adding in Zack explained everything perfectly. Cloud's whole mission as a kid was to go out and join SOLDIER. As it turns out he couldn't make the cut. After the incident at Nibelhiem they are both taken back to the Mansion where they get the Jenova cell's injected into them and Mako treatment. Now, Zack had already had the latter done so his body was able to fight off the injection of Jenova cell's. Cloud on the other hand had no way of being hit by both and his mind was turned into mush.

Your aware of what happens after that right? All Cloud hear's about is what Zack did, how Zack acted, and what Zack had planned for them to do. He mixed his own experiences with that of Zack's and you get Cloud at the beginning of the game. I thought that explained Cloud's situation nicely.

Second, it just doesn't make much sense if you really think about it. I don't care what excuse they gave in the game. Any normal human being would of asked Cloud, how the hell he knew all this crap when he wasn't even there.

Cloud was at Nibelhiem. As for SOLDIER, he remembered trying out for it and then from that he knew Zack had made it. That comes from mixing his own experiences with the constant stories from Zack. When his brain was at such a fragile state and not able to recall everything perfectly he saw nothing to not believe he was in SOLDIER.

And if your Cloud you wouldn't be, "Hey there is a span of time in my memories which goes from one point to another and I can't remember doing the stuff to acheive the later point."

He was just owned by Mako treatment and Jenova cell's. What do you expect the man to do?
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SC2k4 Winner: Mega Man
Ken Masters; the fighting king clothed in blazing fire.

"I don't care what excuse they gave in the game. Any normal human being would of asked Cloud, how the hell he knew all this crap when he wasn't even there."

I dunno about that, if I were Tifa I would be so weirded out by all of it that'd I'd be too afraid to bring it up, especially knowing that Cloud was seriously confused when she found him I can't blame her (anymore).

"Hey there is a span of time in my memories which goes from one point to another and I can't remember doing the stuff to acheive the later point."

As a normal human being I must say that it can take a long time to piece together the events of my life in the proper order that they happened in and I haven't even had anything all that traumatic happen to me.

Frankly I think the situation was this: Cloud didn't really want to know and Tifa was too afraid to try to make him. I can understand and respect both of those possitions. Sure, from a storytelling point of view it's fairly crappy, but in terms of conveying both of those characters in a very human manner it does an excellent job.
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True love is a fairy tale. I'm damaged, so how would I know? - Plummet: Damaged

"FF8 would defeat 10 on GameFAQs."

Not a chance, unless you think FF8 can also beat FF6 or come too close for comfort to it. The way that Tidus and Auron both would no doubt manhandle Squall pretty much makes me believe it isn't so... the fact that Squall is considered a good character in a bad game (I disagree the first part) and that Tidus is a bad character in a good game just has to tell you something. Sorry, FF8 wouldn't beat FFX.
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True love is a fairy tale. I'm damaged, so how would I know? - Plummet: Damaged

I never found that poll, CM, but I did find this one.

http://www.gamefaqs.com/poll/index.html?poll=1178

That's pretty much what I expected.

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"Those who can't, emulate." - MegaPowerNinja
Official World Record Holder: Solstice, Super Mario World

And then there's this one.

http://www.gamefaqs.com/poll/index.html?poll=1443

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"Those who can't, emulate." - MegaPowerNinja
Official World Record Holder: Solstice, Super Mario World

http://www.gamefaqs.com/poll/index.html?poll=1443

There's a Final Fantasy poll.
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SC2k4 Winner: Mega Man
Ken Masters; the fighting king clothed in blazing fire.

[This message was deleted at the request of the original poster]

Match XXXIV: (5) Yoshi vs. (4) Luigi Review

Yoshi beat Luigi, 54.48% - 45.52%

Well Yoshi actually did what the x-st said that he would. But I surprised because that would mean that Pac-Man must’ve token a huge drop between 2003 and 2004, but for some reason he didn’t drop from 2002 to 2003 because Kefka vs. Knuckles proved it otherwise. Also we lost a whole bunch of perfects and if everything goes to plan we should still be left with a couple by the end of this round, but that’s if nothing surprising happens.

---
Summer 2004 Contest 31/36 Crono vs. Magus

Match XXXVI: (7) Bowser vs. (2) Mario Review

Past Performances:

Bowser: 2002

Did not attend
Ranked: N/A

Bowser: 2003

Defeated Ness, 75.07% - 24.93%
Defeated Yoshi, 56.34% - 43.66%
Lost to Cloud, 29.97% - 70.03%
Ranked: 17th

Bowser: 2004

Defeated Guybrush, 82.99% - 17.01%

Mario: 2002

Defeated Servbot, 74.11% - 25.89%
Defeated Morrigan, 66.81% - 33.19%
Defeated Donkey Kong, 81.98% - 18.02%
Defeated Cloud, 50.11% - 49.89%
Defeated Crono, 50.05% - 49.95%
Lost to Link, 37.47% - 62.53%
Ranked: 6th

Mario: 2003

Defeated Captain Olimar, 88.42% - 11.58%
Defeated Shadow, 55.10% - 44.90%
Defeated Crono, 50.05% - 49.95%
Lost to Sephiroth, 38.40% - 61.60%
Ranked: 5th

Mario: 2004

Defeated JC Denton, 83.54% - 16.46%

Analysis:

Well last round we had Bowser underperforming against Guybrush. Even though we only had his 2002 numbers those numbers are probably way off since no one really knew who Ryo or Guybrush were so maybe it was one of those matches where the picture does matter or if you don’t know either one you go for the top one, both where Ryo had a disadvantage. In the other hand we really don’t know whose JC Denton is, but if this was taken like on gamespy I don’t really think Mario would double him. Mario actually showed that he can treat fodders like fodders.

Well this is the third Hero vs. Villain match in this division and like the other two this isn’t going to be pretty. Sad that my third favorite character is going to be blown away from my first favorite character (Yoshi’s second). At least he’ll be blown away from my favorite character, unlike Yoshi will next round. Well now there’s only one question left, how much SFF will this match actually have?

So people say that it will be less then the Mario vs. Donkey Kong SFF, but it could be more. Bowser has been on every single Mario game at least Donkey Kong had his own series for a while to gather some fans, but then again unlike Ganondorf Bowser is a legend like Mario. Most people if you ask whose Bowser would know that he’s from Mario, but Ganondorf I don’t think as many people would know him. Also Bowser is closer to Mario then Ganondorf is to Link so this match could be closer then Link vs. Ganondorf.

I can actually see Mario performing better against Bowser then he did against JC Denton, but I can also see Bowser getting as high as 75% too. Poor Bowser it looks like he’ll meet Ganondorf and Magus in the low, low parts of the x-st. It’s going to be a sad day for people like finalbowser and my brother who love Bowser to death, but like always the red plumber always comes on top. And to think he’s the second most popular Mario character in this contest. I wonder how Yoshi or Luigi would perform.

Charmander’s Bracket: Mario

Charmander’s Prediction: Mario wins, 78.35% - 21.65%

---
Summer 2004 Contest 31/36 Crono vs. Magus

It's not in the 900s, CM. And if it is, then it isn't grouped with the other 900s. YOU look for it.

http://www.gamefaqs.com/poll/index.html?poll=1573

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"Those who can't, emulate." - MegaPowerNinja
Official World Record Holder: Solstice, Super Mario World

HM. The second argument was in reference to Tifa. Also with the third one. That's not an excuse because he didn't know he had been injected. Either Jenova wouldn't let him try to remember or he was too stupid to not notice. Especially when he went back to that point in history in his mind, SEVERAL times. And if it was the first one, then it just seems that Square had started adding way too many convient plot hole fixers which make sense unless you actually examine them. Just because they explain how it happenend doesn't mean it is a good explanation.

CM, its doesn't make them seem more human, atleast not Tifa. Any human would want to know what is going on. Tifa didn't know any experimenting with Cloud had gone on. She didn't even know he was there. She would of at least asked the questions. And it was crappy storytelling.

This is an argument for another thread.

http://www.gamefaqs.com/poll/index.html?poll=359

Here ya go, and hopefully this is the last time I have to hunt it down.
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True love is a fairy tale. I'm damaged, so how would I know? - Plummet: Damaged

8 barely trails 10 in that poll.

FF8 would beat every FF besides FFX, FFVI, and of course, FFVII in a poll.

That's not "least-liked" in the least.
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The only reason this is here is because posts without sigs look ugly.

"that poll" refers to the most recent favorite FF game poll.

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The only reason this is here is because posts without sigs look ugly.

"Any human would want to know what is going on."

And nevertheless, I will fight you to the death on that matter. If I were in her shoes I would be afraid, I may even be too afraid to say a word. She knew his brain was mush, and she didn't rememeber him being there... how could he know so much, then, she'd ask herself. Without referencing back to the game it's hard to come up with a reason. The fact of the matter is, though, that sometimes fear prevents you from saying things you should say. Curiosity did kill the cat, we are told, and I have no doubt that while she had a strong desire to figure out how Cloud knew all that she was also afraid... especially since if she had said anything about the subject it would possibly make Cloud even more confused than before. How could she deal with that? How could anyone deal with what may have happened to his already mushy brain had she told him that she never remembered him even being there? The humanistic traits are there not in direct action but in implication.
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True love is a fairy tale. I'm damaged, so how would I know? - Plummet: Damaged

Most favoite and least liked pull up far different results. FF9 would never win the most favorite, but it would also not "win" the least favorite. I made that point more than clear when Vivi was set to face DK.
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True love is a fairy tale. I'm damaged, so how would I know? - Plummet: Damaged

Okay. So we have a poll from four years ago with 10,000 total votes that says FF8 is the least-liked Final Fantasy. Wow. Hey, a year before THAT poll, we had this one.

http://www.gamefaqs.com/poll/index.html?poll=3

They're both outdated. The polls I showed you are more recent, one of them has NINETY thousand total votes, and it clearly shows FF8 as the fourth most popular game in the series on this site.

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"Those who can't, emulate." - MegaPowerNinja
Official World Record Holder: Solstice, Super Mario World

CM, we can continue this by other means if you want. I can give you a laundry list with my problems on FFVII storyline. Lets try to keep it out of this topic though.

http://www.gamefaqs.com/poll/index.html?poll=361

And the standings also haven't changed much since that time. The newness of 9 wore off putting it into a weaker possition and everything else does exactly as expect. I'm telling you, barring FFX-2, FF8 gathers the most hatred.
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True love is a fairy tale. I'm damaged, so how would I know? - Plummet: Damaged

You can have a laundry list if you want, you're still wrong on that point.
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True love is a fairy tale. I'm damaged, so how would I know? - Plummet: Damaged

*goku z got warned for asking sexually explicit questions of gotspork, so I am filling in*

FF8 may gather the most hate, but it is certainly not the least liked. I think just about everyone has a strong opinion on FF8. And it is about 1/2 and 1/2 and liking and disliking it. FF8 and FF10 would be close, but I honestly think FF8 would come away with it. Especially now that X-2 is associated with it (btw...I didn't think X-2 was bad at all...)

Bah. I was going to type out something massive, but I'll hold off on that for this being the stats topic and not "Discuss Final Fantasy 7!"

Either way, you see that I disagree.
---
SC2k4 Winner: Mega Man
Ken Masters; the fighting king clothed in blazing fire.

And the standings also haven't changed much since that time. The newness of 9 wore off putting it into a weaker possition and everything else does exactly as expect. I'm telling you, barring FFX-2, FF8 gathers the most hatred.

Are you blind? Look at that poll you just showed me. 1-5 on that list are significantly lower than FF8. Only 3 has more than half of what FF8 has, which can probably be attributed to people confusing it with FF3/6j.

If you want to know if how much the standings have changed, look at one of the three polls I showed you. How can you say FF8 gathers the most hatred when it's the fourth most popular out of a list of a dozen or more games, in a poll that reached seven to nine times the amount of total votes than the one you just showed me? You just hate FF8 too much to admit it, but I assure you that you do not speak for everyone.

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"Those who can't, emulate." - MegaPowerNinja
Official World Record Holder: Solstice, Super Mario World

Of the major players in the series it could only beat FF9, and even then I have my doubts. 1-5 don't really count anymore, as stupid as that is. Even 4 doesn't pull the weight it should

I also clearly stated it was the most polarizing, bar only FF7 if any at all.

FF10 clearly has more takers than FF8, it always comes away with more votes, FF8 would also come away with more hate votes in a least favorite poll if a new one was run... You'd have to be pretty crazy to take 8 in that match.

FFX-2 clearly stands on its own, Sp2k4 and S2k4 prove it.

"btw...I didn't think X-2 was bad at all..."

And I bet the casual voter doesn't think it was that bad either, which is another reason why I wouldn't take FF8 over FF10.
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True love is a fairy tale. I'm damaged, so how would I know? - Plummet: Damaged

Well, of course X-2 stands out on it's own. It's a female-oriented game on a male-dominated site, and besides, it's subpar, to say the least.

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"Those who can't, emulate." - MegaPowerNinja
Official World Record Holder: Solstice, Super Mario World

"Are you blind?"

I dunno, are you daft? I would think that it should come as no surprise that since 1-5 are irrelevant to the conversation at hand not because the subject matter is limited by us but because the subject matter is limited by popularity. 1-5 just don't count here, so they aren't even a part of the topic. Critical thinking should be required courses at every stage of schooling life.

"How can you say FF8 gathers the most hatred when it's the fourth most popular out of a list of a dozen or more games"

Because gathering the most love =/= gathering the least hate. If you will take note the most liked game in the series is also the second most hated... but since I've already decided you lack certain critical thinking skills I suppose this argument is done.

"You just hate FF8 too much to admit it"

FF8 wouldn't be my least favorite in the series, let alone in gaming as a whole. Really, you have no idea what you're talking about. To quote Jerry Springer's guest "you don't know me", so stop acting like you have any sort of clue.

BTW, no less than 2 of my favorite characters of all time come from FF8... Quistis and Laguna.
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True love is a fairy tale. I'm damaged, so how would I know? - Plummet: Damaged

"It's a female-oriented game on a male-dominated site"

Something makes me thing you didn't understand a single word I said... perhaps it's the fact that your response is completely unrelated to what I was saying, I don't know.
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True love is a fairy tale. I'm damaged, so how would I know? - Plummet: Damaged

[This message was deleted at the request of the original poster]

Newlib: You can find flaws with any story of any given game in the universe, as cliche as it may sound, that's the point it's a game. So unless someone was claiming that FF7 had a perfect story that is unchallenged on all levels,(correct me if I'm wrong, I didn't bother to read the back log), I don't find your point. Loopholes are a part of everygame, and what makes for good laughs when you point them out to friends. On top of that I hardly find the Cloud history/Tifa reaction that unremarkable to believe.

Where's your proof? All you had to show me was a poll from four years ago with a minute vote total. Are you out to prove something? Have you just reached the end of your wits, so now you resort to name-calling? This is actually making me laugh. Seriously. Your superiority complex isn't impressing me. I have no idea who you are nor do I care.

I understand that gathering the most love is not equivalent to gathering the most hate. However, in one of your posts, you said, "it should be no wonder at all that it is voted least favorite FF." So now we're back to popularity instead of hatred. As I showed you, FF8 is the fourth favorite FF, not the least favorite. Try to pay a little more attention to the language we've all agreed upon.

How much longer are you going to make a fool of yourself? As for me, I'm off to bed. Later.

---
"Those who can't, emulate." - MegaPowerNinja
Official World Record Holder: Solstice, Super Mario World

"I understand that gathering the most love is not equivalent to gathering the most hate."

Funny, because you don't act like you know it.

"FF8 is the fourth favorite FF, not the least favorite."

It is both fourth favorite and most hated, I used the term "least favorite" to be kind to its more vocal fans. I didn't want to offend anyone who didn't make an ass of themselves by throwing mud first and acting like they didn't. And yes, the "name calling" started with your "are you blind?" comment. I want to make this very clear, because you are far from the first to sling bs at me then act like they didn't do it.

"Try to pay a little more attention to the language we've all agreed upon."

Here are some words in the language we agreed upon... I was being polite, you're being a ****.

"How much longer are you going to make a fool of yourself?"

Let's see... you insult me, I fight back. I bring information to the table, you act as if it doesn't exist. I tried my best to be as uninsulting to FF8 fans as I could be, you act like I'm an idiot...

Who is the fool, exactly?
---
True love is a fairy tale. I'm damaged, so how would I know? - Plummet: Damaged

Well, I have this feeling that Mario vs Bowse and MM vs. Tidus are going to cut a few people down, but not enough to matter much. That's how it should be, of course, but ya know... I just kinda miss the days when casual bracket makers were absolutely clueless. Alas, my hopes now ride on Tommy being overrated.
---
True love is a fairy tale. I'm damaged, so how would I know? - Plummet: Damaged

We lost one perfect yesterday. Turns out it was the one with Vivi winning it all. We also lost about 7 people who previously had 35 points. So that takes me from the top 130 to the top 123! I fully expect to be up on the leaderboard after Zero vs. Vercetti and if not, then Frog vs. Master Chief will get me up there.
---
SC2k4 Winner: Mega Man
Ken Masters; the fighting king clothed in blazing fire.

I think it's possible that quite a few people could side with Tidus. He's a Final Fantasy character and the front-page bracketmakers have always underestimated Mega Man.
---
SC2k4 Winner: Mega Man
Ken Masters; the fighting king clothed in blazing fire.

and if not, then Frog vs. Master Chief will get me up there.

oh, you have master chief winning too?
---
Today's Survivor topic can be found here, Please vote : )http://boards.gamefaqs.com/gfaqs/genmessage.php?board=8&topic=16070956

Nope. If I had Master Chief I'd be losing two points. =p
---
SC2k4 Winner: Mega Man
Ken Masters; the fighting king clothed in blazing fire.

Is this percentage good or bad for Mario in his upcoming Crono fight? I can't tell.

we shall see
---
Today's Survivor topic can be found here, Please vote : )http://boards.gamefaqs.com/gfaqs/genmessage.php?board=8&topic=16070956

"He's a Final Fantasy character and the front-page bracketmakers have always underestimated Mega Man."

In the past, yes.. but looking at Link and Crono's round 1 predictions compared to their round 2 predictions...I get the feeling that MM is going to have a lot of correct picks. I'm guessing over 50% which would be a lot considering that he had the potential of two very tough opponents. Link had no "dangerous" prospects, Crono only had one, and Yoshi didn't even drop by half... MM will take out a few when he wins, but not enough for my taste.
---
True love is a fairy tale. I'm damaged, so how would I know? - Plummet: Damaged

I wouldn't expect him to be under 50% or even at 55%, but I think it'll be enough for a match that will be so one sided.
---
SC2k4 Winner: Mega Man
Ken Masters; the fighting king clothed in blazing fire.

I expected more of Mario. SFF is too tricky for me to say this looks bad, or anything, but it could look better...
---
True love is a fairy tale. I'm damaged, so how would I know? - Plummet: Damaged

And that's so obvious.
---
SC2k4 Winner: Mega Man
Ken Masters; the fighting king clothed in blazing fire.

Well surely Mario can go up during the day, right? It's probably too early to judge, I think.
---
M-me? Queen ***** of the Universe?
This is the happiest day of my life. ~ smitelf

yeah, he can still go up, hopefully will too
---
Today's Survivor topic can be found here, Please vote : )http://boards.gamefaqs.com/gfaqs/genmessage.php?board=8&topic=16070956

The problem is that undoubtedly the perfects and one-offs will will score better than the norm. I have a feeling that even if it does dip to the low 50's we may not see more than a handful of our competition drop. Sure, that handful is soundly and permanently eliminated, but it's still not enough to quench my thirst.
---
True love is a fairy tale. I'm damaged, so how would I know? - Plummet: Damaged

I don't see how this could possibly prove to be bad for Mario. It's just not the most extreme case of SFF we've seen and I do expect him to go up during the day.
---
SC2k4 Winner: Mega Man
Ken Masters; the fighting king clothed in blazing fire.

Well, I mean I'm not expecting large dropoffs for a match like Mega Man vs Tidus but I think it'll be enough to make me happy. Now, I'd be disappointed if they all got smart and picked Zero over Vercetti.
---
SC2k4 Winner: Mega Man
Ken Masters; the fighting king clothed in blazing fire.

"It's just not the most extreme case of SFF we've seen"

That's the probelm, we were expecting more out of Mario... This is very close to Crono/Magus but we had reason to think Magus would get less SFF plus he was closer to Crono to begin with. If we went for a direct Mario-Crono/Bowser-Magus comparison Mario should been doing better. He has the day to go, still, but it just doesn't feel like it's enough to me...

But like I said, SFF is tricky so there's no certain way to tell.
---
True love is a fairy tale. I'm damaged, so how would I know? - Plummet: Damaged

"but I think it'll be enough to make me happy. "

You clearly have lower standards, I wish to taste top 50 by the time Zero finishes Vercetti.
---
True love is a fairy tale. I'm damaged, so how would I know? - Plummet: Damaged

Ryu beating Sora (assuming he does so) will do wonders for our chances. I bet over 60% of the people had him coming out of that 4-pack, and the rest does have to be divided between Jill and Ryu. That should be nice.
---
Man is equally incapable of seeing the nothingness from which he emerges and the infinity in which he is engulfed. -Blaise Pascal

SFF can be odd. While most were expecting better of Mario, he still is fairing better than Crono did at the point in time. I think he should end with over 75% of the vote.
---
SC2k4 Winner: Mega Man
Ken Masters; the fighting king clothed in blazing fire.

And by "had him" I meant "had Sora".
---
Man is equally incapable of seeing the nothingness from which he emerges and the infinity in which he is engulfed. -Blaise Pascal

All things considered I'd be in shock if Sora had much more than 50% backing. 60% seems too high for him. Ryu is going into it as the underdog, I'm sure, and when Ryu H wins we'll see a big boost... but that's too far away. Again, I want up there now.
---
True love is a fairy tale. I'm damaged, so how would I know? - Plummet: Damaged

I'm guessing no more than 23% will have Ryu in the third round.
---
Reggie: Kicking ass and taking names since E3 2004.
Nominate Kapp'n (Animal Crossing) for SC2K5!

"I'm guessing no more than 23% will have Ryu in the third round."

Nah, I see more than that. I doubt it was just the board that was confident in Ryu H/Jill being a 3 point match.
---
True love is a fairy tale. I'm damaged, so how would I know? - Plummet: Damaged

You clearly have lower standards, I wish to taste top 50 by the time Zero finishes Vercetti.

Well, yes, but we only need between 1 and 72 brackets to fall in order to crack the top 50. I Mega Man vs Tidus will do its share of taking down brackets and then I expect to reach it when Zero knocks off Vercetti.
---
SC2k4 Winner: Mega Man
Ken Masters; the fighting king clothed in blazing fire.

I won't be getting up there any time soon anyway, due to Yoshi beating Luigi, so I guess it doesn't matter to me when the perfects and -1's are axed, as long as they are.
---
Man is equally incapable of seeing the nothingness from which he emerges and the infinity in which he is engulfed. -Blaise Pascal

Just reached the top 50!! WOOT!!

I wouldn't be too surprised if the percentages for whoever won that fourpack, or, the three of them, would all be pretty close
---
Today's Survivor topic can be found here, Please vote : )http://boards.gamefaqs.com/gfaqs/genmessage.php?board=8&topic=16070956

I'm sure even Bowser's loss will take a tiny handful, but I have this feeling, thanks to it escaping us in the last round, we are pretty far back on that list.
---
True love is a fairy tale. I'm damaged, so how would I know? - Plummet: Damaged

I'd imagine we're in the 50-72 range.
---
SC2k4 Winner: Mega Man
Ken Masters; the fighting king clothed in blazing fire.

Mario's already doing a nice job of increasing right now.
---
SC2k4 Winner: Mega Man
Ken Masters; the fighting king clothed in blazing fire.

Perhaps it is so, but we'll have to see Ngamer hit the list before we can raise our hopes, no doubt. And I'd imagine Solar as well. We're withing reach, we just need a big jolt like Vercetti losing to do it... If I have to wait until Frog defeats MC I supose it'll be alright... but from there it's a long time until another big shakeup.
---
True love is a fairy tale. I'm damaged, so how would I know? - Plummet: Damaged

Maybe, though he's where I saw him when I first started commenting on his performance.
---
True love is a fairy tale. I'm damaged, so how would I know? - Plummet: Damaged

well, only if everything goes as expected, but that's assumed I suppose
---
Today's Survivor topic can be found here, Please vote : )http://boards.gamefaqs.com/gfaqs/genmessage.php?board=8&topic=16070956

Chance for failure comes down to two matches for the entire round. Two matches isn't much, and failure isn't an option. We'll see top 50 sooner or later, I just want it to be sooner.
---
True love is a fairy tale. I'm damaged, so how would I know? - Plummet: Damaged

Yeah. If Frog wins I'm absolutely certain we'll be up there.

I saw him settling around 71.3% earlier and then go up to around 72.3%.
---
SC2k4 Winner: Mega Man
Ken Masters; the fighting king clothed in blazing fire.

From: goku z | Posted: 9/6/2004 1:32:28 AM | Message Detail
Hmm, naw. FF8 would defeat 10 on GameFAQs.

I would bet my account against that in a second, and I would laugh my ass off after you lost.
---
Winner of the Spring 2004 'Best. Game. Ever.' Contest
*Married to smitelf on 5/21/04* ++SCC GOD++

I'm glad this'll be the last SFF match for a while.
---
SC2k4 Winner: Mega Man
Ken Masters; the fighting king clothed in blazing fire.

That isn't true. We have plenty of SFF matches forthcoming.

Mega Man vs Tidus - BOTH CHARACTERS APPEAR ON PLAYSTATION TWO.

Tommy Vercetti vs Zero - BOTH ARE BADASSED CHARACTERS THAT ALL THE LITTLE 13 YEAR OLDS WANT TO BE LIKE.

Frog vs Liquid Snake - BOTH HAVE AN IDENTITY CRISIS AND HAVE AN UNHEALTHY OBSESSION WITH CHARACTERS OF THE SAME SEX.

Knuckles vs Solid Snake - BOTH CHARACTERS APPEAR ON THE GAMECUBE.

Cloud vs Vyse - ONE IS A PIRATE, ONE IS A SOLDIER. COINCIDENCE? I THINK NOT!

Kirby vs Squall - BOTH CHARACTERS SUCK.

Ness vs Auron - BOTH CHARACTERS DO APPEARENCES OUTSIDE OF THEIR MAIN GAME.

And then comes Vivi vs Sephiroth.
---
Winner of the Spring 2004 'Best. Game. Ever.' Contest
*Married to smitelf on 5/21/04* ++SCC GOD++

XD. Someone's a smartass ^_^;.
---
M-me? Queen ***** of the Universe?
This is the happiest day of my life. ~ smitelf

BOTH CHARACTERS SUCK.

XD
---
SC2k4 Winner: Mega Man
Ken Masters; the fighting king clothed in blazing fire.

From: Mumei | Posted: 9/6/2004 3:49:40 AM | Message Detail
XD. Someone's a smartass ^_^;

I am well aware of this FACT, and I take pride in being the smartest ass of them all.
---
Winner of the Spring 2004 'Best. Game. Ever.' Contest
*Married to smitelf on 5/21/04* ++SCC GOD++

I am well aware of this FACT, and I take pride in being the smartest ass of them all.

You need to add that to your sig, somehow.

>_> <_<

*runs*
---
M-me? Queen ***** of the Universe?
This is the happiest day of my life. ~ smitelf

There is a certain HTML tag that allows for a three-lined sig, but I'll keep that information to myself. Few bans are lamer than sharing a bug.
---
Winner of the Spring 2004 'Best. Game. Ever.' Contest
*Married to smitelf on 5/21/04* ++SCC GOD++

Yeah, these SFF's suck because its hard to tell a character's strength from them.

However, i'd say that Mario's performance against Bowser is about as impressive as Crono's against Magus, because I find it hard to believe people would vote Crono just because he's the starring character.

Magus is well loved by many, and there are CT diehards who would swing either way.

Anyone understand what i'm trying to say? Because its hard to explain.
---
Sc2k4: 33 of 36
Next Match: Mario vs. Bowser

*laughs at ulti for posting frog vs liquid snake as an upcoming match*

*runs*
---
Score: 31/32
Hyrule picks: Link, Luigi, Crono, Mario

Liquid Snake is far easier to make fun of than Master Chief, though I would assume that chief has the same identity crisis. He IS a marine, you know.
---
Winner of the Spring 2004 'Best. Game. Ever.' Contest
*Married to smitelf on 5/21/04* ++SCC GOD++

I think I understood what you're saying perfectly. Chrono Trigger fans are more apt to vote Magus than Nintendo fans would be in terms of voting Bowser. Frankly, Crono holding Magus to 30% is far more impressive than Mario holding Bowser to 30%.
---
Winner of the Spring 2004 'Best. Game. Ever.' Contest
*Married to smitelf on 5/21/04* ++SCC GOD++

I think I understood what you're saying perfectly. Chrono Trigger fans are more apt to vote Magus than Nintendo fans would be in terms of voting Bowser. Frankly, Crono holding Magus to 30% is far more impressive than Mario holding Bowser to 30%.

Good, thats what I meant to say, you just found a better way of saying it. =P

Out of curiosity, who do you have between Crono and Mario, Ulti?

I think Crono's gotta victory set in stone.
---
Sc2k4: 35 of 38
Next Match: Mega Man vs. Tidus

He has Crono.

Unfortunately, my foretelling dream predicts a Mario victory by 218 votes. And my foretelling dreams have never been wrong. EVER.
---
The only reason this is here is because posts without sigs look ugly.

Besides...when you think about it, Magus did quite well against Link, being that he went up against the returning champion, suffered a moderate SFF, and is not the most popular chap in the contest. I think he got, what...35% against Link? Not too bad, and Crono got him in a stronger SFF match 70/30.

Things are looking good for the little mute.
---
Sc2k4: 35 of 38
Next Match: Mega Man vs. Tidus

And don't say that's because I've never even had a foretelling dream before. Because while true, that has nothing to do with it!
---
The only reason this is here is because posts without sigs look ugly.

Unfortunately, my foretelling dream predicts a Mario victory by 218 votes. And my foretelling dreams have never been wrong. EVER.

There's a first time for everything.
---
Sc2k4: 35 of 38
Next Match: Mega Man vs. Tidus

He's also never had a foretelling dream before.
---
Winner of the Spring 2004 'Best. Game. Ever.' Contest
*Married to smitelf on 5/21/04* ++SCC GOD++

I could be reading it backwards. Maybe Crono will win with 812...
---
The only reason this is here is because posts without sigs look ugly.

Oh, and I have Crono winning. But this isn't about my bracket, because I've already won one of these things. I'm all about rooting for my favorites from here on in. That said, Crono deserves some redemption after the last two contests.

Mathematically, I think Crono has the clear advantage. In the first contest, CJayC could have easily taken away 3000 votes for Crono. He took away only 400, so you should consider adding 2600 votes to Mario's final margain of victory that year. This makes Crono's performance in 2003 look even better, and if he maintains that level, he could beat Mario with relative ease this year. I wouldn't be surprised to see a match in the realm of 53-47.
---
Winner of the Spring 2004 'Best. Game. Ever.' Contest
*Married to smitelf on 5/21/04* ++SCC GOD++

Oh, and I have Crono winning. But this isn't about my bracket, because I've already won one of these things.

At the rate EB Games is sending your prize...

I'm all about rooting for my favorites from here on in. That said, Crono deserves some redemption after the last two contests.

Agreed.

Mathematically, I think Crono has the clear advantage. In the first contest, CJayC could have easily taken away 3000 votes for Crono. He took away only 400, so you should consider adding 2600 votes to Mario's final margain of victory that year. This makes Crono's performance in 2003 look even better, and if he maintains that level, he could beat Mario with relative ease this year. I wouldn't be surprised to see a match in the realm of 53-47.

It makes sense. My thinking is that, in 2003, Crono lost by less than 500 votes. The change in poll position has drastically decreased casual votes, and it seems to have benefitted RPG characters in general (Tidus and Auron being in the most popular polls, Ness's victory over mainstream Jak, Vivi destroying Donkey Kong).

When you take about 20 thousand total votes from a poll, it can mean a big difference in many matches that had less than 10 thousand previously.
---
Sc2k4: 35 of 38
Next Match: Mega Man vs. Tidus

And Kefka's much improved performance. I think that is related as well.
---
The only reason this is here is because posts without sigs look ugly.

And Kefka's much improved performance. I think that is related as well.

It changed, but I don't think that counts for much considering he went up against Crono last year and lost a lot of votes due to SFF. Besides, he still lost pretty well to a popular character in Knuckles.
---
Sc2k4: 35 of 38
Next Match: Mega Man vs. Tidus

Regardless of his performance against Crono, he still did barely better than Pac-Man, who performed against Luigi as if there WAS no SFF.

And I doubt that there's much difference between Pac-Man 2003 and Pac-Man 2004 to just suddenly drop like that. Hell, if you're already 25 years old, what's 26 years?
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The only reason this is here is because posts without sigs look ugly.

And I doubt that there's much difference between Pac-Man 2003 and Pac-Man 2004 to just suddenly drop like that. Hell, if you're already 25 years old, what's 26 years?

Pac Man isn't that strong. 2002 was the year where mediocre characters did well. Pac Man is the prime example.
---
Sc2k4: 35 of 38
Next Match: Mega Man vs. Tidus

I don't see how that's relevant at all to what I said...
---
The only reason this is here is because posts without sigs look ugly.

Its relevant because you're making Pac Man sound stronger than he really is.

What you said is pretty hard to understand anyway.
---
Sc2k4: 35 of 38
Next Match: Mega Man vs. Tidus

Besides, you theorized that there was SFF between Luigi and Pac Man. Huh?
---
Sc2k4: 35 of 38
Next Match: Mega Man vs. Tidus

SFF between Pac-Man and Luigi? What are you talking about?

I talked so cryptically because I pretty much assumed everyone these days was hip enough to the working of the XP rankings to know what I was referring to.
---
The only reason this is here is because posts without sigs look ugly.

Let me show you.

Regardless of his performance against Crono, he still did barely better than Pac-Man, who performed against Luigi as if there WAS no SFF.

You're saying that Pac Man performed against Luigi as if there was no SFF between them, suggesting that you think there is SFF between them, but that Pac Man outperformed it.
---
Sc2k4: 35 of 38
Next Match: Mega Man vs. Tidus

The SFF I was referring to was the SFF you mentioned between Kefka and Crono.

Luigi performed against Pac-Man as if there was no SFF between Crono and Kefka. I figured that goes without saying.
---
The only reason this is here is because posts without sigs look ugly.

Ahhh, I see what you're saying now.

Either way, I find it hard to believe there's absolutely no SFF between the two. Granted, it is a minute factor, but its still there. I think that Luigi is just handicapped by always being "that one guy player 2 never wants to be" whereas Yoshi is the cool dinosaur Mario rides on with the Princess while Luigi is left behind.

Yoshi just seemed to be the fan favorite.
---
Sc2k4: 35 of 38
Next Match: Mega Man vs. Tidus

Time for bed. I get the feeling Part 52 will already be up when I wake up. =P
---
Sc2k4: 35 of 38
Next Match: Mega Man vs. Tidus

I mean, you have to be a little confused right? You yourself said that Pac-Man is weak. This is the same Pac-Man that nearly performed just as well as Kefka.

The same Kefka who kept Knuckles under 60%.

Pac-Man would NEVER be able to keep Knuckles under 60%. Knuckles and Luigi probably aren't far apart after all, so Knuckles should get almost 70% on Pac-Man himself.

And I said Pac-Man from 2003 probably wasn't much different from Pac-Man from 2004. So explaining Kefka's performance against Knuckles by saying that "Pac-Man dropped" is silly, I'd say. When you're 20+ years old, Another year isn't going to affect you that much...
---
The only reason this is here is because posts without sigs look ugly.

How I wish Mega Man/Zero was the next match for another 70/30 SFF split.

I have yet to play a game in the MMX series, so I will of course be rooting for Zero in that match.
---
Winner of the Spring 2004 'Best. Game. Ever.' Contest
*Married to smitelf on 5/21/04* ++SCC GOD++

Would Kefka beat anyone else from FFIV?

I didn't read past this... W... T.. F.
---
"...for extremely well thought out and irrrefutable reasons that the poster below me will provide." ~Aeon Azuran

20th. Cool beans. Those last steps wil be the hardest. (Read : slowest) Zero winning against Vercetti should give me a nudge.

I've made the Top 10 this year, now I'm looking for the Top 5. Technically, we're all tied, but I still want to see myself up there.

So, what are we talking about today? (Booooooring, boring bracket makes for little interesting discussion.)

---
"Yeah, there seems to be some sort of pink...my god...my god! IT ATE JOHNSON! ~BluesASC on Kirbyzilla

Heroic Mario and Leonhart have just finished another bout of premature gloating about Tidus/Mega Man %-age.
---
"...for extremely well thought out and irrrefutable reasons that the poster below me will provide." ~Aeon Azuran

Hey I moved up two places today, looks like I'm 39th now.

Unfortunately the Vivi guy is gone now :(
---
Current SC2K4 Score: 37/38
COWS are for Milking, not GAMES

Let's see... Bowser would be expected to get 40.55% on Mario, so that means he's losing 12 points with SFF. Just a bit less than DK.

Still, that showing by Crono is just astounding. I gotta give the worthless redhead the nod as far as momentum goes. And 78% of the brackets having him reach the Sweet 16? Holy beejeezus, that's a **********ing lot. And he had much more trouble than last year, too... yet only 60% had him even getting to Mario back then.
---
SC2K4 Status - Points: 036/038 - Matches: 33/35 - Rank: 00123/33221 - Today: Mario - Tomorrow: Megaman

^^
Very true, what Crono did to Magus is making him look way up there in the standings. And unless Mario starts improving against Bowser, this year's MvC will go Crono's way.
---
Current SC2K4 Score: 37/38
COWS are for Milking, not GAMES

Whoa whoa whoa there. Let's not panic just yet, shall we?

Funny thing is, if we were to take each one of the last five matches' results for cash while neglecting each other, we'd have had four different projected champions. Samus, Link, Crono, and Mario - they've all performed above what Cloud could do.
---
SC2K4 Status - Points: 036/038 - Matches: 33/35 - Rank: 00123/33221 - Today: Mario - Tomorrow: Megaman

Maybe Crono can finally be the bracket favorite for Mario Vs. Crono for once.
---
The only reason this is here is because posts without sigs look ugly.

I wouldn't put it past the front-page bracketmakers... wait, yes, yes I would. They are THAT bad. Kefka the bracket favorite when he almost lost to Pac-Man the year before? Come on. If anything we're going to see a rise from last year's 65%.
---
SC2K4 Status - Points: 036/038 - Matches: 33/35 - Rank: 00123/33221 - Today: Mario - Tomorrow: Megaman

*agrees with Slowflake*
---
I have AgentONeal XTREME to thank for saving my life, ask me how!" "Bigboi was right. Tidus > Shadow." .38/40

Let's see... Bowser would be expected to get 40.55% on Mario, so that means he's losing 12 points with SFF. Just a bit less than DK.

Still, that showing by Crono is just astounding. I gotta give the worthless redhead the nod as far as momentum goes. And 78% of the brackets having him reach the Sweet 16? Holy beejeezus, that's a **********ing lot. And he had much more trouble than last year, too... yet only 60% had him even getting to Mario back then.

No it's not; SFF varies among everybody. Just because Bowser is suffering a lil' more from SFF than Magus is doesn't mean crap, really. The only thing you can possibly rely on is Crono/Conker, and Conker still broke over 20% on him.

Oh, and bet on Mario gettin' at least 90% of the brackets supportin' him into the Sweet Sixteen.
---
Supporting both Earthworm Jim AND Mega Man in 2004
Spring Contest Score: 151/192

Well, I believe Mario is doing fine. I suspected Bowser had some kind of fanbase here, and we know how Mario underperforms in his matches.

On to Mario/Crono III!
---
MC vs. Crash - http://www.stripcreator.com/comics/Moltar
Bowser vs. Mario - Bracket: Mario - Vote: Mario (36/38)

On the contrary, pal. Magus lost 16 points to SFF, against 12 for Bowser. I expected Magus to be much less SFF-able... then again, Crono nabbed quite a bit against another huge fan-favorite in Kefka.
---
SC2K4 Status - Points: 036/038 - Matches: 33/35 - Rank: 00123/33221 - Today: Mario - Tomorrow: Megaman

20XX Division: Round 1 - Match 37 – (1)Mega Man vs. (8)Tidus

Moltar’s Analysis

Mega Man - Because Super Man was taken, and Ultra Man just sounds lame.

Round 1 – vs. Earthworm Jim (Mega Man: 82.98% - Jim: 17.02%)

Mega Man showed that he hasn’t lost much strength, as he easily takes out the worm.

Tidus - Guess how often he goes to the salon…

Round 1 – vs. Shadow the Hedgehog (Tidus: 50.81% - JC: 49.19%)

In one of the most hyped matches of the Contest, Tidus shows us that he isn’t as hated as much as we think.

Alright, we can finally find out if Mega Man has gotten stronger or weaker since last year. Jim told us nothing, but Tidus will.

In 2002, Link was untouchable. The closest somebody got to beating him was Sephiroth, who got 43% on the hero. 2 rounds before, Mega Man faced Sephrioth. 6-seed vs. 7-seed. Mega Man came within 1,000 votes of taking Seph down. Quite impressive. Tidus, on the other hand, was on the north side of the division, with an 8-seed. He loses to Sonic in Round 2 by over 10,000 votes. Mega ranks 3rd in the Contest, Tidus ranks 11th.

In 2003, Mega is back with a 2 seed, while Tidus gets a 5. Ganondorf upsets Tidus in the 3rd match of the Contest, while Mega Man reaches the Final 4. This time he loses to Seph by a lot. Mega ranks 4th, Tidus ranks 13th.

Ok, why did I just recap the last 2 contests for these competitiors? I don’t know. I guess I’m trying to show that Mega Man has no chance of losing this match, but we should expect Tidus to put up a fight. Tidus is severely underrated in these Contests, thanks to tough opponents early on. I mean, getting past Shadow is no easy task, and Tidus did it. Maybe if he can get 40% on Mega, he’ll get some respect in the Contest. Too bad I’m mean though. >=)

Moltar’s Bracket Says:Mega Man will win.

Moltar’s Prediction is: Mega Man 61% - Tidus 39%



Ulti's Analysis

Everyone knows that Mega Man will win this, but what gets me is that everyone thinks that Mega Man will flat-out kill Tidus in this match. He won't. As hard as it may be to believe, Tidus should have no problems breaking 40% in this thing, and may swing 43% before all is said and done.

Ulti's Bracket/Prediction - Mega Man/Mega Man with 58.44%



Cena’s Analysis

You know, some people don't even think that Tidus is worthy of being anything but Mega Man's stepladder to success. Sure, Tidus has no chance of winning, but you're gonna sit there and tell me it won't be close? Please. This is Tidus we're talking about. I may hate the guy, but he's made his mark on these contests. He almost took out Ganondorf, he comfortably beat Shadow, without a worry of losing his place, and hell, it's only MM. Mega Man isn't going to put up much of a fight to defend himself. He's not on the same level Link, Cloud or Sephiroth. Hell, even Zelda, who does nothing got a good 40% on him, right? Tidus is the star of one of the most popular Final Fantasy games, one of the most sold games on the PS2, and because the game is so "I hate it" or "I love it", Tidus has brought a lot of attention to himself. This is GameFAQs, ladies and gentlemen, so Tidus is gonna do a hell of a lot better than Mega Man fans want. No need to worry, really, but let's just say Tidus = THREAT.EXE.

Cena’s Vote: Mega Man

Cena’s Prediction: Mega Man with 63% (Might be lower, but I'll give Mega Man an edge)

---
MC vs. Crash - http://www.stripcreator.com/comics/Moltar
Bowser vs. Mario - Bracket: Mario - Vote: Mario (36/38)

72-28... Meh, Bowser's not getting destroyed that badly by SFF.

As for tommorrow, I think MegaMan'll beat Tidus 62.5-37.5
---
I am the Angel of Death. The day of purification has come.

Well I'm not surprised.

Don't forget that Bowser is a legend too, so hitting Link vs. Ganondorf lows isn't possible since I know a few people that would vote Bowser over Mario
---
Summer 2004 Contest 31/36 Crono vs. Magus

Damn Frances.... kept knockin the power on and off. I JUST caught up with what's been going on. ChichiriMuyo getting in another fight... More MegaTidus debates... *yawn*

Well, I'm glad Bowser isn't getting his ass handed to him like Ganondorf did. I still wish he did a little more damage to Mario, if only to keep his respectability up. SFF matches don't really mean much. It's pretty much a cage match saying "Who do you like more?" with little effect on the outside world.

But even saying that, I'm not surprised that Crono got 70% on Magus. In that case, it's a little different. You most likely have to have PLAYED Chrono Trigger to like Magus better than Crono. I don't think Chrono Trigger can be called a video game staple like playing Mario 64, OoT, or FFVII. I'm sure there are many people who haven't played it. Nonetheless, it doesn't mean that they won't support it, so I can still see these people knowing who Crono is, but not being as familiar with Magus, thus the lopsided 70-30 split.
---
"There are only 10 kinds of people in this world, those that read binary and those that don't."

Oh yeah, I DID vote for Bowser. I'd vote Bowser AND each of the Koopalings over Mario....
---
"There are only 10 kinds of people in this world, those that read binary and those that don't."

*voted Magus, but never played Chrono Trigger*

Crono does look cooler though, IMO.
---
In short, Luigi was never cool. Ever. Except for in the original Smash Brothers when he ****ing owned everything at will. ~ Ulti

Crono looks cooler than Magus? You out of our mind?
---
Winner of the Spring 2004 'Best. Game. Ever.' Contest
*Married to smitelf on 5/21/04* ++SCC GOD++

Hey, I'm entitled to my own opinion, aren't I?

I think he looks much cooler than Magus. Actually I think Magus looks stupid.
---
In short, Luigi was never cool. Ever. Except for in the original Smash Brothers when he ****ing owned everything at will. ~ Ulti

I had no preference, really; I only voted Magus to try to get Luca's final extrapolated ranking a lil' higher...and it's not like I even know who Luca is besides what game he's from, heh. I just want the extrapolated to be as screwed up as possible, since Alucard and Ganondorf are already below CATS.
---
Supporting both Earthworm Jim AND Mega Man in 2004
Spring Contest Score: 151/192

That you are. It's just my opinion that Magus looks superior to Crono when we're duscussing nothing but the sprites.

As for the anime, Crono looks better.
---
Winner of the Spring 2004 'Best. Game. Ever.' Contest
*Married to smitelf on 5/21/04* ++SCC GOD++

Magus' sprite indeed pwns. But Crono's pic on the menu screen >>> Magus'.
---
"...for extremely well thought out and irrrefutable reasons that the poster below me will provide." ~Aeon Azuran

Wow, now that you mention Bowser is expected to get 41% against Mario, I guess doing what he's doing now isn't all the good...in any case, proportion-wise, SFF is less in Mario vs. Bowser than in Mario vs. DK, thank goodness. (though I don't know if that is "mathematically correct", else you could say that if there was another CT character that would beat Magus with 60%, that he/she would still lose to Crono!)

I think it would be interesting to see at about what relative strength between two characters would cause the biggest change in votes (for example, if A would beat B without SFF with 75%, and A would beat B with 70% without SFF, yet they were both actually afflicted with SFF, who would be effected more? At one percentage would the MAXIMUM SFF be?) Of course, different characters behave differently, anway...

As for 78.5% having Crono in Round 3, I was actually expecting higher. Seriously, the only competition Crono had (bracket-wise) in that division was Magus, and how many brackets would actually expect Magus to beat the main hero?

---
"Ah, a party! We haven't had one of those. It could be fun! So...what is a party?"
"Well, you drink punch and eat CAKE! ...I think."

Goodness, I figured beating Shadow (who got 45% on Mario) would be enough to get Tidus the proper respect he deserves. I guess we'll have to wait until tomorrow.
---
Squall Leonhart's Road to the Summer Championship
2nd Round: (5)Kirby

Actually, I take it back...Everyone will just start thinking Mega Man got weaker all of a sudden.
---
Squall Leonhart's Road to the Summer Championship
2nd Round: (5)Kirby

Obviously, if Tidus is not tripled, MegaMan will lose to Snake ¬_¬
---
BtT: 3:57.10 | HRC: 50,053.8 ft OV aaaargh
Crash.

Sad but true, Leonhart...but I still think Mega Man'll beat Tidus close to 60-40, and I don't see much of a reason of how it won't happen.
---
Supporting both Earthworm Jim AND Mega Man in 2004
Spring Contest Score: 151/192

Obviously, if Tidus is not tripled, MegaMan will lose to Snake ¬_¬

Yeah Right.. No ****ing way Tidus is going to get tripled by Megaman.. 75-25????!!!?? Impossible even for Link himself..

Megaman will beat Solid Snake no matter the circumstances..


---
SC2K4 Winner: Cloud Strife
Next Target: Vyse

Tag for uber justice!

---
GameFAQs can gain justice from this petition! Please visit it at http://boards.gamefaqs.com/gfaqs/genmessage.php?board=7&topic=15656619 (1065 Signs!)

Mega Man wouldn't be projected to break 60% on him right now. Whatever increase Mega Man could get from MMAC, Tidus can cancel it out with Final Fantasy X-2. That being said, both increases probably weren't that much anyway. The Blue Bomber would have to be quite a bit stronger than Mario to break 60.
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Squall Leonhart's Road to the Summer Championship
2nd Round: (5)Kirby

I agree. There is no way Tidus is getting tripled against Mega Man, the only people who could triple Tidus are Cloud or Sephiroth, and thats solely based on an SFF match.

Gosh, I can't wait to see how many people picked Vercetti to win...cause once he loses, i'm gonna be quite happy to move up in the bracket ranks.
---
Sc2k4: 35 of 38
Next Match: Mega Man vs. Tidus

I think Cloud and Sephiroth would have difficulty breaking 70% on Tidus, SFF and all.
---
Squall Leonhart's Road to the Summer Championship
2nd Round: (5)Kirby

Guys, Janus was usin' sarcasm.
---
Supporting both Earthworm Jim AND Mega Man in 2004
Spring Contest Score: 151/192

Tidus isn't cool enough to get 40% on Mega Man. Haven't you infidels been reading board opinion in this contest?

¬_¬
---
Winner of the Spring 2004 'Best. Game. Ever.' Contest
*Married to smitelf on 5/21/04* ++SCC GOD++

I agree with Leonhart4 ... It will be difficult for Sephiroth or Cloud to break 70% on Tidus even due to SFF ... They are from different game (besides Kingdom Hearts) and extreme SFF only happens when characters from the same game face each other.. It COULD happen though..

---
SC2K4 Winner: Cloud Strife
Next Target: Vyse

I kinda knew Mega couldn't triple tee-dus... I doubt Cloud could either, unless for some weird reason Tidus is weaker than Auron.
---
BtT: 3:57.10 | HRC: 50,053.8 ft OV aaaargh
Crash.

In a Tidus vs. Auron match, it could be very ugly due to SFF..

---
SC2K4 Winner: Cloud Strife
Next Target: Vyse

What do the extrapolated rankings say Tidus should get on Megaman?
---
If history is to change, let it change! If the world is to be destroyed, so be it! If my fate is to die... I must simply laugh!!--Magus Zeal

[This message was deleted at the request of the original poster]

I don't know the exact numbers, but I think it's somewhere around 43-44% for Tidus.
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Squall Leonhart's Road to the Summer Championship
2nd Round: (5)Kirby

Obviously, if Tidus is not tripled, MegaMan will lose to Snake ¬_¬

Obviously you have no idea what you're talking about. Not even Link could triple Tidus. All he has to do in win and he'll take out Snake, that's not the worry here.

Supporting both Earthworm Jim AND Mega Man in 2004

Mega Man wouldn't be projected to break 60% on him right now.

Yes, this is true, but why go by something that is so false?

Whatever increase Mega Man could get from MMAC, Tidus can cancel it out with Final Fantasy X-2.

That's laughable.

That being said, both increases probably weren't that much anyway. The Blue Bomber would have to be quite a bit stronger than Mario to break 60.

And how would that be surprising? There's plenty of reason for Mega Man to be stronger than Mario. I'm fully expecting there to be a gap inbetween Mega Man and Mario/Crono.


Tidus isn't cool enough to get 40% on Mega Man.

That's so true. ;) Tidus isn't even cool enough to break 5% but sadly he will... well maybe that's because Mega Man is just too cool.

What do the extrapolated rankings say Tidus should get on Megaman?

Around the 42-43% area.
---
SC2k4 Winner: Mega Man
Ken Masters; the fighting king clothed in blazing fire.

Oh and thumbs to to Moltar and Cena on those prediction percentages. ;)
---
SC2k4 Winner: Mega Man
Ken Masters; the fighting king clothed in blazing fire.

Obviously you have no idea what you're talking about. Not even Link could triple Tidus. All he has to do in win and he'll take out Snake, that's not the worry here.

Um... I think that comment was poking fun at the people on the board that severely underrate Tidus.
---
M-me? Queen ***** of the Universe?
This is the happiest day of my life. ~ smitelf

*cough* I knew that. <<
---
SC2k4 Winner: Mega Man
Ken Masters; the fighting king clothed in blazing fire.

Yes, this is true, but why go by something that is so false?

The extrapolateds are generally very accurate. That's not really false. It's not going to get the percentage down to the 1000th, but it's close.

Whatever increase Mega Man could get from MMAC, Tidus can cancel it out with Final Fantasy X-2.

That's laughable.

Show me why that's laughable. Sonic got no noticeable boost from the Mega Collection, and it had much longer to sink in with the general public. It's also sold more than MMAC despite being released on only one console. And since Sonic Mega Collection is now being released on more consoles later this year, I guess I should pencil in Sonic as my Summer Contest 2005 winner, huh?
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Squall Leonhart's Road to the Summer Championship
2nd Round: (5)Kirby

MM % the rest of this contest:

MM 59%, Tidus 41%
MM 74%, Zero 26%
MM 54%, Snake 46%
MM 44%, Link 56%
---
This is goku z. 36/38 SC2k4 (Yoshi)
wtf is a kegel?~PhantomTrain

The extrapolateds are generally very accurate. That's not really false. It's not going to get the percentage down to the 1000th, but it's close.

Obviously they are inaccurate when trying to create false hope for those who want to believe Tidus will somehow break 40%. ;)

Show me why that's laughable. Sonic got no noticeable boost from the Mega Collection, and it had much longer to sink in with the general public.

I've been over and over and over why a collection aimed at purely one console as opposed to two will not be as effective as releasing on two consoles. With two you, especially when one is the PS2, you get more people buying the game and a different set of people getting into it.

It's also sold more than MMAC despite being released on only one console.

Yeah, let's not forget it has been out for nearly two years now. That couldn't possibly have anything to do with it.

And since Sonic Mega Collection is now being released on more consoles later this year, I guess I should pencil in Sonic as my Summer Contest 2005 winner, huh?

Anyone who doesn't pencil in their winner, next year, as Cloud or Link is pretty stupid. I'm not even going to bother trying to come for reasoning to combat Advent Children or Zelda 10.
---
SC2k4 Winner: Mega Man
Ken Masters; the fighting king clothed in blazing fire.

I have both SMC and MMAC, and I would say AC had more of an impact. Not because I like MM games more (I don't) but because people have already played the Sonic games....MM games are super hard to find, other then 8...
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This is goku z. 36/38 SC2k4 (Yoshi)
wtf is a kegel?~PhantomTrain

Oh please, why does it matter what Link or Cloud do when a collection aimed at gamers who are already fans of the series can give Sonic an unfathomable boost in popularity?
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Squall Leonhart's Road to the Summer Championship
2nd Round: (5)Kirby

I also have Zelda: Collector's Edition. I'm pretty fond of collections hehehe.
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This is goku z. 36/38 SC2k4 (Yoshi)
wtf is a kegel?~PhantomTrain

Heck you want numbers on Sonic Mega Collection? It's been out for a whole two years and it has sold 537,000 copies. Mega Man Anniversary Collection has been out for about 2 months and has sold 252,000 (lastest numbers of July 2004).
---
SC2k4 Winner: Mega Man
Ken Masters; the fighting king clothed in blazing fire.

Yeah, let's not forget it has been out for nearly two years now. That couldn't possibly have anything to do with it.

That's beside the point. The fact is that it's still sold more, and it had greater sales this time last year than MMAC does now. Also, despite PS2 being the big console here, the AC isn't selling all that well for it.
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Squall Leonhart's Road to the Summer Championship
2nd Round: (5)Kirby

If MMAC truly did benefit from being on two consoles, than how come the GCN version was the only one that made the Top 10 FAQS?
---
If history is to change, let it change! If the world is to be destroyed, so be it! If my fate is to die... I must simply laugh!!--Magus Zeal

Hmmm...I wonder how many MMAC will have sold after 2 years when the initial hype for it wears off. Probably not much more than that per console, and I doubt the PS2 version will ever get that high.
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Squall Leonhart's Road to the Summer Championship
2nd Round: (5)Kirby

*just woke up*

...Sheesh. Mario getting 70% on Bowser, I guess we shouldn't be surprised after the last few days, though I find it funny that some people were expecting it to be worse.

---
"Those who can't, emulate." - MegaPowerNinja
Official World Record Holder: Solstice, Super Mario World

I bought the GCN version of MMAC because I like to support the Big N whenever I can.
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This is goku z. 36/38 SC2k4 (Yoshi)
wtf is a kegel?~PhantomTrain

Oh please, why does it matter what Link or Cloud do when a collection aimed at gamers who are already fans of the series can give Sonic an unfathomable boost in popularity?

Capcom's initial intention wasn't to create the collection for already existing fans of Mega Man. Considering the fact that many people have missed out on playing the classic series because it was basically all on the NES. Now they get a chance to have all of them in one nice package on the GCN/PS2.

That's beside the point. The fact is that it's still sold more,

Oh really? I suppose a game that's been out for four years can be compared to a game that's been out for one month. "Hey! That game sold like crap compared to this four year game! But there's no possible way the time of release matters!"

and it had greater sales this time last year than MMAC does now. Also, despite PS2 being the big console here, the AC isn't selling all that well for it.

A big 300,000 more in two years compared to two months. If anything MMAC is doing a far better job than SMC.
---
SC2k4 Winner: Mega Man
Ken Masters; the fighting king clothed in blazing fire.

Speaking of collections, does anyone know a release date for MMAC in Europe?
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Jon Thomson - today: Mario, tomorrow: Mega Man - 30/38
Nominate Ridley for Summer Contest 2005

I hate to tell you this, but thoae who hasn't played those Megaman games that are on MMAC wouldn't care much for it now either. The young kids will just think it has bad graphic and dis it for that. No one will ever gain anything from a collection.
---
I have AgentONeal XTREME to thank for saving my life, ask me how!" "Bigboi was right. Tidus > Shadow." .38/40

If MMAC truly did benefit from being on two consoles, than how come the GCN version was the only one that made the Top 10 FAQS?

The GCN has sold more, by a little bit, than the PS2 version. The PS2 version wasn't on the Top 10 FAQS but it was on the list at around 16th or so and it was at number one on the PS2 Top 10 for a while.

There was an "invasion" of Mega Man shortly after both were released.

Hmmm...I wonder how many MMAC will have sold after 2 years when the initial hype for it wears off.

Probably far more than 500,000 copies with two consoles to pull from.

Probably not much more than that per console, and I doubt the PS2 version will ever get that high.

The PS2 version actually outsold the GCN version last month.
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SC2k4 Winner: Mega Man
Ken Masters; the fighting king clothed in blazing fire.

Speaking of collections, does anyone know a release date for MMAC in Europe?

Not set release date right now. Hopefully Capcom releases it over there sometime.

I hate to tell you this, but thoae who hasn't played those Megaman games that are on MMAC wouldn't care much for it now either.

You know this how?
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SC2k4 Winner: Mega Man
Ken Masters; the fighting king clothed in blazing fire.

Capcom's initial intention wasn't to create the collection for already existing fans of Mega Man.

Yes, and I'm sure Sega had the same intentions Capcom does.

Do you happen to have the initial sales for Sonic Mega Collection for the first few months? I would think that's when a good majority of the sales were made.

Look, the point of time of release is that the Mega Collection has had more time to sink in and it STILL has done nothing for Sonic. It's had more sales and it's STILL done nothing for Sonic.
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Squall Leonhart's Road to the Summer Championship
2nd Round: (5)Kirby

You know this how?

Because if you never cared to play Mega Man games before, why would you want to when it's just a re-release of all the old games?
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Squall Leonhart's Road to the Summer Championship
2nd Round: (5)Kirby

Yes, and I'm sure Sega had the same intentions Capcom does.

Probably so. Which is why I have no idea why they would release it purely on the GCN, when you do that sort of thing you want to appeal to as many people as possible. They resorted to one particular area by releasing it on one console. Thankfully, they decided to give it to the PS2 crowd.

Do you happen to have the initial sales for Sonic Mega Collection for the first few months? I would think that's when a good majority of the sales were made.

I could probably run a quick check.

Look, the point of time of release is that the Mega Collection has had more time to sink in and it STILL has done nothing for Sonic. It's had more sales and it's STILL done nothing for Sonic.

So because Sonic doesn't get a boost it must be impossibe right?
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SC2k4 Winner: Mega Man
Ken Masters; the fighting king clothed in blazing fire.

Both MMAC and FFX-2 won't change the power of their respective leads noticably.

At all.


That's all I'll say on the matter.

---
-To be replaced by funny comment any day now-

bleh
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Wisconsin>j00
i live in Wisconsin, there for, Me>j00

Probably far more than 500,000 copies with two consoles to pull from.

If you read the next sentence, I noted that it would sell more in the long run being released on two consoles. I was just saying that, per console, I doubt the numbers would exceed Sonic Mega Collection by a vast amount.
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Squall Leonhart's Road to the Summer Championship
2nd Round: (5)Kirby

So because Sonic doesn't get a boost it must be impossibe right?

Never said that. I'm just saying that the chances of it are slim.
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Squall Leonhart's Road to the Summer Championship
2nd Round: (5)Kirby

You know this how?

Common sense, those (I'm sorry for mispelling that word in my previous post) who already havn't seen the greatness of Megaman won't think that he's something special. I don't think someone who don't like/don't know who MEgaman is will buy a game that's over 8 years old that has nes graphic.

I however will buy it when it comes here to Europe, and I will enjoy it, because I knw that those games are good, but I don't think a collection will get him more votes.


---
I have AgentONeal XTREME to thank for saving my life, ask me how!" "Bigboi was right. Tidus > Shadow." .38/40

I've never seen Leonheart say anything that didn't seem plausible, within reason, or poorly argumented. As far as I'm concerned, he's the heir to Slowflake's thrown. :p

Of course, he'll have to kill him, as Slowflake did to Solarshadow.

---
-To be replaced by funny comment any day now-

Because if you never cared to play Mega Man games before, why would you want to when it's just a re-release of all the old games?

There are plenty of people out there who haven't even touched an original Mega Man before. Unlike Sonic, whose games were all from the 16-bit era, Mega Man's games were majorly from the 8-bit era. There are plenty of people who started in Sonic's time over Mega Man's time at GameFAQs.

Mega Man has had two console games so far: Mega Man X7 and Mega Man Network Transmission. Neither were praised and both were directed toward one specific console. MMAC is the highest selling Mega Man console game this generation giving it something of credit.

When you check the pricetag of MMAC ($30) and you get 10 classic games. There's enough reason for people to go out and buy, or at least try it, to get their taste of Mega Man. It's out there and it surely can appeal to those who haven't had the best of luck with Mega Man this generation. Again, it also stretches across two consoles (the two most dominant ones at GameFAQs) so not to alienate any particular group.

And I know damn well people at GameFAQs bought the game when it was released when every NES FAQ was Mega Man 1-6 and both versions boosted up on the Top FAQ list. Not to say that's a sole reason, but for a game that's supposed to not do much MMAC surely has the potential too.

In closing, you cannot tell me there's no way for this happen. You just can't. Not until statistics show Mega Man barely nudging.
---
SC2k4 Winner: Mega Man
Ken Masters; the fighting king clothed in blazing fire.

Not until statistics show Mega Man barely nudging.

So...Until tomorrow then?
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Squall Leonhart's Road to the Summer Championship
2nd Round: (5)Kirby

Cloud asks Vincent: " Is it possible to be forgiven for a sin? "

Vincent replies: " I never tried. "

*hopes that this awesome quote pushes Vincent to nominee level...*
---
" I won't be just a memory...."- Sephiroth, FF VII:AC

I'm waiting to officially judge Mega's strength until he faces Snake.

Tomorrow should give a small clue to where he is though...
---
Snake vs. Tanner - http://www.stripcreator.com/comics/Moltar
Bowser vs. Mario - Bracket: Mario - Vote: Mario (36/38)

Both MMAC and FFX-2 won't change the power of their respective leads noticably.

At all.

Prove it to me, buddy.

I doubt the numbers would exceed Sonic Mega Collection by a vast amount.

If it sold 500,000 per console. That's 1 million units. I cannot think of the last time a Mega Man game did that other than the a Battle Network game.

Never said that. I'm just saying that the chances of it are slim.

You seem to have been nudging toward it not happening. With the sole reasoning that it didn't help Sonic.

Common sense, those (I'm sorry for mispelling that word in my previous post) who already havn't seen the greatness of Megaman won't think that he's something special.

If someone wasn't able to play Mega Man when he was at his best (NES, 8-bit) and then gets a chance too wouldn't you think their opinion could have easily changed?

I don't think someone who don't like/don't know who MEgaman is will buy a game that's over 8 years old that has nes graphic.

It doesn't have to look amazing in graphical power for people to buy it. Now, I will agree with you on the fact that people who have played these old 8-bit games didn't like them then definitely aren't going to like them now. It's the people who haven't that will be the key..
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SC2k4 Winner: Mega Man
Ken Masters; the fighting king clothed in blazing fire.

So...Until tomorrow then?

Bring it on. ;)
---
SC2k4 Winner: Mega Man
Ken Masters; the fighting king clothed in blazing fire.

Unlike Sonic, whose games were all from the 16-bit era, Mega Man's games were majorly from the 8-bit era.

But he also had the X series starting from the 16-bit era and up to grab those new fans. Mega Man is Mega Man. His games all have pretty similar gameplay and style...Well, they used to be anyway. They've been getting some variety lately.
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Squall Leonhart's Road to the Summer Championship
2nd Round: (5)Kirby

*hopes that this awesome quote pushes Vincent to nominee level...*

I think he'll get in next year. =)
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SC2k4 Winner: Mega Man
Ken Masters; the fighting king clothed in blazing fire.

But he also had the X series starting from the 16-bit era and up to grab those new fans.

The X series and classic series are different in many aspects, but contain the same formula of "Defeat boss, gain power, move onto next boss."

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SC2k4 Winner: Mega Man
Ken Masters; the fighting king clothed in blazing fire.

You seem to have been nudging toward it not happening. With the sole reasoning that it didn't help Sonic.

No, I believe that no matter how much Capcom markets it to new fans, I still think it won't create more diversity in the fanbase.
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Squall Leonhart's Road to the Summer Championship
2nd Round: (5)Kirby

Heroic Mario, I think we should focus on what's important,

Megaman will reach the final four
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I have AgentONeal XTREME to thank for saving my life, ask me how!" "Bigboi was right. Tidus > Shadow." .38/40

The X series and classic series are different in many aspects, but contain the same formula of "Defeat boss, gain power, move onto next boss."

Yeah, that's the basic concept of Mega Man games. If you liked it with X, you'd probably like it with the originals even though you've never played them.
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Squall Leonhart's Road to the Summer Championship
2nd Round: (5)Kirby

If you liked it with X, you'd probably like it with the originals even though you've never played them.

Not necessarily. I know plenty of people who can't stand the X series in comparison to the originals.
---
SC2k4 Winner: Mega Man
Ken Masters; the fighting king clothed in blazing fire.

Mooninites: "Using a key to gouge expletives on another's vehicle is a sign of trust and friendship."
Carl: "Who did this to my freakin' car?!"

>_>

---
"Those who can't, emulate." - MegaPowerNinja
Official World Record Holder: Solstice, Super Mario World

Well, I know it won't be unanimous across the board, but the basic concept is the same. People who've only played the X series before and buy MMAC aren't going to experience some miraculous revelation of the awesomeness of Mega Man from it. The basic concept of it is still the same. They might like the games better, but I don't know if it would change their opinion of Mega Man as a character.
---
Squall Leonhart's Road to the Summer Championship
2nd Round: (5)Kirby

I know plenty of people who can't stand the X series in comparison to the originals.

Seriously? You'd think they would at least appreciate the first game, X1.

---
"Those who can't, emulate." - MegaPowerNinja
Official World Record Holder: Solstice, Super Mario World

About the subject of collections:

I know it wasn't sold seperately, but The Legend of Zelda Collector's disk was packaged with the Gamecube for awhile. How many GCN's were sold in the period where that bundle took place? Just a ballpark number would be nice.
---
M-me? Queen ***** of the Universe?
This is the happiest day of my life. ~ smitelf

It doesn't have to look amazing in graphical power for people to buy it. Now, I will agree with you on the fact that people who have played these old 8-bit games didn't like them then definitely aren't going to like them now. It's the people who haven't that will be the key.

I hate to break it to you but most of the people who have never even tried a mega man game are probably new, casual gamers, and the vast majority of new, casual gamers are graphic junkies.
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The topic is dead. Not the kind of dead that can be cured with a Phoenix Down. I'm talking FMV sequence dead.- The King in Teal

I hate to break it to you but most of the people who have never even tried a mega man game are probably new, casual gamers, and the vast majority of new, casual gamers are graphic junkies.

They don't all have to come from this generation in order to have not played the Mega Man games. Even coming from the SNES era and not having played a Mega Man game wouldn't exactly come as a surprise. Just as an example, and not meaning to display every person, there are a few people on this board who haven't played a Mega Man game before and just got MMAC.
---
SC2k4 Winner: Mega Man
Ken Masters; the fighting king clothed in blazing fire.

I actually like the MegaMan graphics. I haven't played them, my brothers have been, but the graphics are pretty nice.
---
Today's Survivor topic can be found here, Please vote : )http://boards.gamefaqs.com/gfaqs/genmessage.php?board=8&topic=16070956

Just as an example, and not meaning to display every person, there are a few people on this board who haven't played a Mega Man game before and just got MMAC.

*Raises hand*

I think I voted for MM in the other contests anyway, but now I'm sure I will.
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Current Pick: Mario; Current Vote: Mario; Points: 35/38
SFF, yo!

They don't all have to come from this generation in order to have not played the Mega Man games. Even coming from the SNES era and not having played a Mega Man game wouldn't exactly come as a surprise. Just as an example, and not meaning to display every person, there are a few people on this board who haven't played a Mega Man game before and just got MMAC.

Of course there are some people who aren't new casuals and still haven't played them. Just most. And I am an example of a person who never played a Mega Man game prior to MMAC.
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The topic is dead. Not the kind of dead that can be cured with a Phoenix Down. I'm talking FMV sequence dead.- The King in Teal

Even coming from the SNES era and not having played a Mega Man game wouldn't exactly come as a surprise.

That would be my situation. But he does have a point; for example, my younger brother (14) wouldn't play any of the MMAC games just because of the graphics. He loves the SNES, because that was the first console we had, but it took forever to convince him to try them, just because he has something against the NES level graphics. =(
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M-me? Queen ***** of the Universe?
This is the happiest day of my life. ~ smitelf

Of course there are some people who aren't new casuals and still haven't played them. Just most. And I am an example of a person who never played a Mega Man game prior to MMAC.

Just trying to tell ya, not everyone is a "graphics whore".
---
SC2k4 Winner: Mega Man
Ken Masters; the fighting king clothed in blazing fire.

Just trying to tell ya, not everyone is a "graphics whore".

But most people new to gaming are. Hell, my friend isn't new to gaming and still complained about Mega Man's graphics. I smacked him and he stopped but I can't do that to everyone.
---
The topic is dead. Not the kind of dead that can be cured with a Phoenix Down. I'm talking FMV sequence dead.- The King in Teal

But most people new to gaming are. Hell, my friend isn't new to gaming and still complained about Mega Man's graphics. I smacked him and he stopped but I can't do that to everyone.

I didn't say everyone wasn't, and I know there are people out there who are. There have been plenty of "graphical" games out there that MMAC has outsold and even other Mega Man games it has outsold this generation.

And it would really depend on how "new".
---
SC2k4 Winner: Mega Man
Ken Masters; the fighting king clothed in blazing fire.

But most people new to gaming are. Hell, my friend isn't new to gaming and still complained about Mega Man's graphics. I smacked him and he stopped but I can't do that to everyone.

I run into that problem all the time. But I'd never get anywhere if I smacked every stupid person I met.

---
"Those who can't, emulate." - MegaPowerNinja
Official World Record Holder: Solstice, Super Mario World

Both MMAC and FFX-2 won't change the power of their respective leads noticably.

At all.

Word.
---
SC2K4 Status - Points: 036/038 - Matches: 33/35 - Rank: 00123/33221 - Today: Mario - Tomorrow: Megaman

I would love to point out that I am not really a fan of the X series, I can deffinately understand how people could consider the original series vastly superior and unfortunately getting ahold of anything from that series is a pain most wouldn't have gone through until now. I'm not ecpecting anything huge out of Mega Man from this, but it should give him a small push if nothing else.
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True love is a fairy tale. I'm damaged, so how would I know? - Plummet: Damaged

Hmmmm, I'm the opposite. I like the X series far more than the Mega Man series. Well, up to X4 that is. The story element made the games more interesting and I liked the gameplay better. I guess I didn't play enough Megaman games on NES to get attached to the series, so I easily liked the X games better. I started on Megaman 2 when it came out and got Megaman 3, but I stopped after that. I played 4 but just a couple of times. For some reason, the original Megaman series didn't interest me anymore. I don't remember what other games I was playing at that time though....
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"There are only 10 kinds of people in this world, those that read binary and those that don't."

You know, the more I think about it the more likely it seems that Crono will be winning this year. <<
---
SC2k4 Winner: Mega Man
Ken Masters; the fighting king clothed in blazing fire.

You know, the more I think about it the more likely it seems that Crono will be winning this year. <<

I've been saying this for a while now. All signs point to Crono winning this year. In fact, I don't think it will even be close. Well, not close by Mario/Crono standards.

---
"Those who can't, emulate." - MegaPowerNinja
Official World Record Holder: Solstice, Super Mario World

Never give up on Mario. He found a way last year, he will find a way this year. (Even though my bracket says different LOL)

MMAC's problem is not the graphics. I don't care about those, but I DO care that it is too freaking hard. Unreasonably hard. Luckily, they put the easy settings in there, which makes MMAC that much better XD
---
This is goku z. 36/38 SC2k4 (Yoshi)
wtf is a kegel?~PhantomTrain

That's kind of the problem there. Even I know he shouldn't have won last year.
---
SC2k4 Winner: Mega Man
Ken Masters; the fighting king clothed in blazing fire.

But he did! BWAHAHAHA.

Right after that glorious match (Where I lost 4 points) I made this topic.


"PWN'D by Mario!"

BWAHAHAHAHAHA! Great, great stuff.
---
This is goku z. 36/38 SC2k4 (Yoshi)
wtf is a kegel?~PhantomTrain

Well, I have been arguing in Crono's favor for a long, long time now. In fact, the day that the spring contest was announced I was bold enough to say that it was an excellent chance for CT to spread itself a little more, gain that extra exposure its characters need, and push Crono over the top. Ever since that day I've been confident that Crono was set to beat Mario if they faced again, and I'm not backing down from that.
---
True love is a fairy tale. I'm damaged, so how would I know? - Plummet: Damaged

We can be the "if" and "maybe" game all we want. Mario's win was highly suspect, but that's all it is, suspect.
---
If history is to change, let it change! If the world is to be destroyed, so be it! If my fate is to die... I must simply laugh!!--Magus Zeal

Crono winning with 51% isn't something I would say would be surprising given how well he was doing last year.
---
SC2k4 Winner: Mega Man
Ken Masters; the fighting king clothed in blazing fire.

And I highly doubt that more than 50 people at the most went out and downloaded a ROM of Chrono Trigger because it got its ass handed to it in the final by Final Fantasy VII.
---
If history is to change, let it change! If the world is to be destroyed, so be it! If my fate is to die... I must simply laugh!!--Magus Zeal

With all this said, this is the last time I want to see Mario vs Crono.
---
SC2k4 Winner: Mega Man
Ken Masters; the fighting king clothed in blazing fire.

And I highly doubt that more than 50 people at the most went out and downloaded a ROM of Chrono Trigger because it got its ass handed to it in the final by Final Fantasy VII.

No. They downloaded it because it defeated Super Mario Bros 3 and A Link To The Past, and had the second-best performance against Final Fantasy VII.

---
"Those who can't, emulate." - MegaPowerNinja
Official World Record Holder: Solstice, Super Mario World

It beat A Link to the Past, Super Mario World, and Super Mario Bros. 3 while getting over 40% on FF7. I'm not saying they did, but you know.
---
SC2k4 Winner: Mega Man
Ken Masters; the fighting king clothed in blazing fire.

I agree. I hate matches that close...
---
" I won't be just a memory...."- Sephiroth, FF VII:AC

From: Heroic Mario | Posted: 9/6/2004 3:35:58 PM | Message Detail
With all this said, this is the last time I want to see Mario vs Crono.
---
Snake vs. Tanner - http://www.stripcreator.com/comics/Moltar
Bowser vs. Mario - Bracket: Mario - Vote: Mario (36/38)

This is the last time I want to see Solid Snake vs Knuckles. It's pointless, Knuckles deserves better.
---
Lonely Angel
Summer 2004 Contest Prediction: Match 36: Mario wins 79.81%-20.19%

I eagerly await Mass LUEshis after either character narrowly wins MvC III.
---
Summer Contest Match 33 Mario vs Bowser
Status 33/36 Points: 037 Next: Mega Man vs. Tidus

I hope CJC retires the big three after this contest...

Next years Final Four:

Mario vs Crono
MegaMan vs Samus

How awesomely unpredictable would that be?
---
This is goku z. 36/38 SC2k4 (Yoshi)
wtf is a kegel?~PhantomTrain

I want to see Aeris back in a contest, and I wanna see how well Tifa would do as well. I also think that maybe the winners should retire, to spice things up a bit. Because if Link or Cloud wins this year, then a sort of a pattern will develop.
---
Current SC2K4 Score: 37/38
COWS are for Milking, not GAMES

I for one would like to see Crono vs Mega Man.

---
"Those who can't, emulate." - MegaPowerNinja
Official World Record Holder: Solstice, Super Mario World

I think:
Mario > Mega Man
Mario > Samus
Crono > Mario
Samus > Crono
Mega Man > Samus

Pretty confusing >_>
---
This is goku z. 36/38 SC2k4 (Yoshi)
wtf is a kegel?~PhantomTrain

Oh, and Mega Man > Crono.
---
This is goku z. 36/38 SC2k4 (Yoshi)
wtf is a kegel?~PhantomTrain

"And I highly doubt that more than 50 people at the most went out and downloaded a ROM of Chrono Trigger because it got its ass handed to it in the final by Final Fantasy VII."

And that's all he'd need to have a decent chance at upsetting Mario. However, I disagree with your assement. Considering that Crono's loss in 2k2 had suspicion placed on him (it's said he should have lost by more) and his loss in 2k3 has the suspicion on Mario (Mario's late surge is strange, no doubt) it's believable that merely appearing in a contest has raised Crono awareness. An outstanding performance in the Spring should have been even more convincing to people. If it was, chances are Crono could get a sizable boost.
---
True love is a fairy tale. I'm damaged, so how would I know? - Plummet: Damaged

And the loss of thousands of votes thanks to the site redesign isn't doing Mario any favors either.

---
"Those who can't, emulate." - MegaPowerNinja
Official World Record Holder: Solstice, Super Mario World

I downloaded CT, not because of the Spring Contest, but because of all the hype it gets from this board. I love it. However, I don't see what's so great about Crono. He's just your generic hero boy, and I absolutely HATE the design. I am not a big fan of the anime style.

Now Frog on the other hand, he is now my second favorite character (to Viewtiful Joe, of course).
---
Summer Contest Match 33 Mario vs Bowser
Status 33/36 Points: 037 Next: Mega Man vs. Tidus

And the loss of thousands of votes thanks to the site redesign isn't doing Mario any favors either.

Why not? Square is very popular with the casual voters. FFX has been in the Top 10 FAQS since the day it came out.

What company always wins favorite company polls? What genre always wins favorite genre polls? These polls were done back before the site was redesigned and casual voters had more power in these polls. From what I can tell the boards are more pro-Nintendo than pro-Square.
---
If history is to change, let it change! If the world is to be destroyed, so be it! If my fate is to die... I must simply laugh!!--Magus Zeal

Frog is my second favorite character as well

1. Kain Highwind
2. Frog
3. Mario
4. Squall
5. Sonic
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This is goku z. 36/38 SC2k4 (Yoshi)
wtf is a kegel?~PhantomTrain

FFVII handed every game its ass in the Spring Contest. I knew it was gonna win, but I didn't think it would do it like THAT. That contest was easier to predict the later it got (besides Starcraft). I didn't think Chrono Trigger would have any problems getting to the finals either. I was pleasantly surprised that LttP was able to take the match to the wire. I underestimated it. I assumed that all the Zelda fanboys would rally to OoT and leave the other games in the dust (LttP & WW). Nonetheless, Chrono Trigger's showing DOES mean something in this contest. I can guarantee you that more than 50 people went and played Chrono Trigger after that.

And I hate Snake/Knuckles III myself. There's no reason why that match should have even been repeated, let alone THREEpeated... Knuckles is my favorite Sonic character. I want to see what he could REALLY do. It seems like the earlier you face one of the Noble Nine, the worse it makes you look (Squall, Fox, Knuckles, Ken, Auron). We already see what Squall and Auron can do when unleashed. Fox would do better than Ness in his spot. And I have no doubt that Ken could have done nearly the same thing that Ryu has done if he was given his spot. Even Strider and Raziel have been written off because they faced Link and Sephiroth early.
---
"There are only 10 kinds of people in this world, those that read binary and those that don't."

As of yet we haven't seen any reason to believe that the site redesign favors one of the other heavily. Considering the finals of the SpC, however, I'm certain Square isn't looking like it has lost anything at all.
---
True love is a fairy tale. I'm damaged, so how would I know? - Plummet: Damaged

Heh, Frog is my favorite, with Crono in second. Fanboyism? Possibly. ;x
---
"...for extremely well thought out and irrrefutable reasons that the poster below me will provide." ~Aeon Azuran

"It seems like the earlier you face one of the Noble Nine, the worse it makes you look"

Which is as it should be, the powerful cahracters weed out the weaklings as quickly as possible to ensure more enjoyable matches later.
---
True love is a fairy tale. I'm damaged, so how would I know? - Plummet: Damaged

Facing the Big Three make you look better, barring SFF.
---
"...for extremely well thought out and irrrefutable reasons that the poster below me will provide." ~Aeon Azuran

Which is as it should be, the powerful cahracters weed out the weaklings as quickly as possible to ensure more enjoyable matches later.

You missed my point. Do you really think Squall was a weakling that deserved to get his ass handed to him by Solid Snake in the first round? My point was some of the characters that get beat down in the first two rounds can do better than the extrapolated show. It might be the Noble Nine's voter base flexing its muscle. I don't know. But most of those characters that I listed would do better than expected if they weren't thrown in as fodder.

---
"There are only 10 kinds of people in this world, those that read binary and those that don't."

I'm not going to buy into that Crono had more cheat votes than that, why just remove 400, if there was more? The minimum amount that Mario needed to win? It would seem odd to remove just the right number of cheat votes if there was more, and any gain Chrono Trigger got from people who went out and played it after the spring contest, probably is cancelled out by Superstar sage, mario kart, and the like. I don't see that crono is gaining much. Although today's results are slightly offputting. But maybe we overestimated how good Magus would do and underestimated Bowser's loyal fanbase.
---
Today's Survivor topic can be found here, Please vote : )http://boards.gamefaqs.com/gfaqs/genmessage.php?board=8&topic=16070956

"You missed my point"

No I didn't, I simply disagree and don't think it's worth my time to argue such a point. Fact of the matter is this, the powerful characters are supposed to eliminate the weaklings early on and all you've done is pointed out that is works out that way.

"Do you really think Squall was a weakling that deserved to get his ass handed to him by Solid Snake in the first round?"

Yes. After seeing him agaisnt Bomberman this year I don't think he deserved to beat Luigi.

"My point was some of the characters that get beat down in the first two rounds can do better than the extrapolated show."

They can also do worse, which is why I disregarded that you were making a point in the first place.

"But most of those characters that I listed would do better than expected if they weren't thrown in as fodder."

Evidence: 0
Speculation: 5
Confidence: 2
---
True love is a fairy tale. I'm damaged, so how would I know? - Plummet: Damaged

I gotta agree with FastFalcon. I stayed up during Starcraft/Wind Waker, and NEVER saw that admission of CJayC, just a snide remark toward AOL users.

Until I see it, I won't believe it.
---
SC2K4 Status - Points: 036/038 - Matches: 33/35 - Rank: 00123/33221 - Today: Mario - Tomorrow: Megaman

"I'm not going to buy into that Crono had more cheat votes than that, why just remove 400, if there was more?"

Why didn't Ceej remove SC's cheated votes agaisnt SSBM? Because it wasn't necessary. He did the bare minimum necessary to insure a legitimate victor... no more, no less.
---
True love is a fairy tale. I'm damaged, so how would I know? - Plummet: Damaged

... Facing a Noble Nine character makes the X-Stats BETTER.

Would you rather have you lose to another character that THEN loses to a NN character, or directly lose?
---
"...for extremely well thought out and irrrefutable reasons that the poster below me will provide." ~Aeon Azuran

"I stayed up during Starcraft/Wind Waker,"

Don't you mean SC/SSBM?
---
True love is a fairy tale. I'm damaged, so how would I know? - Plummet: Damaged

It was the SSBM match? No matter, I stayed up for that one too.
---
SC2K4 Status - Points: 036/038 - Matches: 33/35 - Rank: 00123/33221 - Today: Mario - Tomorrow: Megaman

"It was the SSBM match?"

I'm just assuming as such because that is the one where SC cheated.
---
True love is a fairy tale. I'm damaged, so how would I know? - Plummet: Damaged

Well, it DID throw the legitimacy of the wins over Halo and Wind Waker in jeopardy, too.
---
SC2K4 Status - Points: 036/038 - Matches: 33/35 - Rank: 00123/33221 - Today: Mario - Tomorrow: Megaman

I thikn what's being argued is that a character that powerful shouldn't be put out that early.

I hope CJC retires the big three after this contest...

Next years Final Four:

Mario vs Crono
MegaMan vs Samus

How awesomely unpredictable would that be?

I've been thinkin' hard about having Samus be next year's winner anyways (depending on whehter the next LoZ game is released by then or not), so Samus would win that in my book right now.

Either way, I think those four should be in the same half of the bracket next year, anyways, with all of them being 1-2 seeds.
---
Supporting both Earthworm Jim AND Mega Man in 2004
Spring Contest Score: 151/192

Yes. After seeing him agaisnt Bomberman this year I don't think he deserved to beat Luigi

Although I love Luigi and all but he's definitely not that strong of a conteder.. If there ever was another matchup between Squall and Luigi, the result will still be the same.. Squall won fair and "square" and he did deserved to win the match..

---
SC2K4 Winner: Cloud Strife
Next Target: Vyse

Windwaker was the one with the snide remark about AOL users. SSBM was the one with cheating.
---
The topic is dead. Not the kind of dead that can be cured with a Phoenix Down. I'm talking FMV sequence dead.- The King in Teal

In the history of the summer contest these are the ones who were eliminated in the first round that should have gone to the third or further according to the stats for their respective years.

2k2
Ken
Claire

2k3
Tidus

Even using 2k3 math for Squall only makes the list a whole 4 people getting seriously shafted. Over/under by one is fair and to be expected, sometimes you need that to happen to make the bracket interesting.

You simply can't argue the powerful characters are going out sooner than they deserve. Sure, in 2k2 a couple did, in 2k3 one did, and this year no returning characters went out in round one when they deserved round three. Our only real argument could be made for LS, should Frog spank MC severely, and htat's still a stretch.
---
True love is a fairy tale. I'm damaged, so how would I know? - Plummet: Damaged

Slow, I'm not sure what you and Falcon are talking about, but I saw you mentioned something about SC/Wind Waker, CJay, and not seeing. So here's a copy of the only post CJay made during the course of that match, in case anyone missed something.


The standard "Nope, no mass cheating" topic...
From: CJayC | Posted: 5/29/2004 11:25:45 PM | Message Detail
Checked over voting data, checking IP addresses and the usual stuff. No aberrant data pops up. No mass proxy voting, no mass votes from a single IP address or a range of addresses that doesn't have around as many votes for the other side. Voting is fairly 50/50 across the board, with very few exceptions. The biggest voters, by IP block:
* Comcast subscribers are voting for Starcraft 51%
* Cox Cable users are pro-Zelda, voting 52%
* AOL users are the biggest Zelda fans at 65%
* Just as unsurprisingly, the Korean netblock is voting Starcraft, but again, just at 65%

Fun with numbers.

And, from the contest rules, announced from the very beginning, in case you've forgotten:

While we do make every effort to stop individuals from voting numerous times without restricting anyone from voting that wants to legitimately, outside forces can and will attempt to push the vote for their favorite.

---
I'm drunk with power!
Wait, no, "Buttershots". I'm drunk with "Buttershots"!


And now, just for fun, here are the 4 topics he made during the SC/Melee match.


blah blah blah cheating blah blah...
From: CJayC | Posted: 6/2/2004 12:16:39 AM | Message Detail
Nope, no mass cheating. Again. At least, none that's distinguishable. If there's a couple of people voting thousands of times out there, they're doing it in a way that I can't detect, so yay for them. But I don't think that's happening, simply because the vote totals are so even across both time and IP space.

Of course, there are some people that appear to be using multiple accounts to vote (can I get a "duh")... but nobody I looked at had a for-prizes contest entry, so it's really not worth going after them, since it's people voting for both sides doing it just as often. Of course, there are a couple of people out there that seem to be pushing the boundaries of fairness, so this is a nice, open, friendly warning to them to give it a rest. No point in cancelling out votes, as they pretty much cancel each other out, given that both sides "cheat" on the same scale as much as the other.

And for the record, the only time I've canceled votes is when one person found a glitch in the system and managed to record over 3000 votes all by himself. That's the only kind of "cheating" that can be stopped, and that's the only kind we're concerned about; one or a few individuals should never be able to control a contest vote.

The anti-cheating safeguards for the contest are intended to prevent small numbers of people from affecting the contest by themselves, and that's pretty successful. Of course, it's next to impossible to stop people from voting a few times with multiple accounts without blocking people who are attempting to vote legitimately, and, of course, that was announced to everyone at the beginning of the contest. We want to allow everyone that wants to vote the ability to do so; beyond that, it's a great big popularity contest, and I've no control over it.

So, relax. It's only a game.

---
I'm drunk with power!
Wait, no, "Buttershots". I'm drunk with "Buttershots"!

"the result will still be the same.."

I agree with evreyhting you say but this. We have no guarentees that the result would be the same.
---
True love is a fairy tale. I'm damaged, so how would I know? - Plummet: Damaged

The Starcraft vote surge...
From: CJayC | Posted: 6/3/2004 10:23:59 PM | Message Detail
Seeing a lot of proxy server votes for Starcraft, from votes # 76000 to 79000. Looks like someone got real sloppy; this is kind of obvious. I may end up throwing out that entire block of 3000 votes unless I can sort out the legitimate from the proxy votes. Let me see what I can do here...

---
I'm drunk with power!
Wait, no, "Buttershots". I'm drunk with "Buttershots"!


400 proxy votes found all lined up in a row... all for Starcraft.
From: CJayC | Posted: 6/3/2004 11:06:25 PM | Message Detail
I still haven't found the proxy list this guy used, but I'm piecing it together.

So far, I've found 400 votes for Starcraft made through proxy servers, all coming pretty much one after another. You can actually see when the proxy program starts in the server logs. This is a case of one person (or a couple of them) going through all the trouble of creating a program to auto-vote through proxy server after proxy server. I can only hope they're doing it for the fun of it and not for their own contest entry.

I mean, you usually see 1-2 votes from known proxies an hour, but those votes are for both sides. Then suddenly, between votes #75562 and #78961, there are over 400 votes for Starcraft, all from known proxies. Of course, I'm fairly sure another 300-400 votes in that range are from proxies as well, but I'm still hunting them down.

---
I'm drunk with power!
Wait, no, "Buttershots". I'm drunk with "Buttershots"!

Okay, I'm tired of looking...
From: CJayC | Posted: 6/3/2004 11:57:23 PM | Message Detail
Total confirmed open proxy votes found for Starcraft: 637

There are likely more, but I've exhaused all of the public open proxy lists I know. All of the votes came within a specific time frame, and 100% of them were for Starcraft (something that can't really be passed off as a coincidence). They started off heavy, then slowed down (I guess as the guy exhausted his lists).

There are likely more than the 637 I found, but I was only going by public lists (i.e. ones I could find on Google). How I found them: Looked up a suspect vote IP address on Google with the word "proxy" as well, and then taking the lists that popped up and adding them into my known proxy list. I started with around 200 that I already knew about (I hadn't updated my lists in a year and a half), then found the other 400+ through Google tonight.

Oh, and this is pretty telling:
http://www.cjayc.com/kekekeke.png

The plot points are votes per game per 1000 votes.

And now, for the frequently whined questions:

How do you know that these are all fradulent votes?

They're from known open proxy servers (most of them in countries like Malaysia, Turkey, China, and so on), 100% of them are for Starcraft, and they all came in a huge rush (as if someone started off a program to vote automatically).

How do you know that this didn't happen earlier in the contest?

I don't know, but I'm fairly sure, given that there wasn't a surge like this on any other contest. Every other lead change has been gradual and taken hours to fully come about; a 1000 vote gain in an hour isn't normal.

You're just a Nintendo fanboy, aren't you?

How sad is it this? I mean, I've been accused of being for/against so many different companies at this point, it's not even funny. Just a day ago, I was anti-Nintendo for not finding any cheating going on in the LTTP battle...

For the record, I don't care who wins, as long as both sides play as fairly as the other. If you'll recall what I said just a day or two ago, the only kind of "cheating" that I would remove votes for was when one person attempted to seriously sway the contest vote all by themselves, and low and behold, someone got desparate enough to try it. If you were online and watching it when the swing happened, there can't really be any question that this wasn't legitimate.

So, what are you going to do about this?

I'm not sure. Ask me in an hour. The options range from nothing (if SSBM holds out), to removing all proxy server votes, removing all votes within the known "cheating" timeframe, or even a complete re-run of today's battle from scratch, with new intensive security measures in place to prevent this from happening again.

You're just making this up, aren't you?

Why in the hell would I open myself up to this much criticism without a valid reason? I mean, seriously, tracking this crap down has been an amazing waste of my time that I could have spent updating the site. Instead, we've got some guy attempting to ruin things for his own personal benefit, and that's not right.

---
I'm drunk with power!
Wait, no, "Buttershots". I'm drunk with "Buttershots"!

---
the-elite.net
The Guru Scoreboard: http://geocities.com/cyber1166/gamefaqs/04SumGurus.xls
Contest Archives: geocities.com/cyber1166/gamefaqs

And for the record, the only time I've canceled votes is when one person found a glitch in the system and managed to record over 3000 votes all by himself.

Looking at the time of the post, it was written near the end of CT/LttP. Looks like we were all wrong.

I'm still not sure why he would bother erasing 500 votes and not 3000. Surely it wouldn't take that much more time? I don't know how he does that, so I dunno. The other possibility is either a typo or a brain fade.
---
SC2K4 Status - Points: 036/038 - Matches: 33/35 - Rank: 00123/33221 - Today: Mario - Tomorrow: Megaman

"Seeing a lot of proxy server votes for Starcraft, from votes # 76000 to 79000. Looks like someone got real sloppy;"

I love the way he puts this. It implies that someone may in fact have been cheating for SC everytime and simply slipped up that one time. Really... I still find every SC win to be suspicious.
---
True love is a fairy tale. I'm damaged, so how would I know? - Plummet: Damaged

"Surely it wouldn't take that much more time?"

Since we've never done it... it actually could take some time. I'd imagine that he has to hunt each one down individually in some sort of log and remove it manually. If that's the case then I too would do the bare minimum necessary to insure that the winner was still legitimate.
---
True love is a fairy tale. I'm damaged, so how would I know? - Plummet: Damaged

But for those who were around back then... didn't the votes go away in one clean shot?
---
SC2K4 Status - Points: 036/038 - Matches: 33/35 - Rank: 00123/33221 - Today: Mario - Tomorrow: Megaman

Since we've never done it... it actually could take some time. I'd imagine that he has to hunt each one down individually in some sort of log and remove it manually. If that's the case then I too would do the bare minimum necessary to insure that the winner was still legitimate.

I second'd that

---
SC2K4 Winner: Cloud Strife
Next Target: Vyse

any gain Chrono Trigger got from people who went out and played it after the spring contest, probably is cancelled out by Superstar sage, mario kart, and the like

Those games don't do much to increase Mario's fanbase. People going to play Crono's ONLY game will do more for Crono.

ChichiriMuyo, do you enjoy trying to argue with people and tell them they're wrong? My posts only point was to say that characters like Knuckles would appear to look better if they weren't slaughtered earlier and I wish they were given a chance. If you don't agree then why ARE you arguing? You just gave your opinion that Squall didn't deserve to beat Luigi. I'm not gonna tell you you're wrong with the FACT that he still DID beat him, and handily. All you've done is stated that powerful characters are expected to beat weaklings early and characters could do worse or better than expected, which are both obvious and going away from what I was saying. Evidence? I don't need to show evidence to state an opinion. If you want evidence, please note that this is the same argument that you used to say that Ness would win against Jak, with which you were correct. So why you're arguing this makes no sense to me. I'm dropping it... it's not that serious.

--
"There are only 10 kinds of people in this world, those that read binary and those that don't."

Yes, but that was with the 15 minute updates, he probably had a very large chunk of illigitimate votes all close together (such as the 400 vote rush for SC) that he could delete in one fell swoop.
---
True love is a fairy tale. I'm damaged, so how would I know? - Plummet: Damaged

I just read when you brought up Tidus, Claire, and Ken being able to go to the third round. To clarify things, I wasn't going to that extreme. I was just saying that I wished some characters were given a chance to make a better showing (as Ness and Tails did this year). That's all.
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"There are only 10 kinds of people in this world, those that read binary and those that don't."

therealmnm, here's how it goes. You either intended one of two thing... character look better when they don't get defeated early... which is a no brainer, so I don't think it's what you intended... or characters look weaker in the stats if they face a noble nine member early.

Frankly I believe you meant the second, and that what you have done is confused the cause and the effect. They do not look weak because they faced a powerful opponent early... they faced a powerful opponent early because they are weak. There's no reason for Fox to make round 3. It doesn't matter if he's beaten by Link or if he gets tossed out by Master Chief, the fact still remains, he barely has any business in round 2, let alone round 3.

Would he score slightly higher than expected against MC? Maybe, maybe not. You can't argure firmly one way or the other outside of the fact that, in general, a character who goes against Link directly looks better than if they have to go through another character's match with Link for their rating. Fox goes against this logic, but I dare you to say that Alucard wouldn't have looked significantly better had he faced Link instead of going through Ganon.

Only one case has been brough forth of a character who went out too soon and looked significantly worse doing it than he did the next year... Squall, and for him we've already found a cause for his increase. I have little to no doubt that facing a noble nine in round 1 doesn't change your score against them as compared to what you would get in round 2, 3, 4, 5, or 6. It doesn't matter where they meet, each character has a fairly deffinate relation to each other in terms of strength. I don't care if Ganon met Link in the final four, he'd still get spanked just as hard.
---
True love is a fairy tale. I'm damaged, so how would I know? - Plummet: Damaged

"I wasn't going to that extreme."

Someone else had said something of the like, I said it more in response to them than to you.
---
True love is a fairy tale. I'm damaged, so how would I know? - Plummet: Damaged

I am pondering something.. Say if there was a Bowser vs. Magus matchup... how do you guys think the percent would split up?

---
SC2K4 Winner: Cloud Strife
Next Target: Vyse

I'd expect Magus to push for a 60/40 split but fall short by a bit. 58/42, I'd estimate.
---
True love is a fairy tale. I'm damaged, so how would I know? - Plummet: Damaged

I'd think 56-44 would be more like it.

Don't look just now, but Bowser's about to break 29%.
---
SC2K4 Status - Points: 036/038 - Matches: 33/35 - Rank: 00123/33221 - Today: Mario - Tomorrow: Megaman

"Don't look just now, but Bowser's about to break 29%."

It makes me wonder about Mario...
---
True love is a fairy tale. I'm damaged, so how would I know? - Plummet: Damaged

Meh... these SFF matches mean absolutely nothing.

On another note, what do you think Mario would've pulled on Conker. How about Crono/JC?
---
Summer Contest Match 33 Mario vs Bowser
Status 33/36 Points: 037 Next: Mega Man vs. Tidus

"what do you think Mario would've pulled on Conker."

All I know is that the math says Conker takes about 23.75.
---
True love is a fairy tale. I'm damaged, so how would I know? - Plummet: Damaged

wow, so he even said the 3000 vote thing before sc was caught, ok then, I guess there was more for Crono, in which case, I'll admit, I'm not feeling to great in having Mario now, and Mario's beating of Bowser isn't as high as I would have liked it to be, but I can still make myself ok that, by underestimating bowser/overestimating magus.

and I know those games won't do much to boost Mario, but I don't think Crono's game coming in second really made that many people play chrono trigger, and if it did, its probably close to the small number that those games boosted mario
---
Today's Survivor topic can be found here, Please vote : )http://boards.gamefaqs.com/gfaqs/genmessage.php?board=8&topic=16070956

"but I don't think Crono's game coming in second really made that many people play chrono trigger"

As was stated, it wasn't CT's match with FF7 that counts but CT beating three of the best games Nintendo has ever made that does.
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True love is a fairy tale. I'm damaged, so how would I know? - Plummet: Damaged

Okay, final clarification (since one must watch exactly how he words things on this site). My whole point, which was in response to Snake/Knuckles, was to say that some characters would do better off if given a chance. I was mostly talking about people's opinions of them (as seen with Squall, Ness, and Tails). A lot of people wrote them off as weak characters. When I brought up the XRs, I was really specifically looking at Squall, Ness, and Fox. All these can be contributed to SFF, but I didn't specify. But people still thought that they are weak. With Ken and Fox, that was just my opinion that they could do more damage than what might be thought (put Ken in Ryu's place). I wasn't turning this into a stats discussion. Anyways....

---
"There are only 10 kinds of people in this world, those that read binary and those that don't."

We saw what Fox was capable of against Cloud, it asn't all the much more than against Link. Knux has genuinely gotten screwed 3 times, and you could make a case for him, sorta, but he still goes out in the round he's supposed to.

Trust me, I'm not one for gross underestimations. I had Squall beating Jill last year, I had Ness beating Jak this year (and Bowser beating him last year), I had Fox beating Pikachu last year. I know pretty damn well, regardless of stats, where these characters stand... and most of them don't deserve to go any farther than they do. It doesn't matter to me if a Noble Nine beats them or if Dante's the one to do it, only a handful have ever been screwed outright. Given that early loses are the exception, not the rule, I'm going to have to say that the system works like it's supposed to 95% of the time.
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True love is a fairy tale. I'm damaged, so how would I know? - Plummet: Damaged

Oh, no doubt. I had those same picks easily except for Ness over Jak, but that's because I don't like Ness OR Earthbound at all. With Fox, I was looking at the rankings and saw plenty of people ranked ahead of him that I would take him over in both years, although way more in 2003. I may or may not be wrong but I could make a strong case for each of them. With the others, I was just pulling for better draws for characters I like. It wouldn't make a difference in the contest results.
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"There are only 10 kinds of people in this world, those that read binary and those that don't."

Yeah, but you're only looking at the stats as they are, not as they should be. Sure, Fox should be higher in both years, but he faced some SFF in 2k3 and Cloud clearly underperformed against Mario who suffered SFF to Link in 2k2. There are extenuating cricumstances behind Fox, Squall, Ness, and anyone else that looks lower than they should be, and it's not because they faced an elite too early.
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True love is a fairy tale. I'm damaged, so how would I know? - Plummet: Damaged

lol, this is gonna go on forever. Okay, honestly. Last post about this. Of course we both know about SFF and Cloud's "performance" against Mario. Any serious bracketmaker should know about that. I was just defending why I brought up the XRs. My point was to see those characters do well to shut up people I've seen (not in these topics) that DON'T know where they really stand and write them off. In other words, just defending characters I like just like you and HM defend Terry Bogard. Nothing to be seriously analyzed. THE END!
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"There are only 10 kinds of people in this world, those that read binary and those that don't."

"THE END!"

I'll have the last word on this matter, thank you very much.

Ummm...

"word"
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True love is a fairy tale. I'm damaged, so how would I know? - Plummet: Damaged

And for the record, the only time I've canceled votes is when one person found a glitch in the system and managed to record over 3000 votes all by himself. That's the only kind of "cheating" that can be stopped, and that's the only kind we're concerned about; one or a few individuals should never be able to control a contest vote.

Time for me to laugh at everyone who told me that he never said that. The only way Crono will lose is if Mario cheats. Again.
---
Winner of the Spring 2004 'Best. Game. Ever.' Contest
*Married to smitelf on 5/21/04* ++SCC GOD++

Old post, but...

Mega Man will never fall below 60% on this faithful day. And when everything is over I'll be at #1 with "Mega Man" as my winner. ;)

You're not finishing ahead of me unless Mario beats Crono... and I don't think that's going to happen. =)

---
Contest Winner: Mega Man | Score: 34/36
Current Oracle ranking: 4th | Pick: Crono with 57.21%

Time for me to laugh at everyone who told me that he never said that. The only way Crono will lose is if Mario cheats. Again.

When I realized that (Read: after brackets were locked) I started making this joke about my pick:

I'm counting on Ceej to pull me through!
---
Summer Contest Match 33 Mario vs Bowser
Status 33/36 Points: 037 Next: Mega Man vs. Tidus

even with it beating three of Nintendo's greatest hits, I still doubt that many people bought the game. The strongest piece of crono gaining imo is chrono trigger beating smb3. That's the thing that worries me most about mvc, but outside that, not much else does.
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Today's Survivor topic can be found here, Please vote : )http://boards.gamefaqs.com/gfaqs/genmessage.php?board=8&topic=16070956

If so many extra people supposedly bought/played Chrono Trigger after it got runner-up in the game contest, then how come NOBODY's said a word about A SINGLE PERSON possibly buying/playing Final Fantasy 7, the game that beat it? Afterall, not only did it beat the game that beat three of Nintendo's greatest games in the pre-3D era 58-42, but it also dominated over LoZ:OoT, stomped SSBM, and tore into Metal Gear Solid...and it won the contest.

You can't say that Crono's projected to beat Mario with 54% of the votes like I've heard before and not expect nothing short of a mauling from Cloud or Sephiroth in the entire contest...and Aeris probably woulda made it into the contest again, too, if this CT-theory is true.
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Supporting both Earthworm Jim AND Mega Man in 2004
Spring Contest Score: 151/192

FF7's exposure on this site was already far beyond anything CT had. FF7 is near supersaturation. While CT was well known, it had much more room for improvement thanks to the Spring contest as opposed FF7.
---
2k4 - The Summer of Sephiroth.

How much more exposure could Final Fantasy VII possibly get on this site? It already had a character win the contest the year before, and it had three of them make a cameo appearance in a game that people who wouldn't normally play FF. Crono has much more potential to grow than Cloud does.
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Squall Leonhart's Road to the Summer Championship
2nd Round: (5)Kirby

Ahem, that should say presented them to people who would normally play FF.
---
Squall Leonhart's Road to the Summer Championship
2nd Round: (5)Kirby

so, in the history of the contest, have there ever been characters face off more than once where we've had a different outcome? For example, Link faces Cloud and wins then Link faces Cloud and loses?

The Mario vs Crono match is gonna be huge. If Mario wins, I should finish in the top 10.
---
<reptile-> The first time hypr opened a box of Cheerios and looked inside he yelled, "OH WOW! DONUT SEEDS!"
<hypr> wtf are donut seeds

Nope...not yet. Crono vs. Mario SHOULD be the first time that happens.
---
Snake vs. Tanner - http://www.stripcreator.com/comics/Moltar
Bowser vs. Mario - Bracket: Mario - Vote: Mario (36/38)

Mario/Crono is about the only chance we've got for it to happen this year as Snake beating Mega Man probably won't happen and Sonic over Samus is looking increasingly less likely.
---
Squall Leonhart's Road to the Summer Championship
2nd Round: (5)Kirby

Only 3 matches have ever been repeated. [By my count anyway] Sephiroth beat Megaman twice, and Snake beat Knuckles twice, and of course Mario beat Crono twice.

Link didn't face Cloud in sc2k2.
---
Cold hearted orb, that rules the night; Remove the colors from my sight; Red is grey, and yellow white; but we decide which is right, and which is an illusion

I know SFF is tricky and all, but today's performance doesn't bode well for Mario. He's doing less than 1% better than Crono against a relatively weaker opponent. I figured a bigger gap in strength would result in more SFF, but I guess not.
---
Squall Leonhart's Road to the Summer Championship
2nd Round: (5)Kirby

http://gamefaqs.com/shared/sum04b37.jpg

I'm kinda disappointed with this one. I absolutely hate that picture of Tidus. CJayC should've used the cover art from FFX.

The one redeeming quality is that Mega Man doesn't have his traditional "Buster-to-head" round 2 picture.
---
Squall Leonhart's Road to the Summer Championship
2nd Round: (5)Kirby

Oh GOD! That pic sucks ass...
---
Snake vs. Tanner - http://www.stripcreator.com/comics/Moltar
Bowser vs. Mario - Bracket: Mario - Vote: Mario (36/38)

Tidus looks a lil'...feminine.....
---
Supporting both Earthworm Jim AND Mega Man in 2004
Spring Contest Score: 151/192

Tidus looks God awful, but at least Mega Man looks pretty good.
---
SC2k4 Winner: Mega Man
Ken Masters; the fighting king clothed in blazing fire.

Well, we will have another rematch. Link versus Sephiroth or Cloud....and the outcome of each is unpredictable.
---
This is goku z. 36/38 SC2k4 (Yoshi)
wtf is a kegel?~PhantomTrain

What a disappointing picture. =(
---
M-me? Queen ***** of the Universe?
This is the happiest day of my life. ~ smitelf

bad pic of megaman and tidus. that's horrible. they both look stupid. i might not even vote now.
---
Mario Sunshine-120 Shines || BtT 3:43.55 || HRC 37,179.9 ||

Ah true, I had forgotten about that. Plus, Cloud-Sephiroth is a rematch as well.
---
Squall Leonhart's Road to the Summer Championship
2nd Round: (5)Kirby

It's the short bus kid with his special helmet vs Meg Ryan! ROFL, they both look terrible.
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This is goku z. 36/38 SC2k4 (Yoshi)
wtf is a kegel?~PhantomTrain

You're not finishing ahead of me unless Mario beats Crono... and I don't think that's going to happen. =)

Your tiebreaker would also have to be better than mine. Assuming I missed Mario vs Crono.
---
SC2k4 Winner: Mega Man
Ken Masters; the fighting king clothed in blazing fire.

I am very confident that we will have two rematches with new winners this year

Crono defeats Mario
and
Sephiroth defeats Cloud or Link defeats Cloud.
---
This is goku z. 36/38 SC2k4 (Yoshi)
wtf is a kegel?~PhantomTrain

Perhaps even three, if Sephiroth can pull it off. (And why can't he? I think he has a great shot)
---
This is goku z. 36/38 SC2k4 (Yoshi)
wtf is a kegel?~PhantomTrain

The possibility of Crono beating Mario bothers me very much. C'mon it's MARIO! Mario is the man! But it's gonna be a close one whichever way it goes.

Seph beating Cloud....that's not gonna happen.

Link beating Cloud.....it might depend on the pic.
---
<reptile-> The first time hypr opened a box of Cheerios and looked inside he yelled, "OH WOW! DONUT SEEDS!"
<hypr> wtf are donut seeds

tnote...that bracket you created is ****ing awesome! There's a HUGE! amount of great matches. Just one thing: switch Squall and Ganondorf, and then Squall and Tidus. We don't want another Squall vs. Kirby/Snake, and Ganondorf could be SSF'd by Samus.

Messed up seeding is not a problem, IMO. The matches that this seeding created are incredible.

the fact that Squall is considered a good character in a bad game

I disagree with the first and second parts. FFVIII is tied for the best game in the series (with FFVI) and Squall is just...average.

I know SFF is tricky and all, but today's performance doesn't bode well for Mario. He's doing less than 1% better than Crono against a relatively weaker opponent. I figured a bigger gap in strength would result in more SFF, but I guess not.

That's assuming Bowser is a lot weaker than Magus/Ganondorf, and there is no reason to do so, as they haven't had overly compareable matches. It's purely mathematical speculation on the Bowser case, so there is not an overwhelming ammount of evidence to prove your case.

We'll just have to wait and see.
---
And pray that there's intelligent life somewhere up in space,
'Cause there's bugger all down here on Earth.

Yeah, tnote's bracket is a good one.
---
Winner of the Spring 2004 'Best. Game. Ever.' Contest
*Married to smitelf on 5/21/04* ++SCC GOD++

Question for you all: how many votes do you think Mario would get against Ryu, if Super Mario RPG was his only game?

...

That's probably the most worthless thing to ponder about in the world.
---
And pray that there's intelligent life somewhere up in space,
'Cause there's bugger all down here on Earth.

Heh, thanx guys. Glad to see my hard work got some recognition. And yeah, I was aware of a Squall/Kirby "rematch," but given it had not actually played out in this tournament as of yet, I felt it would still be a decent 2nd round match-up.
---
Anxiously awaiting... FROG vs. Master Chief

If someone wasn't able to play Mega Man when he was at his best (SNES, 16-bit) and still doesn't get a chance to, wouldn't you think their opinion couldn't have easily changed?

Fixed your typos. Dashing makes MMX series >>> than MM series. Seriously, playing through the beginning of MMX sucks, just because there's no dashing. I hate it.

Also, MMX was the best-selling title in the series, IIRC from Capcom's massive press release, and the only one to break 1 million.

Sliding > dashing.
---
Current Pick: Mario; Current Vote: Mario; Points: 35/38
SFF, yo!

I know it wasn't sold seperately, but The Legend of Zelda Collector's disk was packaged with the Gamecube for awhile. How many GCN's were sold in the period where that bundle took place? Just a ballpark number would be nice.

That...is the strongest argument in Link's favor that I've heard. It was over 2 million, that I'm sure of. Probably at least 2.5 million, although it might not be over 3. Seriously, Collector's Edition could easily be enough to propel Link over Cloud, and prevent Mega Man from beating him.

Has Mario been losing ground all day? I seem to remember him having close to 72% of the vote in the beginning, but now he's around 70%. Does he usually lose the day vote in his matches?
---
TOOMMMAAATOOOO SAAAAUUUUCCCCEEEE!
(he seems pumped....perhaps?)

All I have to say is the Mega Man Collection made me play them for the first time because I had access to them.
---
Not all those who wander are lost...
There is no god, and the cage wasn't 30 feet. - CM Punk

Seriously, Collector's Edition could easily be enough to propel Link over Cloud, and prevent Mega Man from beating him.

The Collector's Edition lacked Link to the Past, an omission which still makes me angry. Without including his best game, it won't help Link. And honestly, I don't think any "collections" (MMAC, LoZ:CE, SFAC, SMC, etc.) are really going to give a notable boost to their characters. The only one that has a chance at all is MMAC, because many gamers haven't played MM2 or 3 and those are MM's best games. Still, I find it doubtful that a huge boost could happen to a character because of a collection.
---
Current Pick: Mario; Current Vote: Mario; Points: 35/38
SFF, yo!

RPGuy, one can argue that LoZ:OoT is greater than LoZ:LttP, but I won't because I haven't given LttP a fair chance yet...for shame, I know. Regardless, that's still about two million copies for anybody getting a Gamecube around that period (also, isn't LttP on the GBA now or something similar?). That's PLENTY of room for Link to get new fans, though I don't mean to sound like Link's going to destroy whoever he faces in the finals.

Being reminded of this makes me feel much better about Link; before this, the only factor I had of picking Link over Cloud was gut feeling.
---
Supporting both Earthworm Jim AND Mega Man in 2004
Spring Contest Score: 151/192

Harrich, I'm speaking more out of anger than anything else. Yes, there is a GBA port of LttP, but it's dumbed down to be even easier than it originally was. Plus, I can't play it on a console. I suppose CE could help out Link, but I'd argue against it. There are very few people that come to this site that haven't played a Zelda game at some point in there lives; sticking them all on one disc (and excluding LttP and LA) isn't going to do all that much.
---
Current Pick: Mario; Current Vote: Mario; Points: 35/38
SFF, yo!

Your tiebreaker would also have to be better than mine. Assuming I missed Mario vs Crono.

Not true. If I'm not mistaken, our brackets only differed on two matches: Ness vs Jak and Crono vs Mario. So if I'm right on Mario vs Crono, I'll have a higher score.

---
Contest Winner: Mega Man | Score: 36/38
Current Oracle ranking: 4th | Pick: Mario with 78.70%

Is it a possibility that Final Fantasy Chronicles was the reason for Crono's 2k2-2k3 increase? After all, it did sell a few hundred thousand copies.

That's probably the most worthless thing to ponder about in the world.

Heh, I was only wondering how much strength Mario gets from his RPG, especially considering SMRPG over SF2.

Has Mario been losing ground all day? I seem to remember him having close to 72% of the vote in the beginning, but now he's around 70%. Does he usually lose the day vote in his matches?

Mario's lost the day vote in every match that he underperformed in.

All I know is FF Chronicles couldn't have hurt.
---
Not all those who wander are lost...
There is no god, and the cage wasn't 30 feet. - CM Punk

Might Tidus vs. Mega Man break 100,000 votes? Hmm...
---
"Thank you, Mario. But our princess is in another castle."
-Toad in Super Mario Bros.

A lot of these second round matches are crazy the way they set up what should be highly seeded characters for defeat in the second round. If i were making the bracket seeds would go like this:
1 Link Seph Cloud Crono
2 Mario MegaMan Snake Samus
3 Sonic Magus Squall Ryu
4 Auron Ganon Tidus Zero
5 Dante Jill Shadow Frog
6 Liquid Alucard Bowser Yoshi
7 Knuckles Vivi Luigi DK
8 Kirby MasterChief Vercetti Scorpion

I think this divides the best 32 characters of the contest into seeds that are actually based on character strength. What's that, you want to know where Hayabusa and Sora are? They would get 9 seeds which means some interesting first round matches...I'm interested to see how accurate people think my seedings are in relation to actually character strength. Odds are people will think a handful of people are seeded too highly but I guess that'll all play out in the weeks to come and in next years bracket. Lots of unexplored match possibilities still though.
---
Mario Sunshine-120 Shines || BtT 3:43.55 || HRC 37,179.9 ||

If i were making the bracket seeds would go like this:
1 Link Seph Cloud Crono
...
I'm interested to see how accurate people think my seedings are in relation to actually character strength.

Mega Man has earned his #1 seed... no one else realistically deserves it. Otherwise it pretty much seems okay.
---
Contest Winner: Mega Man | Score: 38/40
Current Oracle ranking: 4th | Pick: Mega Man with 59.62%

Mega Man 66.67% 360
Tidus 33.33% 180
TOTAL VOTES 540

If these trends continue...hey!
---
Contest Winner: Mega Man | Score: 38/40
Current Oracle ranking: 4th | Pick: Mega Man with 59.62%

If the votes actually maintained their current rate, Heroic Mario would be a very happy individual with a 66/33 Mega Man match.
---
"I don't know who you are but I thank you for arousing me." -- Terranigma

And a Megaman championship would be realistic.

But that's too good to be true ><
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The only reason this is here is because posts without sigs look ugly.

I really hope this trend continues....
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*Chorno Cross SPOILERS* TD is defeated!
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v224/Daredevil3181/TDDead.jpg

wow, hm, as of this point, i'm flabbergasted : (

but yay for Zelda anywayz!!!
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Today's Survivor topic can be found here, Please vote : )http://boards.gamefaqs.com/gfaqs/genmessage.php?board=8&topic=16070956

What were you expecting for this match?

I thought Mega Man just couldn't get that 60%+ guys?! ;)
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SC2k4 Winner: Mega Man
Ken Masters; the fighting king clothed in blazing fire.

And he could hit 64% before we even reach daytime.
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SC2k4 Winner: Mega Man
Ken Masters; the fighting king clothed in blazing fire.

I knew it. I knew MM would get over 60 easy.

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"Those who can't, emulate." - MegaPowerNinja
Official World Record Holder: Solstice, Super Mario World

From Captain Flufflez's seeding, I know a Tommy/Ryu match would really piss me off about how much I'd think on that.
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Supporting both Earthworm Jim AND Mega Man in 2004
Spring Contest Score: 151/192

Well, looks likes Megaman is down to 62%. He needs to win the day vote if he has any hope of winning this tournament.
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If history is to change, let it change! If the world is to be destroyed, so be it! If my fate is to die... I must simply laugh!!--Magus Zeal

If he gets 64% on Tidus, I'll look at him as a serious contender for the championship, but I still don't think he'd win it with just 64%...

Tidus < Ganondorf < Magus, who got 34.93% against Link.

...Mega Man would need to probably double Tidus in order to win it, now that I look at it like that. Mega Man's impressin' me with the 62% he currently has on him, but he still can't beat Link yet.
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Supporting both Earthworm Jim AND Mega Man in 2004
Spring Contest Score: 151/192

As of right now, it doesn't look very good for the blue bomber as his percentage keeps dropping.. If he is successfully able to get 64% on Tidus, he will be a serious contender for the championship but by the end of the match.. the percent might even drop down to 60% at the rate right now.. =(

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SC2K4 Winner: Cloud Strife
Next Target: Vyse

I predicted earlier that Mega Man will get 60%, give or take a percent. It's not lookin' like too bad of a guess right now, though I'd love to be wrong and see Mega Man crush Tidus.
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Supporting both Earthworm Jim AND Mega Man in 2004
Spring Contest Score: 151/192

That...is the strongest argument in Link's favor that I've heard. It was over 2 million, that I'm sure of. Probably at least 2.5 million, although it might not be over 3. Seriously, Collector's Edition could easily be enough to propel Link over Cloud, and prevent Mega Man from beating him.

You certain it was that high? I know they didn't have the Zelda Bundle for very long, but it was during that huge sales boom they had due to the price drop. If the bundle was in place over Thanksgiving, then it sold at least around 700,000, if memory serves correctly.
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M-me? Queen ***** of the Universe?
This is the happiest day of my life. ~ smitelf

Oh my god, what a beating. Looks like everyone's performing closer to Clinkeroth than they should. Good game Snake, nice knowing you.

Megaman needs to brutalize Tidus with the day vote to be of championship level though. Get 66-67%, then we'll talk.
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SC2K4 Status - Points: 038/040 - Matches: 34/36 - Rank: 00123/33221 - Today: Megaman - Tomorrow: Zero

This doesn't scream "I will beat Link." Sorry HM, but unless he gets up to Link/Magus levels, your boy is goin' home early...

If Mario RPG were his only game... Mario wouldn't exist.
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"...for extremely well thought out and irrrefutable reasons that the poster below me will provide." ~Aeon Azuran

Heh, still 8 perfects...and that should go through today as well...

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Steve Illumina: Official Satirical Commentator of SC2K4
Perfects to Fall: 8 SC2K4: 37/40 (Go FROG!)

I don't want to hear 66-67% levels here, Slowflake. He doesn't need to do a full percent or two better than what Link did in order to win. Especially, if he did see some sort of increase over the last year. As far as I'm concerned there's no way someone is telling me Mega Man cannot win based on his 62%. That's just stupid. If it was only 56-58% sure, but you have to realize he's already overperforming by 7% at the moment.
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SC2k4 Winner: Mega Man
Ken Masters; the fighting king clothed in blazing fire.

But you're HEROIC FREAKING MARIO. The one guy delusional enough to still believe in a CT championship this spring after a near-loss to LttP.
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SC2K4 Status - Points: 038/040 - Matches: 34/36 - Rank: 00123/33221 - Today: Megaman - Tomorrow: Zero

And for the record, overperforming by 6% (not 7!) is not quite enough. The gap between Clinkeroth and the rest is just THAT DAMN BIG.
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SC2K4 Status - Points: 038/040 - Matches: 34/36 - Rank: 00123/33221 - Today: Megaman - Tomorrow: Zero

but I still don't think he'd win it with just 64%...

There's no sense in saying he cannot win if he isn't exactly on the money. The extrapolated standings, while accurate, aren't down to a tee. Now, if Tidus were have to increased a little or whatever, then that could only help the situation. But really, 64% and you still don't think he could win? He's already overshooting the majority's, and the X-sts, predictions.
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SC2k4 Winner: Mega Man
Ken Masters; the fighting king clothed in blazing fire.

I'm just saying, 66-67% just guarantees him the thing it doesn't mean he's in the running. He does need to increase, but regardless he still is looking quite "boostful" today. I wouldn't say he cannot win just based on what he's doing now. I'd like to at least wait until he faces Snake.

And it's 7% roughly: 56, 57, 58, 59, 60, 61, 62. =p
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SC2k4 Winner: Mega Man
Ken Masters; the fighting king clothed in blazing fire.

But you're HEROIC FREAKING MARIO. The one guy delusional enough to still believe in a CT championship this spring after a near-loss to LttP.

Wasn't that a joke?...

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"WE LIEK HITELR MOR CUZ HE AHS A CUULER LOKE AN GON ARMM ATTCKS!" ~MWiS/Scipio Africanus

No, the guy genuinely had CT, I hear. Last-minute switch from... SMB3. At least it saved him 16 points.

490? Watch this drive now.
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SC2K4 Status - Points: 038/040 - Matches: 34/36 - Rank: 00123/33221 - Today: Megaman - Tomorrow: Zero

Last time it came at the 495 mark. I was so disappointed; I got 493, 496, and 498. =X
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"WE LIEK HITELR MOR CUZ HE AHS A CUULER LOKE AN GON ARMM ATTCKS!" ~MWiS/Scipio Africanus

I'm going to prepare some improvements to the graph sheets for SC2K4 and SpC2K4 on my Excel files. Stay tuned. ;)
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SC2K4 Status - Points: 038/040 - Matches: 34/36 - Rank: 00123/33221 - Today: Megaman - Tomorrow: Zero

What drive? :)
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This space reserved for the Summer Guru Contest winner!

Go Mega Man!
For Everlasting Peace!
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This space reserved for the Summer Guru Contest winner!

Make it snappy...

The drive to get post 500.
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"WE LIEK HITELR MOR CUZ HE AHS A CUULER LOKE AN GON ARMM ATTCKS!" ~MWiS/Scipio Africanus

so when does it start
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36/36 points in sc2004
tomorrow's pick: Crono

(Of course... it's always slower on the morning after a long weekend...)
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"WE LIEK HITELR MOR CUZ HE AHS A CUULER LOKE AN GON ARMM ATTCKS!" ~MWiS/Scipio Africanus

Should start soon.

Who do you have for Ryu/Sora?
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"WE LIEK HITELR MOR CUZ HE AHS A CUULER LOKE AN GON ARMM ATTCKS!" ~MWiS/Scipio Africanus

499?
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36/36 points in sc2004
tomorrow's pick: Crono

the end
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Rockman: 16 years and still runnin' strong.