Every game has cheat votes in favor of it. Ceej didn't catch any mass voters meaning that there was no single person with 500 accounts on the same map votign for the same character from the same ip. It's still possible to get multiple votes from a single ip with multiple accounts. That's allowed because some people may share ips (like voting from school). There are cheat votes on both sides, though, so it tends to even out. Mass cheating creates an uneven situation, and that's the only time when cheating means much. Please be aware though, that "tends to even out" does mean that there is a chance that it does favor one side or the other. If SC has high board support it's more likely to pull cheat votes because people who don't visit the boards probably will not have multiple accounts if any.

I was referring to Battle.net, not multiple accounts. Getting votes from Battle.net is not cheating. That’s all I said.
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Married to UltimaterializerX on 5/21/04
Current Sp2K4 Score: 79/92, Next Winner: Final Fantasy X

As for the age deal the latest poll taken in September 2003 had the most users between the age of 13-17 and 18-25, that age group has definitely played both of these games. And like Chichiri said before with emulation its even easier for younger voters to get a copy of either game.

89,000 people voted by the way, well above what we usually get in contest polls, heh.

http://www.gamefaqs.com/poll/index.html?poll=1386

Younger than 9 0.59% 529
9-12 4.26% 3797
13-17 47.93% 42682
18-25 39.58% 35245
26-30 4.74% 4222
31-35 1.34% 1191
35-40 0.57% 506
Older than 40 0.98% 877
TOTAL VOTES 89049
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Nintendo® - We Make Games Worth Playing
Dodongo Dislikes Smoke - Old Man; The Legend of Zelda

However, Starcraft seems to transcend the logic established by the other entries. My point is kinda what Ulti said: from the looks of it, it could come relatively close to a game like Chrono Trigger, but also be unable to blow out something like, say, Xenogears.

Exactly. Starcraft's strength varies, and the fact that it beat Wind Waker doesn’t mean that Metroid Prime couldn’t beat Halo. That’s why the rankings in this division will prove to be unreliable, IMO, when games are ranked according to their performance against Starcraft, since SC's power fluctuates according to that of its opponent. Hell, it may even fluctuate heavily depending on the day; last night was a good night for a Starcraft match because it was a Saturday and Battle.net was heavily trafficked. It's potential power will be less on Thursday.
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Married to UltimaterializerX on 5/21/04
Current Sp2K4 Score: 79/92, Next Winner: Final Fantasy X

Yeah, it's a big problem and it makes extrapolated rankings highly unreliable...
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ChichiriMuyo is officially the Discussion Guru Encyclopedia - UltimaterializerX
And I'm 23/24 myself. My loss was all part of Alucard's plan. - BigCow

That’s why the rankings in this division will prove to be unreliable,

I definitely agree.
---
Nintendo® - We Make Games Worth Playing
Dodongo Dislikes Smoke - Old Man; The Legend of Zelda

Indeed. They're only going to work on a handful of games at the end.
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SpC2K4 Status --- Points: 081/092 --- Matches: 48/55 --- Rank: 00274/40940 --- Today's pick: FF10

Yes, and unfortunately we pretty much knew how those handful of games stood before we started; FFTA and FE most notably in the lower half and Skies of Arcadia and Soul Calibur obviously in the upper. We know those games don't stand much of a chance all in all. Soul Calibur could do well for itself, but by that I mean it won't get blownout as opposed to syaing it would win a lot.
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ChichiriMuyo is officially the Discussion Guru Encyclopedia - UltimaterializerX
And I'm 23/24 myself. My loss was all part of Alucard's plan. - BigCow

I meant, we can compare FF7 with DDR, but not with Halo since Starcraft's screwing the math over.

I think Diablo 2 and Warcraft 3 could join the party for more bracket-busting fun next time, too... *shudders*
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SpC2K4 Status --- Points: 081/092 --- Matches: 48/55 --- Rank: 00274/40940 --- Today's pick: FF10

[This message was deleted at the request of the original poster]

*points to the 50% of brackets who didn't even have Megaman in the Sweet 16 in 2003 AFTER HE ALMOST BEAT SEPHIROTH THE PREVIOUS YEAR*
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SpC2K4 Status --- Points: 081/092 --- Matches: 48/55 --- Rank: 00274/40940 --- Today's pick: FF10

Slowflake, I thought you were a fellow Diablo 2 fan :)
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Go back home to Final Fantasy buddy, you might get hurt out here. -Tinek Arukena
Spring Contest Score = STARCRAFT'D

CJayC doesn`t care about mass cheating so long as CNET makes their money. Note how he gave vague inferences to multi-voting on both sides, but admitted to doing nothing about it.
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Married to smitelf on 5/21/04
I would like to take this moment to politely orgasm over Ulti's Halo/Starcraft analysis. -smitelf

Well, I love Diablo 2 and all, but I would really be mad if it thanked me back by ripping my bracket a new one.
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SpC2K4 Status --- Points: 081/092 --- Matches: 48/55 --- Rank: 00274/40940 --- Today's pick: FF10

I`d imagine more brackets would be prone to know how well StarCraft did and hopefully bring that over to any other battle.NET game especially Diablo II. But you never know when people are picking MC to win it all and Vercetti to beat MM.
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Nintendo® - We Make Games Worth Playing
Dodongo Dislikes Smoke - Old Man; The Legend of Zelda

"CJayC doesn`t care about mass cheating"

He stopped the mass cheating the one time that there was evidence that it existed. Unless he's outright lying to all of us, and there is little reason for that.
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ChichiriMuyo is officially the Discussion Guru Encyclopedia - UltimaterializerX
And I'm 23/24 myself. My loss was all part of Alucard's plan. - BigCow

Wow, is this contest about to get really interesting? All of the predictions for Round 4 in the Oracle Challenge are in the low fifties. I've never seen that before. I'm almost excited. :)
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Contest Stats: http://solarshadow-stats.tripod.com

Heh, it should be expected though. The matches have been closer than expected or bigger blowouts than expected far too many times. With two games this big and the previous results noone wnats to be anything but conservative regardless of how likely or not that it will be close.
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ChichiriMuyo is officially the Discussion Guru Encyclopedia - UltimaterializerX
And I'm 23/24 myself. My loss was all part of Alucard's plan. - BigCow

*** COMPARISONS GAME - Match #57 - (1) SUPER MARIO BROS. 3 vs. (3) LEGEND OF ZELDA ***

Sales

Of course, 18 times platinum = instant win, unless you're facing Tetris, SMB1 or Duck Hunt. Major props to LoZ for being the first standalone platinum game though.

- Advantage SMB3

Franchises

Well, um... I'm all out of original material. Only one more week...

- Advantage LOZ.

GameFAQs Status

Number of FAQs: LoZ
Number of reviews: SMB3
Average review score: SMB3
Board activity: SMB3

Pretty clear winner here.

- Advantage SMB3.

Board Odds Project

PICKS (out of 102)
Super Mario Bros. 3 - 88
Legend of Zelda - 11
Also picked: Final Fantasy (2), Tetris (1)

POINT VALUE
4. Super Mario Bros. 3 - 2054
6. Legend of Zelda - 772

The BOP is trying to get out of a major slump (well, a two-loss streak, much like my bracket), but is such a crushing indicative of what could happen? Well, there was worse, such as a game with only 3 picks actually winning the match - take a wild guess as to what I'm talking about.

However, previous matches tend to blur our vision quite a bit, as LttP has shown (not to mention the Halo vs. Wind Waker saga, but that's for another day), and so a pick relying on instinct can prove to be the good one.

- Advantage SMB3.

Previous Rounds

A toughie, really. However, LoZ's scores wowed me just a bit more - and getting a higher percentage than "male" in a gender poll hasn't been seen since that Sam Fisher vs. Magus pre-poll, and if you only count official GameFAQs PotDs... since the 5th of Never.

- Advantage LOZ.

Summer Contests / Polls of the Day

Just to add to the difficulty a bit more. LoZ is probably far from LttP and OoT in terms of popularity, but SMB3 is leaps and bounds ahead of every other Mario. Enough to compensate for Link thrashing Mario in SC2K2?

WHO THE HELL KNOWS?

- TIE.

Intangibles.

LoZ has the Zelda name. That's it. Period.

SMB3 has everything else. A monster amount of copies sold. Respect even from those who have grown to hate the newer installments. Unrivaled in pure platforming goodness (that's the popular opinion, not mine: I like SM64 and DKC2 better). I think that somewhere, this is what's responsible for the monstruous BOP numbers.

Screw SM64/OoT, this is another ball game entirely. Like comparing LttP/SM and WW/MP.

- Advantage SMB3.

Conclusion: A close poll occurs on Saturday, then the fallout completely makes the greatly hyped and super-close Sunday match totally ignored. And then another huge match on Monday.

We've seen that before, and we're seeing it again. Only difference is that the Monday poll isn't the most hyped of the contest this time. But it STILL can go either way.
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SpC2K4 Status --- Points: 081/092 --- Matches: 48/55 --- Rank: 00274/40940 --- Today's pick: FF10

Since Division 128 has treated me like a virgin on prom night... I will no longer spend more than two minutes analyzing these matches. Damn you Starcraft... and with no further ado, time for another... Tnotez Take:

Starcraft winning did not, in fact shock me, however SSBM taking down FFX does. Call me crazy, but I truly feel the match picture cost FFX those 2000 votes. I do still have three perfect divisions, so I will address those. Everyone and their brother was all up on SMB3 before this contest. Now? Toss-up, plain and simple. Zelda has obliterated everyone. SMB3 has impressed, but not obliterated. So in the end, say goodbye to my perfect quarter bracket because...

GunPoint Prediction: Legend of Zelda with 52%

I think it is going to be more like 54-55%, but I am holding out hope for a barnburner. If I had it to do again, I would not have listened to all y'all strokin' SMB3's ego like it was early 90's MJ. Aah well, in the end it would not have mattered. Either one will lose to the Chrono Trigger/LttP win, because

Back in Time = Instant Win.
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Contest: 83/96; Division 128 absolutely pwned me...

Oh well, this contest officially makes no sense. Halo and Soul Calibur more popular than Metroid Prime? Oh well, this can be partly attributed to some minor SFF in its match with Wind Waker, along with the obvious Starcraft Anomaly.

This Starcraft Anomaly is a very unique factor that I don't think we've ever seen before. Or have we? Admittedly, this is mostly based on our speculation, but up until this point, the only two factors that have changed percentages in any remarkable way are SFF and Anti-Votes, but even for those, they didn't affect matches enough to alter the outcome. Perhaps, factors similar to the Starcraft Anomaly have been in play before, but the match was not close enough for it to come into play as a deciding factor. Oh well, looks like the next couple of contests just got a lot more interesting, at least from a analyst's point of view.
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Heh Heh... The wind... It is blowing...--Ganondorf

This match is tearing me apart from a prediction standpoint... I have SMB3 with 51% right now but I have this good feeling that LoZ is going to take it...

This. Match. Sucks.

Especially for me. <<
---
Nintendo® - We Make Games Worth Playing
Dodongo Dislikes Smoke - Old Man; The Legend of Zelda

ulti: "CJayC doesn`t care about mass cheating"

chichiri: "He stopped the mass cheating the one time that there was evidence that it existed."

i go with chichiri on this one. i think cjayc does care about "mass cheating". he simply does not define the starcraft voting as "mass cheating".

"Oh well, this contest officially makes no sense."

It idd cost this board one of its greatest users, sorta... *tears* damn you Starcraft! YOU MANIACS. YOU BLEW IT UP. DAMN YOU. GOD DAMN YOU ALL TO HELL.
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ChichiriMuyo is officially the Discussion Guru Encyclopedia - UltimaterializerX
And I'm 23/24 myself. My loss was all part of Alucard's plan. - BigCow

I just saw this and laughed at how Halo was voted over SMB3 to have the best shot at winning this contest.

http://www.gamefaqs.com/poll/index.html?poll=1558

Funny.
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Nintendo® - We Make Games Worth Playing
Dodongo Dislikes Smoke - Old Man; The Legend of Zelda

It idd cost this board one of its greatest users, sorta... *tears* damn you Starcraft! YOU MANIACS. YOU BLEW IT UP. DAMN YOU. GOD DAMN YOU ALL TO HELL.

I would not have voted for Starcraft if I had known AT would actually close his accounts. I thought he was kidding...*sniffle*...
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Married to UltimaterializerX on 5/21/04
Current Sp2K4 Score: 79/92, Next Winner: Final Fantasy X

This. Match. Sucks.

Especially for me. <<

Poor HM, so conflicted, his Nintendrone instincts tearing him in two opposite directions.
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Married to UltimaterializerX on 5/21/04
Current Sp2K4 Score: 79/92, Next Winner: Final Fantasy X

Okay, these StarCraft victories are getting to some peoples heads. Some seem to think SC could beat Ocarina of Time or Final Fantasy VII. Ludicrous.
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Nintendo® - We Make Games Worth Playing
Dodongo Dislikes Smoke - Old Man; The Legend of Zelda

I think you meant to say "Some seem to think SC could beat Wind Waker. Ludicrous." as if you hit your head and thought it was last week, cause really, that's basically the same thing. It's ludicrous, but what about SC isn't?
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ChichiriMuyo is officially the Discussion Guru Encyclopedia - UltimaterializerX
And I'm 23/24 myself. My loss was all part of Alucard's plan. - BigCow

Wind Waker is one thing, one totally different thing. To even think that SC could beat OoT or FFVII...

You know something I`d put my account on the line that it couldn`t. That is something I never do.
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Nintendo® - We Make Games Worth Playing
Dodongo Dislikes Smoke - Old Man; The Legend of Zelda

Now we can't go losing another old timer... before you know it I'll have to leave simply because everyone else that's cool has left too... :(
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ChichiriMuyo is officially the Discussion Guru Encyclopedia - UltimaterializerX
And I'm 23/24 myself. My loss was all part of Alucard's plan. - BigCow

I couldn`t handle StarCraft taking down OoT/FFVII... that would just kill me that battle.NET is doing that much.
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Nintendo® - We Make Games Worth Playing
Dodongo Dislikes Smoke - Old Man; The Legend of Zelda

Me too man, but I won't count out the possibility... I'll just hope that the almighty Kaphwan can save us for the Korean menace... wait a minute.... could Starcraft's wins be part of Kim's plan?
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ChichiriMuyo is officially the Discussion Guru Encyclopedia - UltimaterializerX
And I'm 23/24 myself. My loss was all part of Alucard's plan. - BigCow

Hehe. =P
---
Nintendo® - We Make Games Worth Playing
Dodongo Dislikes Smoke - Old Man; The Legend of Zelda

But AT leaving... part of Kim's plan. It can't be... unless he wants AT to write more RECBT!
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ChichiriMuyo is officially the Discussion Guru Encyclopedia - UltimaterializerX
And I'm 23/24 myself. My loss was all part of Alucard's plan. - BigCow

Like many others, I was also torn with Super Mario Bros. 3 vs. The Legend of Zelda. I finally decided with SMB3, however. SMB3 seems to be liked more, for one thing, which just *might* do something in an SFF match like this. The other thing is that SMB3's rerelease was far more, um, yeah, than Legend of Zelda's.

Also, about underestimating Soul Calibur and Starcraft...what about Halo? I never would've expected that game to even take 45% in a match against Zelda: WW. So that's THREE games we underestimated...

Oh, and notice how KoTOR > FFTA, unless SFF pullled FFTA's percentage down that much. Did you agree with that comparison before SSBM vs. FFX started? Everyone got so caught up in saying how SSBM was disappointing against Vice City, that they didn't think about how well Vice City did against KoTOR.


---
"Ah, a party! We haven't had one of those. It could be fun! So...what is a party?"
"Well, you drink punch and eat CAKE! ...I think."

It sucks that AT is leaving, such an incredibly cool user. =\

As for the next match though, I`d like to comment that from here on out we`re getting user created pictures. CJayC said not to be to overpowering on the game you make the picture for but some obvious overpowering could go on, heh.
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Nintendo® - We Make Games Worth Playing
Dodongo Dislikes Smoke - Old Man; The Legend of Zelda

but I have this good feeling that LoZ is going to take it...

That's because you've been incessantly harping on the Zelda series since LoZ-DK. Give it a rest, man.

By the way, Nintendo has always had the majority of the power on this site, but only Final Fantasy VII is able to overcome every single one of them, so there's no need to talk of a "shift in power back to Nintendo." Square's trump card has ALWAYS been FFVII, and it's proven to be capable of overcoming anything that Nintendo throws at it. Yes, that includes Ocarina of Time. I know you're making yourself believe that Metal Gear Solid and GoldenEye are close in popularity just so you think Zelda can win just like you're doing with FFVI and Chrono Trigger. You're very quick to change your mind so it favors you.
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Spring Contest 2004: 76/92
Today: (2)Super Smash Brothers Melee over (3)Final Fantasy X

http://www.gamefaqs.com/shared/spr04b57.jpg

Thats the picture. Both sides were created by people on this board. Aeowyn created the LoZ picture and Paratroopa1 created the SMB3 picture.
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Nintendo® - We Make Games Worth Playing
Dodongo Dislikes Smoke - Old Man; The Legend of Zelda

Final Fantasy X has lost...what a sad day for me. One of my favorite games ever. It deserved better than to lose in a match totally overshadowed by Starcraft.

smitelf:
but I know that you mentioned cheating in their somewhere and I feel obliged to point out that Starcraft didn’t cheat. Getting support from Battle.net is a valid way to get votes.

I wasn't trying to imply that Battle.net was cheating, though it is likely that some people out there were using dynamic IPs and maybe macros or scripts (perhaps for both sides). It was just a joke about why there would be more incentive for people to cheat for Starcraft than for other games :) In actuality, fanboyism is likely the driving force behind vote stuffing and cheating, rather than self-interest.

On a side note, would it be alright if I changed my sig? It's been a week, and I consider that a decent bet expiration time :)

Haste2:
Oh, and notice how KoTOR > FFTA, unless SFF pullled FFTA's percentage down that much. Did you agree with that comparison before SSBM vs. FFX started? Everyone got so caught up in saying how SSBM was disappointing against Vice City, that they didn't think about how well Vice City did against KoTOR.

Do you mean, how well Knights of the Old Republic did against Vice City? I do think that KotOR > FFTA makes sense. Halo is probably strong, so there goes the "XBox games are weak idea". Hell, Soul Calibur was a Dreamcast game and it did well (though we know SCII probably played a big role in that). And Knights of the Old Republic was #1 in FAQs for a while, as well as being a critically acclaimed game that gamers respect. It's probably significantly stronger than most of us would have thought before the contest, but at this point that makes sense.


About the next match: total toss-up, objectively speaking, though the end result might not be that close. I have been harping on The Legend of Zelda's chances in this match all tournament, but recently I've started to become afraid that SMB3 will probably win. I hope my fears are not justified.

The morning vote might be interesting; I expect The Legend of Zelda to do better with the day vote than with the early night vote. Its track record is better in that regard than SMB3's. So a slight early lead for SMB3 might not be enough.

Of course, SMB3 could always cheat to win if it's trailing at the end...it is Mario after all ;)

Note that the next 4 matches are as close as we presume they will be, then the user-submitted pics might become important.
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smitelf is a far better forecaster of this contest than I could ever hope to be.
I am in awe of her PWNage.

I know you're making yourself believe that Metal Gear Solid and GoldenEye are close in popularity just so you think Zelda can win just like you're doing with FFVI and Chrono Trigger.

I believe both MGS and CT are stronger than GE and FFVI, however, there is absolutely nothing that backs the former up. It is nothing but pure speculation and that match told us absolutely nothing about FFVII or OoT other than they are the powerhouses we expected them to be. I am fine to facts but to say MGS is much stronger than GE is nothing but pure speculation right now. Now, FFVI and CT is speculation but I think everyone could agree that CT is stronger than FFVI. I mean it isn`t fact, but it is hard to believe otherwise. The problem that lies in that is how much more popular is it? If it isn`t a lot then ALttP has a tremendous shot at taking down CT despite being the underdog in the match. Both matches are going to be close, both have no set winner so I don`t see any problem in simply stating one side, that just happens to be for Zelda.
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Nintendo® - We Make Games Worth Playing
Dodongo Dislikes Smoke - Old Man; The Legend of Zelda

On a side note, this is the 3rd match out of the last 4 to break 80,000 votes. Maybe the vote totals will continue to climb here in the last week.

By the way, considering how high FFX's and how low SSBM's prediction percentages were last round, do you think it's possible for Melee to match or even go lower than StarCraft?
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Spring Contest 2004: 76/92
Today: (2)Super Smash Brothers Melee over (3)Final Fantasy X

Calling the day vote tomorrow is going to be hard for me... I`ll have to see how it starts.
---
Nintendo® - We Make Games Worth Playing
Dodongo Dislikes Smoke - Old Man; The Legend of Zelda

Heroic Mario:
that match told us absolutely nothing about FFVII or OoT other than they are the powerhouses we expected them to be.

Yup.

Leonhart4:
On a side note, this is the 3rd match out of the last 4 to break 80,000 votes. Maybe the vote totals will continue to climb here in the last week.

Hey, the Final Fantasy VII vs. Ocarina of Time match might just break 90,000 votes. o_O What an accomplishment that would be... </sarcasm>

By the way, considering how high FFX's and how low SSBM's prediction percentages were last round, do you think it's possible for Melee to match or even go lower than StarCraft?

I wouldn't think so. That would mean less than 36% of those who picked SSBM to get that far would've picked it to win another round. One would think that among people who already picked it to go that far, more than 36% would pick it to advance another round.
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smitelf is a far better forecaster of this contest than I could ever hope to be.
I am in awe of her PWNage.

This match is starting out with some crazy percentages for SMB3. It started out at 76% and right now is settling around 63%, insane..
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Nintendo® - We Make Games Worth Playing
Dodongo Dislikes Smoke - Old Man; The Legend of Zelda

I am thoroughly impressed with SMB3. It's looking strong going into the Final Four. Who knows, it may just make it to the finals.
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"Delicious morsel! Let me get my bib...!" - Ultros
Vote Super Mario Bros. 3!

The percentage for Super Smash Brothers Melee was 14.18%. Anyone wanna take a guess at what it'll be either way for the winner? Melee has a good shot, and StarCraft almost assuredly will set the record for lowest prediction percentage.
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Spring Contest 2004: 80/96
Today: (1)Super Mario Brothers 3 over (2)Tetris

Starcraft I think will be over 5 if it wins. Melee will be around 10.

And even if LoZ picks up the day vote, SMB3's got this one.

I need someone to do some number crunching for me...but I feel a new theory should be discussed. The FF Fanboy SFF Relevance Theory.

FFVI, FF Tactics, and FFX have all failed to defeat worthy opponents. They beat cupcakes and they beat 2nd tier games with ease, but in the face of a challenge they all failed to get the job done. Tactics, viewed as the weakest of the 3, came the closest to a win when it lost narrowly to upper 2nd tier (only on this site) game MGS.

I think with FFVII facing its first truly worthy foe in 2 days this theory deserves mention...are the FF fanboys truly only loyal to their dear FFVII and willing to vote otherwise in other situations? Or are they simply outnumbered by Nintendites each and every time? Or is it too close to really be determined?

Any comments? Or have I gotten so desperate for answers after my 128 division died last night.

On a side note, I honestly did have SSBM over WW in the final two originally. But what do I do? Change it to FFX. Oh well. Considering how things are this spring, 76/96 aint too overly bad for the end of 3 rounds...

Nice pics by the way...real creativity! Look forward to the next 6 days worth!
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SCK24: 76/96 Trivia XIII: Diehards Forever
Steve Illumina: Standing tall against fanboys for over 20 years

I think the FFVII-MGS poll proved that it's on an entirely different level from the rest of the series. If it beats OoT and then faces SSBM in the Final Four, we'll see just how large that gap is because I'd expect FFX to be 2nd in line.
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Spring Contest 2004: 80/96
Today: (1)Super Mario Brothers 3 over (2)Tetris

I`m still shocked at this beating... 61%? That is just to much for two high quality games like this.
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Nintendo® - We Make Games Worth Playing
Dodongo Dislikes Smoke - Old Man; The Legend of Zelda