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| Spring 2004 Contest |
| Stats & Discussion - Spring 2004 Contest - Part 3 |
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| From: smitelf | Posted: 4/29/2004 8:02:36 AM | Message Detail |
| Well, I'm talking mostly about lead in percentage, not votes. Say, for example if FF7 gets the same number of votes than OoT between 1 AM and 3 AM; according to this model, it means that overall, OoT will get more votes on the whole day. Okay, never mind. It just occurred to me that we’re not talking about the same instance of time. My bad…I always think of the end of a match being between 1 AM and 3 AM because I’m on the east coast but you were talking about the beginning. D’oh! (6) Starcraft (11) Star Wars: Knights of the Old Republic Ulti! Don’t do that to me! The horror, the horror…two of my favorite games against each other in the first round…ugh, don’t force me to contemplate it! I’m already in pre-mourning of KOTOR’s eventual defeat at the hands of Vice City. Then again, if KOTOR was against Starcraft, at least it would be losing to a worth opponent. --- Engaged to MWIS 04/07/04 Current Sp2K4 Score: 25/26, Next Winner: The Legend of Zelda: The Wind Waker |
| From: smitelf | Posted: 4/29/2004 8:06:33 AM | Message Detail |
| *worthy --- Engaged to MWIS 04/07/04 Current Sp2K4 Score: 25/26, Next Winner: The Legend of Zelda: The Wind Waker |
| From: steve illumina | Posted: 4/29/2004 8:09:41 AM | Message Detail |
| Ulti!
Don’t do that to me! The horror, the horror…two of my favorite games
against each other in the first round…ugh, don’t force me to
contemplate it! I’m already in pre-mourning of KOTOR’s eventual defeat
at the hands of Vice City. Smitelf, I agree 100% here...I originally had KOTOR in my bracket here but changed it cause the clueless GTA fanboys will be too many for it to overcome. A real shame too... --- SC2K4: 22/26! Read my Satirical Contest Commentary! Steve Illumina: Standing tall against fanboys for over 20 years |
| From: goku z | Posted: 4/29/2004 8:12:23 AM | Message Detail |
| I'm
starting to feel better about my prediction of SSB:M going to the Final
Four, taking out FFX and Z:WW on the way. Still a little iffy though... --- "Get busy livin' or get busy dyin'.....your damn right." - Red, The Shawshank Redemption |
| From: UltimaterializerX | Posted: 4/29/2004 8:17:47 AM | Message Detail |
| My thoughts on the thing: Division 8: The easiest to seed by far. And you can call me crazy for having Zelda 1 as the favorite all you want, but I am doubting my picking against it in the divisional final more and more. The only real issue I came across was seeding 6-9. I placed Duck Hunt over Donkey Kong duer to the fact that Duck Hunt wins the match if it gets two more updates. Pac Man and Contra were the other issue, as it took a little thinking to see who could beat who. But all in all, I think my seeding there would get most of you to agree with me, give or take a pick here and there. I suppose River City Ransom and Phantasy Star`s order could be debated as well. The division also makes for some killer matches. Contra vs Pac Man? Tetris vs Metroid? Ouch. Division 16: Aside from Division 128, this was the hardest to seed. The first three seeds are obvious enough, as well as the last two, but it`s difficult from there. Super Metroid and Super Mario World are probably locked into 4 and 5, but how so? A match between those two would be absolutely killer on brackets. Going down the list, I think the 6 spot is good for Sonic 2. After that though, it`s pure hell. Super Mario RPG beating Street Fighter 2 is nice, but where does Mortal Kombet fit into all this? And Earthbound couldn`t beat Doom, but what about Secret of Mana? That little triangle was annoying to seed. And farther down the list, PSIV and the Simpsons was a total tossup for me. And like I said, there are a couple of killer matchups in this division, highlighted by the Chrono Trigger/LTTP/FF6 triangle. Division 32-64: Easy division to seed. FF7 and OOT are locks for their spots, and the only question near the bottom is whether or not Pokémon deserves to be seeded higher than Fallout 2. Figuring out where to put Resident Evil and Xenogears was tough, but not all that impossible. The big issue in this division was whether or not to switch seeds between MGS and FFT. I left them alone, but you never know. And this new division would have some rediculous matchups to try and call. Perfect Dark vs Xenogears? FFT vs MGS? Goldeneye vs Super Mario 64? Catlevania vs Resident Evil? Damn. Division 128: Before anyone complains about this one, THIS WAS A COMPLETE ***** TO SEED. The only thing we`re going to agree on is that shenume belongs at the bottom. Now, the top five seeds are all locked into their spots, but in which order? I maintain that the winner o fSSBM/FFX wins the division, so I put them at 1 and 2, but only because I think SSBM will win the thing. Putting Final Fantasy X at #1 just didn`t look right. Right below that is the Wind Waker and Metroid Prime; between those four games, we have yet to see what the true order will be, so rearrange them however you see fit. But I think we can at least all agree that those are the top four games in the division. From there, it`s just unfair. MGS2 at 5 seems good enough, but everything after that is just crazy. Seeding everything from six all the way down to 12 was a total mess, and I rearranged everything several times. I even took a break to seed the other three bottom-feeders, and wound up putting Skies over both FFTA and Fire Emblem. (cont.) --- Boards Hunted: 4098 I would like to take this moment to politely and sincerely orgasm over Ulti's Halo/Starcraft analysis. -smitelf |
| From: UltimaterializerX | Posted: 4/29/2004 8:33:52 AM | Message Detail |
| Now,
the reasons I did what I did for 6-12. I maintain that Half-Life is
going to shock people come tomorrow. It won`t beat Metroid Prime, but
it is far stronger than Gordon Freeman, similar to FF6 being far
stronger than Kefka. In my opinion, Gordon not winning in 2002 was a
total fluke, and him not winning in 2003 was seeding. He`ll win a match
sooner or later. But for now, I think all the games seeded 6-11 can
beat Half-Life as it currently stands, though this may change. But from there, it`s literally dead ****ing even. I onyl have Star Wars at #11 because it`s an Xbox exclusive, and we all know what that means. So for that alone, though the hate won`t be much, I think Star Wars suffers. The next anomaly is why Vice City is a 7 seed. Well originally, I had Vice City as an 11, then a 10, and up against every other game in the pack in the first round. Finally, here`s what happened. I had to seed Starcraft somewhere first, despite my desperate desite to have a 7-10 Starcraft vs Halo match with Starcraft as the 7 seed. But the problem then is that Kingdom Hearts and Vice City would both be seeded above Halo; frankly, I think Halo could beat either of those games. So what I did was finally decide to put Starcraft at #6. It already beat Halo, and frankly, that gives it enough power to be at the 6 spot, just under the heavy hitters of the division. From there, it was just seeding Vice City, Halo, Kingdom Hearts, and Soul Calibur. Now, despite what I said earlier about Halo being able to beat both VC and KH, this doesn`t mean I could actually put Halo at, say, the 7 spot. Currently, Halo would have to be a tad lower, so I did some more thinking. Kingdom Hearts and Soul Calibur was close, but if anything it proved that Soul Calibur may be the weakest of the four games left. So I slapped it at 10 and decided to leave it alone. From there, I just put Vice City at 7 so that we could have ourselves a Halo/Kingdom Hearts matchup right there in the first round, with Kingdom Hearts being the 8 seed primarily because of bracket and anti-Xbox voting. While Halo could very well win that matchup, I just couldn`t seed it that far ahead of Soul Calibur. Frankly, no matter where Halo goes, it won`t perform to its seeding. It will always be either too strong or too weak. So I figured I`d give the best match possible, though Halo and KH are easily interchangeable. But even after all that, Vice City doesn`t look right at 7. I might tweak that a bit later. --- Boards Hunted: 4098 I would like to take this moment to politely and sincerely orgasm over Ulti's Halo/Starcraft analysis. -smitelf |
| From: UltimaterializerX | Posted: 4/29/2004 8:34:44 AM | Message Detail |
| smitelf, I ever tell you I love you? As an internet friend that refuses to e-mail me, at least <3 --- Boards Hunted: 4098 I would like to take this moment to politely and sincerely orgasm over Ulti's Halo/Starcraft analysis. -smitelf |
| From: smitelf | Posted: 4/29/2004 8:36:28 AM | Message Detail |
| smitelf, I ever tell you I love you? As an internet friend that refuses to e-mail me, at least <3 I *did* email you...twice...O_o --- Engaged to MWIS 04/07/04 Current Sp2K4 Score: 25/26, Next Winner: The Legend of Zelda: The Wind Waker |
| From: UltimaterializerX | Posted: 4/29/2004 8:38:05 AM | Message Detail |
| Really? When? --- Boards Hunted: 4098 I would like to take this moment to politely and sincerely orgasm over Ulti's Halo/Starcraft analysis. -smitelf |
| From: UltimaterializerX | Posted: 4/29/2004 8:41:48 AM | Message Detail |
| I only see one e-mail, but hey, it`s there. Thanks, yo. --- Boards Hunted: 4098 I would like to take this moment to politely and sincerely orgasm over Ulti's Halo/Starcraft analysis. -smitelf |
| From: smitelf | Posted: 4/29/2004 9:10:39 AM | Message Detail |
| (1) Super Smash Brothers: Melee (16) Shenume (8) Kingdom Hearts (9) Halo: Combat Evolved (5) Metal Gear Solid 2: Sons of Liberty (12) Half-Life (4) Metroid Prime (13) Skies of Arcadia (6) Starcraft (11) Star Wars: Knights of the Old Republic (3) The Legend of Zelda: The Wind Waker (14) Final Fantasy Tactics Advanced (7) Grand Theft Auto: Vice City (10) Soul Calibur (2) Final Fantasy X (15) Fire Emblem I’m sure I’ve posted my dream seeding elsewhere before but here’s what I would suggest: (1) Final Fantasy X (16) Shenmue (8) Starcraft (9) Halo: Combat Evolved (5) Grand Theft Auto: Vice City (12) Star Wars: Knights of the Old Republic (4) Metroid Prime (13) Final Fantasy Tactics Advanced (3) The Legend of Zelda: The Wind Waker (14) Skies of Arcadia (6) Metal Gear Solid 2: Sons of Liberty (11) Half-Life (7) Kingdom Hearts (10) Soul Calibur (2) Super Smash Brothers: Melee (15) Fire Emblem The first four are locks – what matters is where you put them, in particular FFX and SSB:M but we won't know for sure on that one for a while. I completely disagree with MGS2 as a 5th seed – that honor should go to GTA:VC. It’s one of the most underestimated games in this division (I probably overestimated it in thinking it could take down SSB:M, though I’m still confident it won’t be anything near a massacre). The fact that it beat MGS2 in nominations (or at least that’s what I assume; CJay obviously tinkered with the placement of games a bit but I don’t see any reason why VC vs. KOTOR or SSBM vs. MGS2 would be orchestrated) and is on the same console should tell you something, and it definitely isn’t a cult issue like Earthbound or a lack of competition issue like Halo that caused it. For MGS2 I was divided over whether or not to put it over KH but decided to do so because I think it might have a broader base of appeal on this site, despite KH being a Square RPG. It’s also a Disney game and its weakness was proven yesterday when it just barely beat off a fighter. I don’t care how popular of a fighter it is – a Square RPG should not have trouble taking down a fighter on this site. KH failed to impress and I’m thinking that it got into the bracket based on a fanbase that isn’t consistent with the reality of the voting populace. Well, more honestly, I still wanted to have Kingdom Hearts against Soul Calibur and MGS2 was the only game that could fit the missing space between VC and KH plausibly. Everything between 7th and 10th is pretty much equal. We’ve already seen that there is little difference in popularity between Halo and Starcraft and Kingdom Hearts and Soul Calibur. I don’t think it’s a great leap of the imagination to theorize that the Starcraft vs. Kingdom Hearts match will be interesting, as well, although I still expect KH to win. I switched your KOTOR and Half-Life seeding around, Ulti, because we’ve seen how Halo vs. Starcraft turned out, and KOTOR is much weaker than Halo, while I would consider Half-Life to be on almost equal footing with Starcraft. I also switched FFTA with Skies of Arcadia because of the “Final Fantasy” advantage. Oh. I have an exam in less than two hours. I should probably be studying now. --- Engaged to MWIS 04/07/04 Current Sp2K4 Score: 25/26, Next Winner: The Legend of Zelda: The Wind Waker |
| From: smitelf | Posted: 4/29/2004 9:12:49 AM | Message Detail |
| Haha, I noticed that I *still* ended up with GTA:VC vs. KOTOR... --- Engaged to MWIS 04/07/04 Current Sp2K4 Score: 25/26, Next Winner: The Legend of Zelda: The Wind Waker |
| From: smitelf | Posted: 4/29/2004 9:14:27 AM | Message Detail |
| Oh yeah, and I ordered the matches wrong. It should be: (1) Final Fantasy X (16) Shenmue (8) Starcraft (9) Halo: Combat Evolved (5) Grand Theft Auto: Vice City (12) Star Wars: Knights of the Old Republic (4) Metroid Prime (13) Final Fantasy Tactics Advanced (6) Metal Gear Solid 2: Sons of Liberty (11) Half-Life (3) The Legend of Zelda: The Wind Waker (14) Skies of Arcadia (7) Kingdom Hearts (10) Soul Calibur (2) Super Smash Brothers: Melee (15) Fire Emblem --- Engaged to MWIS 04/07/04 Current Sp2K4 Score: 25/26, Next Winner: The Legend of Zelda: The Wind Waker |
| From: smitelf | Posted: 4/29/2004 9:19:34 AM | Message Detail |
| I only see one e-mail, but hey, it`s there. Thanks, yo. Well, hey, at least one got there. The other one I sent yesterday but maybe I spelled the email address wrong or something. Wouldn't be the first time. --- Engaged to MWIS 04/07/04 Current Sp2K4 Score: 25/26, Next Winner: The Legend of Zelda: The Wind Waker |
| From: steve illumina | Posted: 4/29/2004 9:58:01 AM | Message Detail |
| Hmm, I did not get an email... ^_^ Ulti ya did good, for the 64 games that are here in the contest, your seedings are the best I have seen. Now if the 64 games to be picked and seeded were up to me...the brackets below would be my dream tourney of 64 greatest games, based on historical significance as well as being worthy. Some may love it, some may hate it, but I think it came out pretty fair and representative of gaming history as a whole. Enjoy :) "A greatest game contest should be just that. It should cover the greatest games in history for their contributions to this entertainment medium we all love...and each of these divisions has fluff that dont belong. Fluff that takes the place of far more worthy games. I shall list below what this tourney would have been if it were up to me. Below, my historically accurate greatest game tourney brackets..." Division 8 1: Legend of Zelda 16: Adventure 8: Ms Pac Man 9: Centipede 5: Punch Out! 12: Metroid 4: Mega Man 2 13: Gauntlet 6: Final Fantasy I 11: Phantasy Star 3: Tetris 14: Space Invaders 7: Donkey Kong 10: River Raid 2: SMB 3 15: Pong Get rid of: Metal Gear, Pac Man, Contra, Pitfall, Duck Hunt, RCR and Galaga Division 16 1 Street Fighter 2 16 StarFox 8 NBA Jam 9 Warcraft II 5 Super Mario World 12 Doom 4 Mortal Kombat II 13 Donkey Kong Country 6 Super Metroid 11 Final Fantasy IV 3 Sonic the Hedgehog 14 F-Zero 7 Super Mario Kart 10 Sim City 2. FFVI 15 Command and Conquer Get rid of: Chrono Trigger, Mana, Mario RPG, Shining Force, Simpsons, Gunstar, P Star IV, Earthbound and Mortal Kombat Division 32-64 1 FFVII 16 Panzer Dragoon Saga 8 Ultima Online 9 Madden Football 5 Castlevania Symphony 12 Resident Evil 4 Metal Gear Solid 13 Diablo 6 Quake 11 Radiant Silvergun 3 Mario 64 14 C&C: Red Alert 7 Goldeneye 10 Pokemon 2 Zelda Ocarina 15 Virtua Fighter Get rid of: Suikoden II, Xenogears, FF Tactics, DDR, P Dark, Nights, Fallout 2 Division 128 1 Halo 16 Counterstrike 8 Everquest 9 Metal Gear Solid 2 5 Super Smash Bros Melee 12 Tony Hawk Pro Skater 4 4 Soul Caliber 2 13 Ninja Gaiden 6 GTA: Vice City 11 Metroid Prime 3 Gran Turismo 3 14 Kingdom Hearts 7 StarCraft 10 Wind Waker 2 FFX 15 Splinter Cell Get rid of: Soul Caliber 1, Half Life, Skies of Arcadia, FFTA, Fire Emblem, Shenmue, Star Wars Feel free to comment! --- SC2K4: 22/26! Read my Satirical Contest Commentary! Steve Illumina: Standing tall against fanboys for over 20 years |
| From: steve illumina | Posted: 4/29/2004 1:50:47 PM | Message Detail |
| bump...quiet today hehe --- SCK24: 22/26 Trivia XIII: Diehards Forever Steve Illumina: Standing tall against fanboys for over 20 years |
| From: ChichiriMuyo | Posted: 4/29/2004 3:49:36 PM | Message Detail |
| Im gonna disagree with you steve, before I go and read everything else I missed. For "historical accuracy" Pac-Man is more important than Ms. Pac-Man and Pitfall is more important than River Raid in the 8-bit era. And, as sad as it makes your two additions look, both would score better as well. Also, if we're talking historical accuracy as you put it then Duck Hunt needs to be in, because we wouldn't have the light gun genre without it really. And neither FF nor PS deserve teh spot more than Dragon Warrior. 16-bit, whoo boy. MK did more than MK2. MK2 was just a sequel, after all. You've also dissed sidescrolling beat'em ups twice now since you've taken out The Simpsons and RCR and didn't add TMNT. That's like saying the genre is unimportant. Though I would say that Final Fight deserves the spot more than The Simpsons. You've added too much emphasis to RTS, so Command and Conquer is unnecessary. War2 did more than War 1 though, so it can stay I guess. Allowing 2 Final Fantasies in an era based setups makes for an unfair advantage for the series. SoM and CT were both more deserving because one basically brought Action-RPGs to life and without it we'd be without KH and so many other big games, and the other showed that RPGs can be more than they had ever been before. For 32/64 you removed NiGHTS. Obviously you know nothing. It's that simple. Red Alert was bigger than C&C had a much largre effect on the genre, so I guess it can stay, but RA and War2 seem to me to be contemporaries. I was pl;aying RA only a year or so after War2 and graphically they are on the same level. And Finally, despite your personal tastes you have no reason to remove DDR. It has single handedly kept the arcade scene alive in this country. Fighting games used to be the kings of the arcades and that's what every arcade junky played and talked about, now it's ddr. People still play fighters but they can go home and play them in an arcade perfect port. Short of spending $800 you cannot get an arcade perfect experience at home. $800 of course being the cost of an official Konami arcade style metal pad. Madden has no place, though. Madden was kickin' back in the 16 bit days, so if any Madden gets in it may as well be in 16 bit. There were no revolutions from that series in that era that weren't force by competitors getting too close or beating the Madden series in a given area. And the crap-shoot era. Firstly, not only is Soul Calibur a better game than Soul Calibur 2, it's also far more revolutionary. It also beat out SC2 to get into this contest, so it is more deserving in every way. Counterstrike is a Half-Life mod. It isn't even a full game, really. It doesn't deserve the spot, and counterstrike fans can vote for the game that they actually bought. Shenmue is more deserving than Splinter Cell. You may not like it... hell, I didn't even like it... but it is far more revolutionary. It is more likely to be called a masterpiece of a game today, and it will probably be more likely to be called a masterpiece of a game in 10 years. In 10 years Tom Clancy will be Stephen King, we'll be wondering if he's actually coming up wih this crap or if he made an elaborate computer program that writes his books for him. Splinter Cell doesn't have a book it's based off of, right? But it's still TC, and we had Rainbow Six first. TH4 should go, put TH2 in for the previous generation and throw out Quake or something equally useless. Skies of Arcadia needs to stay in, and if you still think Halo deserves that 1 seed you're dellerious. Not only have we seen that it doesn't perform like a seed (a fact that was never in any doubt in my mind) but it's also not revolutionary. Going through areas that all look exactly the same is lame. I haven't had to do that very often since before the NES, and even then that was because I was actually going through the same 1 level over and over again or there wasn't a background. It's poorly designed and offers nothing to the genre that wasn't done better earlier. |
| From: ChichiriMuyo | Posted: 4/29/2004 3:56:58 PM | Message Detail |
| "nh82, I don't think you have to worry about GoldenEye losing. GoldenEye was twice as popular as Perfect Dark was" I'm gonna disagree there. We haven't yet got enough evidence to prove that the fanbases of GE and PD are that dissimilar. PDS was one of those games that is good enough to deserve a shot at the title Best Game Ever but doesn't have the popularity to back it up. A game that only had 6,000 copies made for the US isn't a great measuring stick. The GE vs. SotN match is still up in the air, but I have fait in Alucard's plan. --- ChichiriMuyo is officially the Discussion Guru Encyclopedia - UltimaterializerX And I'm 23/24 myself. My loss was all part of Alucard's plan. - BigCow |
| From: UltimaterializerX | Posted: 4/29/2004 3:58:22 PM | Message Detail |
| In
10 years Tom Clancy will be Stephen King, we'll be wondering if he's
actually coming up wih this crap or if he made an elaborate computer
program that writes his books for him. >>>>>>>>>>>>XD --- Boards Hunted: 4098 I would like to take this moment to politely and sincerely orgasm over Ulti's Halo/Starcraft analysis. -smitelf |
| From: UltimaterializerX | Posted: 4/29/2004 4:00:30 PM | Message Detail |
| I
believe a loss in the second round will all be a part of Alucard`s
plan. He shall throw the match against Goldeneye because he does not
wish to dominate the contest; he wishes for this contest to be fair
after all, as he could dominate with ease. Anyway, to be a bit more serious, let me try my crack at what steve posted. --- Boards Hunted: 4098 I would like to take this moment to politely and sincerely orgasm over Ulti's Halo/Starcraft analysis. -smitelf |
| From: FastFalcon05 | Posted: 4/29/2004 4:02:20 PM | Message Detail |
| you may not be able to get the arcade experience, but the floor pad for ddr is great, too. --- Silly Rabbit...Trix are for....kids. |
| From: creativename | Posted: 4/29/2004 4:05:54 PM | Message Detail |
| My
little brother (who is 12, in 6th grade) told me something that I found
very interesting indeed. We were talking about Starcraft, and he said
that "almost all of my friends own Starcraft". I was very surprised at
this, and told him how could that be when all his friends were only 5-7
years old when it came out? He said that it is still popular. He also
said that Warcraft (I'm assuming he meant III) is hugely popular and
very heavily played by kids his age. I trust what he says because he's always been very accurate when it comes to this sort of stuff. Him telling me how extremely excited kids his age were for Pirates of the Caribbean (months before its release) was the first thing that led me to believe it might have a $40+ million opening weekend. Its legs were spectacular and legs are difficult to gauge until you hear the word of mouth after the movie is released, but I would not have guessed at it's strong opening otherwise. Shows how not only is the average gamer becoming older as the gaming industry matures (my idea is that eventually playing video games with your kids will be just like taking the family to a movie), but that younger gamers are always getting more sophisticated. --- Remember to nominate Frog from Chrono Trigger for Summer Contest 2K4! SC2K4.com |
| From: ChichiriMuyo | Posted: 4/29/2004 4:07:29 PM | Message Detail |
| Tried
to IM you, Ulti, but I can't. Those games are all Greatest Hits games
and shouldn't cost more than $20 off the self. You can, however, buy
them off of ebay SEALED for even less than that. I'd post links but you
know, kinda not supposed to post links for stuff like that. Quick
rundown of what I found without trying at all: SotN sealed - $13.50 +4
s&h, CC sealed - $15 + $4 S&H, Xenogears sealed - $15.50 + $4
s&h. Yes, I own all, yes they are all worth it. $20 after shipping
at buy it now prices for unopened games. No bidding, little waiting. I
like this ebay stuff. :) --- ChichiriMuyo is officially the Discussion Guru Encyclopedia - UltimaterializerX And I'm 23/24 myself. My loss was all part of Alucard's plan. - BigCow |
| From: redline15 | Posted: 4/29/2004 4:17:32 PM | Message Detail |
| some long-winded responses to ultimaterializer's bracket, because i feel like it: I placed Duck Hunt over Donkey Kong duer to the fact that Duck Hunt wins the match if it gets two more updates. yes...but it did not. and i doubt the match would play out in the same way if held again. besides...giving duck hunt a #6 and donkey kong #7 just...looks wrong... Aside from Division 128, this was the hardest to seed. The first three seeds are obvious enough... i was going to say you were jumping to conclusions by putting ff6 above lttp... ...but with chrono trigger in the top spot, it actually looks better that way. so never mind. ...you are welcome for the wasted space. In my opinion, Gordon not winning in 2002 was a total fluke, and him not winning in 2003 was seeding. He`ll win a match sooner or later. ...he was given a #7 seed after losing to a #14 seed that gave the #11 seed less trouble than her first round opponent. he had a higher seed than any first round failure but kirby...and he still failed again. gordon would have to get a #1 seed and face off against aiai before he'd even have a chance to... ...no, i take that back. he'd lose that match too. But the problem then is that Kingdom Hearts and Vice City would both be seeded above Halo; frankly, I think Halo could beat either of those games. before the contest started, i wouldn't have. i still think they could beat it, in fact...but i can obviously see where kingdom hearts could have some trouble. ...that division is just guesses at this point anyway, though. we'll see how accurate they were within a week... --- signature (n.): a random bit of gibberish that no one ever reads. |
| From: ChichiriMuyo | Posted: 4/29/2004 4:17:42 PM | Message Detail |
| "you may not be able to get the arcade experience, but the floor pad for ddr is great, too." Either you're joking or you aren't a serious ddr player. I can assure you, I've nearly broken bones attempting Max300 at home due to the pad slipping. And that was on Standard, not heavy. I will only play DDR in the arcade unless Im excessively bored, and even then I'll play Beatmania IIDX before I play DDR as the controller is much more accurate to the real thing and less likely to severely injure me when I try to do things that I can do with eas in the arcade. Ulti - you may be right, Alucard does like to play fair, but I think he has it in him to whoop GE's ass first before bowing out to the inferior yet excellent (to some degree) OoT (or, perhaps if there is a god, Mario 64). --- ChichiriMuyo is officially the Discussion Guru Encyclopedia - UltimaterializerX And I'm 23/24 myself. My loss was all part of Alucard's plan. - BigCow |
| From: UltimaterializerX | Posted: 4/29/2004 4:24:06 PM | Message Detail |
| Division 8 1: Legend of Zelda 16: Adventure 8: Ms Pac Man 9: Centipede 5: Punch Out! 12: Metroid 4: Mega Man 2 13: Gauntlet 6: Final Fantasy I 11: Phantasy Star 3: Tetris 14: Space Invaders 7: Donkey Kong 10: River Raid 2: SMB 3 15: Pong Get rid of: Metal Gear, Pac Man, Contra, Pitfall, Duck Hunt, RCR and Galaga First of all, I completely agree that subbing in Ms. Pac Man for Pac Man is a bit silly. Taking out Duck Hunt and Galaga don`t seem too smart either, but bear in mind I`m only 21. You might be older than me and remember that all of these games actually meant for the era. Personally, I`d take out River Raid, Space Invaders, Phantasy Star, and Pac Man in favor of Pac Man, Duck Hunt, Galaga, and Arkanoid. I would also consider removing Adventure for the original Super Mario Brothers. I think we all agree that the one game per series rule is stupid as hell. Division 16 1 Street Fighter 2 16 StarFox 8 NBA Jam 9 Warcraft II 5 Super Mario World 12 Doom 4 Mortal Kombat II 13 Donkey Kong Country 6 Super Metroid 11 Final Fantasy IV 3 Sonic the Hedgehog 14 F-Zero 7 Super Mario Kart 10 Sim City 2. FFVI 15 Command and Conquer Get rid of: Chrono Trigger, Mana, Mario RPG, Shining Force, Simpsons, Gunstar, P Star IV, Earthbound and Mortal Kombat You don`t have to like RPGs, but saying that Chrono Trigger and SMRPG don`t belong in this contest is ludicrous. Earthbound is also debateable, but the rest are iffy enough to not be missed if they`re off the bracket. And I noticed how you discreetly dismissed LTTP. Bad move. And Street Fighter 2 a 1 seed? NBA Jam and C&C in the bracket? Starcraft has proven beyond a doubt that it is the best PC game ever seen in this contest, and no sporting game deserves a place on a gamefaqs bracket. Most of them would get killed by damn near anything in one of our matches. And Star Fox wasn`t major until the N64 days. I`d get rid of Star Fox, C&C, NBA Jam, Sim City, and Warcraft 2 in favor of LTTP, Chrono Trigger, SMRPG, Final Fantasy IV, and some random popular game of your choosing. --- Boards Hunted: 4098 I would like to take this moment to politely and sincerely orgasm over Ulti's Halo/Starcraft analysis. -smitelf |
| From: The n00b Avenger | Posted: 4/29/2004 4:26:41 PM | Message Detail |
| Why take out Chrono Trigger and leave in FF6? That seems really silly. --- www.rpgdl.com The RPG Dueling League Where smart men argue about dumb things |
| From: ChichiriMuyo | Posted: 4/29/2004 4:29:56 PM | Message Detail |
| Wow,
I didn;'t even notice LttP was missing, all I looked at was what didn't
belong and what he said he took out. What a crackhead! LttP could still
win that friggin' division as it stands, and it's still better than any
Zelda released since it came out. Gotta disagree with you taking ou
Space Invaders though, Ulti. This is a game that caused an entire
nation to have a coin shortage after all. And unlike a lot of other big
games of its day it still hold up like Ms. Pac-Man does. Both really
are excellent games even now. --- ChichiriMuyo is officially the Discussion Guru Encyclopedia - UltimaterializerX And I'm 23/24 myself. My loss was all part of Alucard's plan. - BigCow |
| From: redline15 | Posted: 4/29/2004 4:32:00 PM | Message Detail |
| i might place space invaders as high as #5 in a historically accurate bracket. ...it deserves a higher rank than centipede, at any rate. --- signature (n.): a random bit of gibberish that no one ever reads. |
| From: UltimaterializerX | Posted: 4/29/2004 4:33:56 PM | Message Detail |
| You
tried to IM me, but couldn`t? Did you take me off of your closed list
or something? You`re still on my buddy list just fine. Wierd, very
wierd... my comp might have been on the fritz or something, I dunno.
But either way, those prices are NICE. Division 32-64 1 FFVII 16 Panzer Dragoon Saga 8 Ultima Online 9 Madden Football 5 Castlevania Symphony 12 Resident Evil 4 Metal Gear Solid 13 Diablo 6 Quake 11 Radiant Silvergun 3 Mario 64 14 C&C: Red Alert 7 Goldeneye 10 Pokemon 2 Zelda Ocarina 15 Virtua Fighter Get rid of: Suikoden II, Xenogears, FF Tactics, DDR, P Dark, Nights, Fallout 2 You cannot get rid of FFT, Perfect Dark, Xenogears, Suikoden, or even NiGHTS and DDR. They`re all too good for what they did for gaming. I think the only game that could have really been taken out of this division was Fallout 2, and even that`s debatable. Though if we`re going to take a game out, let it be Fallout 2 in favor of putting Starcraft where it ****ing belongs. The fact that a 16th seeded Starcraft might win two games in Division 128 proves how strong a 32 bit game it is. Division 128 1 Halo 16 Counterstrike 8 Everquest 9 Metal Gear Solid 2 5 Super Smash Bros Melee 12 Tony Hawk Pro Skater 4 4 Soul Caliber 2 13 Ninja Gaiden 6 GTA: Vice City 11 Metroid Prime 3 Gran Turismo 3 14 Kingdom Hearts 7 StarCraft 10 Wind Waker 2 FFX 15 Splinter Cell Get rid of: Soul Caliber 1, Half Life, Skies of Arcadia, FFTA, Fire Emblem, Shenmue, Star Wars Hell. ****ing. No. Counterstrike in favor of Half-Life? Don`t confuse Half-Life with Gordon Freeman on this site. Half-Life is an amazing game. Soul Calibur 2 probably deserves the spot over one, though Chichiri`s reasons for disagreeing are good ones. Skies of Arcadia also belongs, though I can understand getting rid of FFTA, Shenume, and Fire Emblem. Oh, and Star Wars also belongs. Nice call on Ninja Gaiden though. I`d get rid of Counterstrike, Everquest, Starcraft (so it can go in D32), Gran Turismo, and Tony Hawk. As for what to put in place of all the missing games, who knows. --- Boards Hunted: 4098 I would like to take this moment to politely and sincerely orgasm over Ulti's Halo/Starcraft analysis. -smitelf |
| From: ChichiriMuyo | Posted: 4/29/2004 4:34:53 PM | Message Detail |
| "In
1991 we released the Super Nintendo Entertainment System, and followed
that a year later with the release of The Legend of Zelda: A Link to
the Past on that system. With this title, the Zelda series once again
returned to the top-down isometric view. It can probably be said that
were it not for this title, the Zelda franchise would never have
developed. " - Eiji Aonuma the Zelda Guru (Quote from a link in the
most recent Nintendo-news e-mail.) --- ChichiriMuyo is officially the Discussion Guru Encyclopedia - UltimaterializerX And I'm 23/24 myself. My loss was all part of Alucard's plan. - BigCow |
| From: UltimaterializerX | Posted: 4/29/2004 4:36:20 PM | Message Detail |
| redline and his love for the ellipse ~_^ And you also think LTTP was the best Zelda game, Chichiri? Sweet. Like I`ve said a million times, I had LTTP in the finals before listening to the board. All hell will break loose if it beats Chrono Trigger. --- Boards Hunted: 4098 I would like to take this moment to politely and sincerely orgasm over Ulti's Halo/Starcraft analysis. -smitelf |
| From: Yesmar | Posted: 4/29/2004 4:38:09 PM | Message Detail |
| Oh well, nothing much to say today. Wind Waker's winning by as much as everyone expected, and we won't be able to properly gauge its popularity against Metroid Prime until tomorrow's match. --- Heh Heh... The wind... It is blowing...--Ganondorf |
| From: redline15 | Posted: 4/29/2004 4:43:18 PM | Message Detail |
| redline and his love for the ellipse ~_^ at least i'm using commas now. if i'm going to keep complaining about no one reading my posts, i might as well make them readable... --- signature (n.): a random bit of gibberish that no one ever reads. |
| From: Heroic Mario | Posted: 4/29/2004 4:45:36 PM | Message Detail |
| Heh, you read that too Chichiri? =) --- Nintendo® - The Beginning and the End He who hesitates is lost. |
| From: creativename | Posted: 4/29/2004 4:48:07 PM | Message Detail |
| It can probably be said that were it not for this title, the Zelda franchise would never have developed Rather trivial statement, since the same can be said for almost every game that has sequels. --- Remember to nominate Frog from Chrono Trigger for Summer Contest 2K4! SC2K4.com |
| From: Slowflake | Posted: 4/29/2004 4:48:45 PM | Message Detail |
| Heh, almost forgot the preview again. Coming up soon, don't worry. P.S.: There's not a single copy of Starcraft for sale in town. Dammit. --- SpC2K4 Status --- Points: 021/026 --- Matches: 21/26 --- Rank: ?????/????? --- Today's pick: Wind Waker |
| From: ChichiriMuyo | Posted: 4/29/2004 4:49:38 PM | Message Detail |
| Nah, Aim has just been spazzing on me lately. Agreed that most of those games in 32/64 deserve to stay, but GE is enough representation and PD could still go without really being missed overall. And I still disagree with SC2 deserving it more than SC. A good portion of the nominators agree with me. The fact alone that it beat out SC2 to get in when they both fought for the same division is proof enough of which one the Soul Calibur fans think is better, and if you listen to them talk as I have done many times before you will also find out why on a technical level SC is considered to be the superior. SC2's home releases really show how Namco figured out that they screwed up badly. Look at all of the added characters except the console exclusives. Sueng Mina, because just having Kilik wasn't good enough (I love Seugn Mina!), Sophitia because Cassandra wasn't a good enough successor (Sophitia also stands as the hard evidence of how differently the two games play), Assassin because everybody realized Yunsung sucked and they wanted Hwang back, Berserker because somebody, somewhere, still likes Rock, and Lizardman because he too was wanted back. Then there is Necrid. 5 of 6 characters added to the home versions, excluding console exclusives, are returning characters or clones of old characters. That's how upset SC fans were at SC2, and that's only half of what Namco needed to fix to make them happy. Sure, it pleases the general audiences very well, and in the US it sold really well. In Japan it sold very badly in comparison (stats to follow later). Overall I think SoulCal really earned its spot. It had to contend with its own sequel, a sequel that reaches a much larger audience, and it still came out on top. Soul Calibur 2 Sales data (Japan first, US second) PS2 144,948 - 120,104 GC 97,148 - 500,000 Xbox 31,815 - 279,868 --- ChichiriMuyo is officially the Discussion Guru Encyclopedia - UltimaterializerX And I'm 23/24 myself. My loss was all part of Alucard's plan. - BigCow |
| From: ChichiriMuyo | Posted: 4/29/2004 4:55:58 PM | Message Detail |
| cn,
it's not often that the development of a series is considered to be
more reliant on the 3rd game in the series than the first two. I'm not
talking about revolutionizing the series, either, I'm talking about
shaping the further development of the series. That, if you read into
it, means the person who is credited as knowing the most about the
series other than Miyamoto himself believes that LttP is the DEFINING
game in the series. Not the first, not the most revolutionary, but the
one that fully embodies the series as it was meant to be. --- ChichiriMuyo is officially the Discussion Guru Encyclopedia - UltimaterializerX And I'm 23/24 myself. My loss was all part of Alucard's plan. - BigCow |
| From: redline15 | Posted: 4/29/2004 5:00:38 PM | Message Detail |
| The
fact alone that it beat out SC2 to get in when they both fought for the
same division is proof enough of which one the Soul Calibur fans think
is better... sc1 got in because it was a dreamcast exclusive. there were about a hundred contenders for the spot in the arcade/ps2/gc/xbox fields...and about six in the dreamcast field. i'd be shocked to see sc1 beat sc2 in a more traditional nomination scheme. ...i do agree that sc1 deserves the spot more, however. --- signature (n.): a random bit of gibberish that no one ever reads. |
| From: ChichiriMuyo | Posted: 4/29/2004 5:07:47 PM | Message Detail |
| Soul
Calibur wasn't in the arcades? Then what the hell is that System 12
board doing? Looks like it's playing Soul Calibur to me. Both were in
arcades. Oh, and yeah, how many DC games made it into that division? At
least 3, for sure. So obviously there were a number of good
competitors. Not to mention, Xbox has less titles worth nominating than
DC, so that alone should have made the two roughly even, but then you
have people who think SC2 is the best game on the GC and people who
hate the PS2 but liked SC2 enough to want to get it in. Hell, my Xbox
nom went to SC2 because there isn't a damn exclussive on the system
that I care about, nor anything really worht mentioning overall. I'd
bet that for half the nominators Xbox was "Which multi-console release
do I like the best?". SC2 didn't make it, and it had 3 better selling
consoles to back it up, 2 of which really don't have more than half a
dozen REAL competitors either. Sorry, but for every great Xbox title I
can name an equally great DC title, and for every great GC title I can
name a great DC title that is almost as great +5 extra DC games that
are excellent just to balance it out. --- ChichiriMuyo is officially the Discussion Guru Encyclopedia - UltimaterializerX And I'm 23/24 myself. My loss was all part of Alucard's plan. - BigCow |
| From: DomaDragoon | Posted: 4/29/2004 5:09:35 PM | Message Detail |
| You
know, with all this discussion about the "dream bracket" things, I
think it's high time that some regular start up the "In or Out" topics
again. It'd be interesting to see people's views on it. And it looks like KH made the comeback after all. Neat. Now if Gordon and Bastila can get their acts together, I may have the only perfect 1st round 128 in the BOP. (Yeah, right...) --- Smart Ask! National Champion (2003) www.rpgdl.com |
| From: FastFalcon05 | Posted: 4/29/2004 5:12:29 PM | Message Detail |
| Either
you're joking or you aren't a serious ddr player. I can assure you,
I've nearly broken bones attempting Max300 at home due to the pad
slipping. And that was on Standard, not heavy. I will only play DDR in
the arcade unless Im excessively bored, and even then I'll play
Beatmania IIDX before I play DDR as the controller is much more
accurate to the real thing and less likely to severely injure me when I
try to do things that I can do with eas in the arcade. well, slipping isn't really a problem for me, granted I'm not a master at the game just yet, I'm still working my way through standard mode, I'm not horrible at the game either. I would say I'm pretty good at it, but yeah the pad slips back, but I don't notice it when I'm playing, maybe you have an older version of the pad? I got mine for Christmas, and they actually sell a different sort of floorpad now that the guy said was for "professional players in competitions" but I don't intend on making it my lifestyle, but just because I don't slip doesn't mean I'm not a "serious player." --- Silly Rabbit...Trix are for....kids. |
| From: redline15 | Posted: 4/29/2004 5:12:39 PM | Message Detail |
| Soul Calibur wasn't in the arcades? Then what the hell is that System 12 board doing? ...proving that i'm rather absentminded and should pay more attention to what i post. my apologies... --- signature (n.): a random bit of gibberish that no one ever reads. |
| From: Who Cares? | Posted: 4/29/2004 5:15:08 PM | Message Detail |
| You
know, with all this discussion about the "dream bracket" things, I
think it's high time that some regular start up the "In or Out" topics
again. I agree, the ones that were done for the VG characters was just as interesting, since we got to tap into the minds of various board members. |
| From: creativename | Posted: 4/29/2004 5:19:34 PM | Message Detail |
| There is no way in hell Soul Calibur would receive more nominations than Soul Calibur 2 in a quirk-free nomination system. --- Remember to nominate Frog from Chrono Trigger for Summer Contest 2K4! SC2K4.com |
| From: UltimaterializerX | Posted: 4/29/2004 5:25:46 PM | Message Detail |
| Quit the pessimism redline. Your posts are fine. Nothing wrong with being unique. And Slowflake, you must SCOUR THE COUNTRYSIDE. --- Boards Hunted: 4098 I would like to take this moment to politely and sincerely orgasm over Ulti's Halo/Starcraft analysis. -smitelf |
| From: ChichiriMuyo | Posted: 4/29/2004 5:32:10 PM | Message Detail |
| If
you're talking about a red octane pad, we're talking about $100 pad
that really won't slip on you. Very nice and all, but I don't feel the
need to pay $100 so I can safely play my home versions and their vastly
inferior songlists. Even on Ebay a proper Ignition 2.0 with hard insert
goes for $90. It's great practice, but it's still not as good as the
arcade by a long shot. Short of really good pads like that, there is
nothing that will hold up to 1/8th runs on a 300 bpm song. Then when
you play they will respond a bit differently, which sucks, and they
actually FEEL different. Neither of those facts are good at all.
Besides that, I've even heard one or two people say they still can't do
10 footers as reliably as they'd like on the Ignition 2.0s. If you're
"working through standard" now, I assume you're at about 6 footers
tops. And that is, in fact, the peak at which most soft pads will give
you a reliable performance on. If you do any tough 6s (HVAM basic,
Max300 Basic, Maxx basic{??}) or 7s you'll start having trouble. Once
you do a moderately difficult 8 you will have to seek new ways to play,
and any hard 8s you hit (Drop Out, Max 300 Standard, Maxx Unlimited
Standard) will not even be worth it. I'm not sure if hard 9s (healing
Vision Angelic Mix) or 10s are even possible for anyone. I've known
players that compete in the top levels (for east coast, at least
*chuckles*) and none of them have ever made claims of even doing half
as good on a soft pad for a 10 footer. They just aren't made for cata+
songs. Redline - apology half accepted. I'll fully accept it once you admit Xbox doesn't have more noteworthy games than the DC. --- ChichiriMuyo is officially the Discussion Guru Encyclopedia - UltimaterializerX And I'm 23/24 myself. My loss was all part of Alucard's plan. - BigCow |
| From: ChichiriMuyo | Posted: 4/29/2004 5:39:34 PM | Message Detail |
| From: creativename | Posted: 4/29/2004 5:19:34 PM | Message Detail There is no way in hell Soul Calibur would receive more nominations than Soul Calibur 2 in a quirk-free nomination system. Words like that mean nothing. I've also heard similar things about KH losing to SC, but it was pretty damn close wasn't it? I heard the same thing about Halo losing, and that actually did happen. I heard that about Symphony of the Night winning, and you can look at my sig to refresh your memory on that one. People say all kinds of things, but it means nothing until the provide evidence. The fact is SC got in, SC2 didn't. The fact is, SC2 had twice as many opportunities to even be nominated. The fact is, Xbox doesn't have more quality titles than DC, and neither does the Cube. And, again the fact is, All three of the consoles SC2 was on sold better than SC, so SC2 had a more mass-audience appeal and higher levels of recognition from casual gamers. It still didn't get in. The biggest factor of what I listed should be the fact that neither the GC nor the Xbox has more quality titles than the DC. That's two systems with an altogether crappy line-up vs. one lower selling system with an altogether crappy-line up (I say that in the nicest way, my lovely DC, I mean no insult, really!). --- ChichiriMuyo is officially the Discussion Guru Encyclopedia - UltimaterializerX And I'm 23/24 myself. My loss was all part of Alucard's plan. - BigCow |
| From: Mac Arrowny | Posted: 4/29/2004 5:44:31 PM | Message Detail |
| Original Soul Calibur sold 573K on DC, and as far as I know, also did better in the arcades. That's not worse than any other console, that's better, so Soul Calibur got in because of sales, it would seem. |
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