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| Spring 2004 Contest |
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| From: smitelf | Posted: 3/4/2004 10:34:23 AM | Message Detail |
| Going
back to Pong vs. RCR. I think the point I was trying to make (before I
talked myself out of it), is that the simple fact that RCR made it into
the contest may be an indication that it is more popular than we give
it credit for. Particularly when you consider how competitive it was to
get the NES nominations, and that it is seeded higher than more famous
NES games like Contra and Metal Gear. Now here's the problem. I think RCR is definitely more popular than Pong among people who are aware of both games. If only the people who submitted nominations voted, RCR would win. But if we have to worry about 100,000 people voting, simple recognition is a very big factor. And Pong definitely has the advantage there. Hence, I still have to give the overall edge to Pong. I think the contest nomination stage for the Spring 2004 contest is in some ways comparable to the primaries in the U.S. presidential election. The people who vote in the primaries are more excited about politics than the average guy and tend to be more extreme in their political views (i.e. for Democrats, they are more liberal/socialist, for Republicans, more conservative) than the majority of the public. The people who nominated games for the contest know more of the obscure names like River City Ransom and EarthBound than the average voter will when the polls come up. This is why, against a household name-type game like Pong, RCR has no chance. People who have played RCR may recognize its superiority and nominate it but the percentage of the population that knows or cares about these obscure games is drastically lower when taking the general population of GameFAQs into account. --- "Your fate is sealed, and none but yours." -- Auron Proud Supporter of Starcraft in the Spring 2004 Contest |
| From: smitelf | Posted: 3/4/2004 10:35:14 AM | Message Detail |
| Oh, and damn you guys for being so interesting, I'm going to fail my midterm because of you ... ;) --- "Your fate is sealed, and none but yours." -- Auron Proud Supporter of Starcraft in the Spring 2004 Contest |
| From: Shaker | Posted: 3/4/2004 10:36:23 AM | Message Detail |
I feel there are two things that are worth taking a look at. One has been discusses quite in-depth already, and the other has been granted a virtual 'Idunnowuththehellwillhappen' stamp. I am talking about the modern division and the Castlevania/Goldeneye/Perfect Dark menage a trois. I, myself, have ruled out SSBM advancing beyond FFX.(All biased guesswork, of course) I've also chosen FF as the winner in the Modern Division. As I've said in this topic before, I have difficulty weighing Wind Waker, and my gut-feeling tells me not to put much faith into it. Even if they are all Link games, I feel that since it is arguably the 3rd most popular Zelda in the Contest, people that have played and liked both Metroid Prime and WW will be prone to favor Samus Aran's game, simply because it is Samus' best chance at glory. Most voters do not vote this conscious, I know, they call it like they see it. But at the moment, I have Prime. If there is any Stat/COntest discusser who's opinion I put even more stock in then Solarshadow, its Slowflake. And he alone made my confidence in Wind Waker waver. But so far, I'm sticking with it. I have bigger worries about the BangFang Triangle. I currently have SOTN over Perfect Dark to be beaten by Goldeneye. Somehow that doesn't make sense, since Goldeneye shouldn't be a lot stronger then PD. I simply cannot feel right putting SOTN over Goldeneye, maybe because I've enjoyed the game too much. No matter how many people say its possible, I cannot see SOTN win that matchup. I need guidance for this one. MORE. FEED ME. --- Mara Juana Keelju is owning that fool like a $2 hooker tryin' to get a 20 dollar bill ~MrStillSmokin' on his boxing match with Maplejet |
| From: Z1mZum | Posted: 3/4/2004 10:40:14 AM | Message Detail |
| In
regards to the Perfect Dark/SOTN/Goldeneye threeway, I also have the
same thing. I'm still deciding whether or not to give SOTN the victory
over Goldeneye. I suppose Perfect Dark and Goldeneye are a matter of preference. Like you said, they're not really all that different in theory. I never could get on the Perfect Dark bandwagon (althought my brother did get it, which in turn made me play it), I never got over Goldeneye. I always thought of it as the better game due to the obscene amount of hours pumped into that game with my friends. Perfect Dark just wasn't the same, for some reason it always felt like something was lacking. So, in theory, if SotN is going to beat a Perfect Dark game that is so much like Goldeneye, what's to stop it from actually beating Goldeneye? --- Mega Man in the Summer Contest '04? You better believe it! |
| From: smitelf | Posted: 3/4/2004 10:42:20 AM | Message Detail |
| So,
in theory, if SotN is going to beat a Perfect Dark game that is so much
like Goldeneye, what's to stop it from actually beating Goldeneye? Fanbase. GoldenEye is more widely popular, I believe (though I'm certainly no expert on FPS games). --- "Your fate is sealed, and none but yours." -- Auron Proud Supporter of Starcraft in the Spring 2004 Contest |
| From: Who Cares? | Posted: 3/4/2004 10:48:50 AM | Message Detail |
| Both
are good games in their own rights, but in both cases, the characters
make the game sell, moreso than the actual gameplay. In that view of
things, since I don't see KH beating Vice City, I'm seriously starting
to doubt whether SSBM can do it or not. That and it's a fighting game
that we're comparing to an RPG. Sorry, I too must disagree on the SSB:Meele thought. If this game was just all cameos, then it wouldn't still be creating a buzz nearly 2 1/2 years after it's release. As others already mentioned, it's the gameplay and replay value that has people going wild about it for so long. I also think you making a mistake by seeing it as simply a 'fighting game' because as I said earlier in this topic, I see Meele as more of a sub-division (or even a genre of it's own) than putting it up on the same level as Street Fighter, Soul Calibur, & the like. You say 'fighting games' to me and Meele wouldn't even come to my mind, but that's just me. |
| From: UltimaterializerX | Posted: 3/4/2004 11:18:49 AM | Message Detail |
| If there is any Stat/COntest discusser who's opinion I put even more stock in then Solarshadow, its Slowflake. Add me to that list after this post. Last year, Ganondorf and Zelda proved that being within the Zelda series do not automatically mean that you are going to be nearly unbeatable. It is also safe to say that if they were the weak links (pun intended) of the Zelda series, then in this contest, the weak links (I`m just so damned PUNNY today...>_>) are any Zelda game not called Ocarina. Now, that being said, let`s look at each Zelda game in this contest. The original Zelda is currently the fourth favorite Zelda in the field, behind the other three in the contest. That game is going up against the most popular Mario game in existence, and though we can easily vote against Mario because of his CHARACTER contest actions, it`s not so easy to vote against his individual games, as they are all quite good. In the 16 bit division, we have Link to the Past, which can be a complete wild card in this contest. It is the second favorite Zelda game behind OOT among fans of the series. The only problem here is that it would have to beat FF6 to win its division, which I honestly cannot see happening. Rather than trying to decide whether or not FF6 is more popular than FF6, look at the seedings in that bracket. Both FF6 and Chrono Trigger are seeded higher than LTTP. Theoretically, if FF6 and Chrono Trigger were splitting the Square vote, shouldn`t LTTP be above one of them? The fact is that even though FF6 and CT stole nominations away from each other, they BOTH still finished ahead of LTTP, and simply put, LTTP is practically going up against the combined fanbases of both games when its match with FF6 rolls around. Ocarina of Time needs no analysis at all, as it is the most popular Zelda title. Either it loses to FF7, or wins the contest. There is an outside chance that it could beat FF7 and lose in the final, but I seriously doubt it. And finally, there is the Wind Waker, which is the third most popular Zelda game in the series. Let me tell you guys something right now. I would bet both Slowflake`s and Darth Maul`s accounts on WW beating Metroid Prime, and I would steal all the money from Shake`s store to give everyone their $20. I`m that sure of this. When Link and Samus go at it on even terms (Metroid Prime against LTTP would be an example of uneven terms... stick to the same eras here), Link will always win. It has been proven over and over again on this site, and this contest will simply not chance the minds of everyone who was pro-Zelda in every other poll on this site. I would honestly be shocked if Metroid Prime could even get 40% against Wind Waker. Now, in the polls I have posted within this topic, we can almost make a claim that Metroid Prime, Wind Waker, and Vice City are equal in terms of methematicl statistics based on past polls. I also think that Final Fantasy X can beat Vice City with ease, or the lesser Smash Brothers if it comes down to it. Now, if FFX can take down Vice City, then why would it have any problems with Vice City`s statistical equals? I seriously think you guys have overthought this contest to death by this point. Stop number-crunching and reading everyone else`s posts for hours on end and simply use the sense that you have within your own head. I guarantee that every match we get wrong in this contest will be a match that we originally had going the other way. --- My SC2K4 Petition: http://cgi.gamefaqs.com/boards/genmessage.asp?board=7&topic=12558738 Boards Hunted: 3277 |
| From: UltimaterializerX | Posted: 3/4/2004 11:20:13 AM | Message Detail |
| Solarshadow: I was being 100% sarcastic. You`re already my love pig ^_^ And Symphony of the Night won`t beat Perfect Dark. It may be close to a certain degree, but there is no way it wins that match. --- My SC2K4 Petition: http://cgi.gamefaqs.com/boards/genmessage.asp?board=7&topic=12558738 Boards Hunted: 3277 |
| From: Slowflake | Posted: 3/4/2004 2:11:17 PM | Message Detail |
| Hmmm, lots of interesting stuff here. But why is it that it fell on page 3? Yes, SSBM has unique, awesome gameplay, but for some reason I'm not ready to put much faith in the voters. After all, VC was groundbreaking in its own bloody, pervert, cash-cowing way. But the way you put it, I'm tempted to keep SSBM in the Sweet 16 in the time being. Whatever I say, don't put too much stock into me this spring. What I'm good at is taking data, crunching it and drawing conclusions. Remember the Cloud/Auron/Alucard/Tails demonstration? Yes, that kind of stuff. All we have is FAQ and board lists, which are not reliable at all, and old polls... and history illustrates very well what they are worth. That leaves wild guesses and instincts. My gut told me WW was going to the Final Four the second I entered my bracket, and my gut was 50/50 on the first round matches I had difficulty calling: I initially had Squall, Shadow (gasp), Ramza and Yuna winning their matches, and switched them all. FYI, I switched the last two earlier, meaning that at some point in time I was running perfect until Squall vs. Luigi. I guarantee that every match we get wrong in this contest will be a match that we originally had going the other way. Exactly. The BangFang Triangle. XD. Now, what I think about this is that Goldeneye loses second round no matter what. GameFAQers don't care for what came first, they care for what's better, and since I hear PD is regarded as being better than Goldeneye, it wouldn't surprise me to see it win... if it actually makes it there. Personally, I'm banking on SOTN to beat it... 27% on Sephiroth ranks Alucard around characters like Knuckles, Auron, Yoshi... all highly-regarded competitors. --- SpC2K4 Status --- Winner: FF7 --- Finalist: CT --- Semifinalists: SMB3, LoZ:WW |
| From: Slowflake | Posted: 3/4/2004 2:14:32 PM | Message Detail |
| And
Solar seems to think me never playing RCR is a miracle. Well, get this,
I played a sum total of ONE, count 'em, ONE Final Fantasy game. FF6 of course, duh. --- SpC2K4 Status --- Winner: FF7 --- Finalist: CT --- Semifinalists: SMB3, LoZ:WW |
| From: UltimaterializerX | Posted: 3/4/2004 2:19:16 PM | Message Detail |
| That
little triangle of yours is actually very easy to call, in my opinion.
People are overestimating Symphony of the Night based on Alucard`s
performance in the two character contests. I don`t buy it, considering
he beat the weakest Sonic character available in the contests,
Bomberman, Duke Nukem, and Kirby. Kirby SEEMS like a decent enough
character, but I can virtually guarantee that Perfect Dark would smash
any Kirby game to bits, so I don`t think he`s very stong, either.
Furthermore, are there any Kirby games in this contest? No. Perfect Dark has yet to be in any of these contests, so people don`t know what to expect. But I was once a regular post on the PD message boards, and I can say with near certainty that it will beat both SotN and Goldeneye. Symphony is simply too overestimated by people who think that Alucard beating those weak characters means something. Furthermore, virtually everyone who has played both Perfect Dark and Goldeneye likes Perfect Dark better. I can be thrown on that list with ease. Basically, this little quartet reminds me far too much of the Alucard/Bomberman/Ramza/Kirby quartet last year. Too much talk is being given to three easy matches, in my opinion. --- My SC2K4 Petition: http://cgi.gamefaqs.com/boards/genmessage.asp?board=7&topic=12558738 Boards Hunted: 3277 |
| From: FastFalcon05 | Posted: 3/4/2004 2:53:08 PM | Message Detail |
| Both
are good games in their own rights, but in both cases, the characters
make the game sell, moreso than the actual gameplay. In that view of
things, since I don't see KH beating Vice City, I'm seriously starting
to doubt whether SSBM can do it or not. That and it's a fighting game
that we're comparing to an RPG. I'm sorry slowflake, I know you already said more on this, but I also want to say the Super Smash Brothers is better because of its characters, yeah of course, but the game is magnificent. If this were a strictly gamecube contest, it should have the right to beat WindWaker, it's that good. And it relies even less on its characters than Kingdom Hearts, because a main theme of KH was the characters, and, well, in SSB there...aren't any themes lol. Super Smash brothers (both of them) were excellent games in their own right, and they were both successful because of thier incredible replay value. But yeah, I don't know how well it will do, but I will be *shocked* if it doesn't live up to its great name. --- Was nokia trying to prove that something can be made worse than x-box? ~Darkbaconslayer on N-Gage |
| From: cyko | Posted: 3/4/2004 4:24:25 PM | Message Detail |
| Furthermore, virtually everyone who has played both Perfect Dark and Goldeneye likes Perfect Dark better. then why did Goldeneye get more nominations? i've played both and i have to agree with Z1mZum; Perfect Dark just lacked something that Goldeneye had. i can't quite put my finger on it, but maybe it's because Perfect Dark really wasn't that different and i had already played Goldeneye to death. it had a lot of the same guns, same play control, a lot of similar mission objectives, and even some of the same levels! the only thing about PD that stood out was the 8-man deathmatchs you could have with the computer sims. that was fun. otherwise, it was just a repolished Goldeneye. not everyone who has played both prefers Perfect Dark. it's been an ongoing discussion on the Poll of the Day Board before this contest was even announced and the people there were split pretty evenly. People are overestimating Symphony of the Night based on Alucard`s performance in the two character contests. as for Castlevania:SotN, i'm not sure why you are underestimating it so much. SotN was widely regarded as the best 2-D platformer of the 32/64 era and by far the best Castlevania game. not only was it a great game, but it is also the only Castlevania game in the contest, so it's also carrying the whole series (for whatever that's worth). and Alucard's performance in the past two Summer Contests wasn't all that pathetic, either. he may not have beaten any elite characters to reach the Sweet Sixteen twice, but take a look at how he did against Cloud. Alucard scored 30.4% of the vote against Cloud. by comparison, Auron only got only 27.8% and Bowser got 29.97%. neither of those characters are considered lightweights and Alucard did better than both of them. (yeah, yeah, i know there's the split-fanbase against Auron and Kingdom Hearts factor, but still; that puts Alucard at least on the same level as those big names.) plus Sonic got 33.79% against Cloud; 3.4% better than Alucard. even Sonic didn't do a whole lot better than Alucard. what really makes that stand out, though, is what Alucard had going for him to win those matches. quite frankly, he's not that great of a character. his pictures are all very girly; the femmie gothic look is not that popular (at least i hope it's not.....bleh). he does have a sword, but it's kinda small and not prominently displayed. his dialogue in SotN was cheesey and not well-translated. he really didn't have much character development. so what did Alucard have going for him? his game, that's what. people voted for him because of how great his game was. so basically, SotN got almost a third of the vote against FF7. now, do you honestly think that Perfect Dark or even Goldeneye could get a third of the vote against FF7? i doubt it. and i think they would both do about the same against FF7 (maybe Goldeneye would do a bit better based on the nominations) since both PD and Goldeneye do share a very similar fanbase. that's why i think Castlevania can beat both. --- Please go nominate Secret of Mana for SNES. Right Now. A Cheese Legend of Trivia 12 |
| From: ChichiriMuyo | Posted: 3/4/2004 5:08:36 PM | Message Detail |
| "And
Symphony of the Night won`t beat Perfect Dark. It may be close to a
certain degree, but there is no way it wins that match." Quoted for the possibility of future taunting. --- The cry sounds out from the throngs. PICS NOW, with you both in thongs! - Villainous Janus |
| From: ChichiriMuyo | Posted: 3/4/2004 5:17:39 PM | Message Detail |
| Oh,
and I must absolutely agree with cyko on SotN. They basically modeled
the GBA Castlevania's after SotN, and it's effect can even still be
felt in LoI. It really is that good of a game. I wouldn't vote for PD
even if it was facing another game, and I'm sure there are others... to
be honest I don't wholly believe that the entire GE fanbase will stand
behind PD because it really doesn't have that... feel. Some games are
very solid and well made but don't feel right, PD is one of
them. Also with how late it came in the N64's life I'm certain that
many people haven't played it. I think GE can take SotN, but I don't
really think PD can. --- The cry sounds out from the throngs. PICS NOW, with you both in thongs! - Villainous Janus |
| From: smitelf | Posted: 3/4/2004 5:27:58 PM | Message Detail |
| Damn...looks
like I might be reversing my decision on Halo v. Starcraft. Halo has
the 23rd rated FAQ on GameFAQs, but that's not all. Look at KOTOR. PC
version is in 31st place on the top 50 FAQ list, while the Xbox version
is at 25, despite being significantly older. This tells me that there
are definitely more Xbox players than I suspected as compared to PC
gamers here. Poor Starcraft. --- "Your fate is sealed, and none but yours." -- Auron Proud Supporter of Starcraft in the Spring 2004 Contest |
| From: ZetSword | Posted: 3/4/2004 5:32:10 PM | Message Detail |
| Man, this contest is gonna be tough... --- Jeff Foxworthy: You know you're a redneck when you have a gunrack on your gunrack. Stewie: YOU SUCK! |
| From: Haste2 | Posted: 3/4/2004 7:24:28 PM | Message Detail |
| Heh,
I thought I was the only one who had Castlevania taking down PD, but
then losing to Goldeneye. I'm rather convinced that Goldeneye >
Perfect Dark, now. One thing worries me, though...it really might not
matter if few people have played PD. PD could win based on the
recognition of the game (i.e. they know it's like an enhanced
Goldeneye, and EVERYONE'S played Goldeneye), which would probably be
stronger than it would be for SoTN. But let's not compare Alucard to Kirby in any way to guage Alucard's game...Castlevania: SoTN would blow away any Kirby game (haha, another pun...sort of). As for Duck Hunt vs. Donkey Kong...I guess it's hard guessing how hard the anti-vote for Donkey Kong will be, being in the pre-NES era. But Donkey Kong was a phenomonal game at its game, and is one of the most recognized old arcade games today. Not only that, but I'm betting Duck Hunt will get lots of anti-votes because many people never got to play it due to not owning one of those gun accessories. I'm still expecting DK to take it. --- "Ah, a party! We haven't had one of those. It could be fun! So...what is a party?" "Well, you drink punch and eat CAKE! ...I think." |
| From: creativename | Posted: 3/4/2004 8:07:32 PM | Message Detail |
| since Goldeneye shouldn't be a lot stronger then PD Goldeneye should be a lot stronger than Perfect Dark. Many liked Perfect Dark better, but look at Goldeneye's sales figures. Goldeneye sold over 8 million units; it's one of the best-selling games of all time. To put that in perspective, Ocarina of Time sold 6 million units. Goldeneye is most likely just too damn popular for Perfect Dark or SotN to stand much of a chance against it. I'm guessing it'll get at least 60% of the vote against either games. I guarantee that every match we get wrong in this contest will be a match that we originally had going the other way That's a poor guarantee...I can guarantee that of the matches where people flip-flop a lot on, the choice they switch to will be right roughly 50% of the time. "Gut instinct" isn't much help in matches that are toss-ups, because half the people will have their gut tell them the wrong thing. You always here people ****ing about how their initial choice was right, and less about those who switched and got it right; but that's just human nature. There's an asymetry of emotion involved. Because get more pain from switching incorrectly, than joy from switching correctly, and emphasize one more than the other. And Ultimaterialzer, you are entirely waaay too confident in your picks. "Too much talk is being given to three easy matches, in my opinion"? The matches you think are easy, aren't. Plain and simple. I can say with near certainty that it will beat both SotN and Goldeneye I suppose it's possible, but it would truly be shocking if that were so. Perfect Dark is just very unlikely to beat Goldeneye. Goldeneye is too legendary. In any case, even if Perfect Dark does win, there should be no shred of certainty involved in that outcome. --- Remember to nominate Frog from Chrono Trigger for Summer Contest 2K4! |
| From: neoatomtaco | Posted: 3/4/2004 8:12:48 PM | Message Detail |
| Is it just me or is it ironic when a lot of people are saying halo is just a wolfenstein/goldeneye clone. when starcraft is just a warcraft clone. well at least in thier logic it would be. am i wrong? --- "isnt monkey love a beautiful thing"Rikku-FFX-2I am not a Taco ingrediant, Damn you! BTW yes it is. LOL |
| From: creativename | Posted: 3/4/2004 8:17:32 PM | Message Detail |
| plus Sonic got 33.79% against Cloud; 3.4% better than Alucard. even Sonic didn't do a whole lot better than Alucard Alucard faced Cloud in 2K2...Sonic faced him in 2K3. Sonic and Cloud in 2002 would've been very even. Alucard wasn't as strong as Sonic in 2003. But SotN probably will do well against Perfect Dark. It's a tough match to call. --- Remember to nominate Frog from Chrono Trigger for Summer Contest 2K4! |
| From: Haste2 | Posted: 3/4/2004 8:54:29 PM | Message Detail |
| Here's a crazy thought: it's likely that... ...there will be 3 unsurprising division winners and 1 surprising one (according to the bracket predictions). Crono and Mega Man were the "surprising" ones (though we obviously knew MM would take the division). So, basically, if you want to have a real shot at placing in the contest, I would go with 3 expected division champions, and then go for the longshot with one of the other divisions. I'm almost certain there will be a Crono (no, not a Mega Man) in the contest. --- "Ah, a party! We haven't had one of those. It could be fun! So...what is a party?" "Well, you drink punch and eat CAKE! ...I think." |
| From: irriadin | Posted: 3/4/2004 9:26:02 PM | Message Detail |
| Well, for no apparent reason, I'm about to post my bracket picks for the 8-bit division: 8 Bit Division (1) SMB3 vs. (16) Metal Gear (8) Metroid vs. (9) Pac-Man (5) Phantasy Star vs. (12) Contra (4) Final Fantasy vs. (13) Pitfall (6) Donkey Kong vs. (11) Duckhunt (3) Legend of Zelda vs. (14) Adventure (7) Pong vs. (10) River City Ransom (2) Tetris vs. (15) Galaga Second Round (1) SMB3 vs. (8) Metroid (5) Phantasy Star vs. (4) Final Fantasy (6) Donkey Kong vs. (3) Zelda (7) Pong vs. (2) Tetris Third Round (1) SMB3 vs. (4) Final Fantasy (3) Zelda vs. (2) Tetris Fourth Round (1) SMB3 vs. (3) Zelda --- Backing StarCraft and Ocarina of Time in the Spring 2004 contest. |
| From: solarshadow | Posted: 3/4/2004 9:57:55 PM | Message Detail |
| And
what would you know about the U.S. primaries, smitelf? :) That's a good
point though, and an effective comparison. Damn, I wanted RCR to win... UltimaterializerX: Solarshadow: I was being 100% sarcastic. You`re already my love pig ^_^ Uh, ah, I, um.... Slowflake: And Solar seems to think me never playing RCR is a miracle. Well, get this, I played a sum total of ONE, count 'em, ONE Final Fantasy game. Oh great, and we're supposed to take your opinion on what will happen in the modern division? :) You know what's scary? There are at least six games in the contest which I own but haven't played. But I'll let you know if any of my opinions are based purely on boxart. ;) cyko: i've played both and i have to agree with Z1mZum; Perfect Dark just lacked something that Goldeneye had. Bingo. My feeling exactly. Even without the nominations seeding GoldenEye higher, I would've quickly picked it as a favorite over PD. GE got an incredible amount of exposure with huge sales and rental figures. I think PD did about 1/8th of GE's sales (which still isn't too shabby when you think about it). My initial thought was to put GoldenEye over SotN, but I'm starting to reconsider. GE lost badly to Halo in GameSpy's contest, and FPS games don't seem to be particularly popular around GameFAQs. That said, I haven't heard SotN making as much noise as I'd expected either (although at GameSpy it lost narrowly to RE2 before winning the "extra life" poll). SotN was a big game on the PlayStation which may have a lot more popularity around here than we're giving it credit for (and I don't think Alucard's performance is particularly indicative of the game). Grr. I wanted to say GoldenEye would win this one, but I'm not convinced. Someone convince me. How much space is there between Perfect Dark and GoldenEye? Symphony of the Night would have to lie somewhere in the middle for this scenario to play out. If the popularity of PD and GE is very close (and they are only one seed apart on their platform), then we would have to be able to narrow down the popularity of SotN very precisely for PD < SotN < GE to hold up. No, this is becoming very worrisome. --- Contest Stats: http://solarshadow-stats.tripod.com |
| From: NeoElfboy | Posted: 3/4/2004 11:48:25 PM | Message Detail |
| Well, I'm not sure where I put PD relative to SotN, but I do know I put Goldeneye above either. Simply put, Goldeneye is one of the most popular and well-respected games of its era. Everything indicates this... its seeding, its sales figures. It's easily the most popular FPS of all time among console gamers. Perfect Dark... heh, despite Ulti's claims, most people I've talked to preferred its predecessor. And while Symphony of the Night is certainly popular, it doesn't feel like the high-end threat Goldeneye is. SotN was always to a degree eclipsed by FF7 and MGS, for instance, on the PSX. Goldeneye for a long time was THE game for the Nintendo 64 (took OOT, the most popular N64 game period, to shove it out of the spotlight). Thus, it's only fitting that I see Goldeneye having no real problems until it runs into Zelda 64, where I expect it to put up a good showing but be overwhelmed by GameFAQs' impressive Zelda fanbase, especially for the most popular title in that series. As for PD vs. SotN? I have SotN right now (PD had the bad luck of coming out at a time when N64 interest was dwindling: see Majora's Mask) but hey, it's just a point. |
| From: UltimaterializerX | Posted: 3/5/2004 1:56:51 AM | Message Detail |
| "And
Symphony of the Night won`t beat Perfect Dark. It may be close to a
certain degree, but there is no way it wins that match." Quoted for the possibility of future taunting. WHY do you still post in this topic? Or any other, for that matter. This site should have much more strict penalties for trolls, because you all do nothing more than piss everyone off, yet you all get away with it. Pathetic, in my opinion. As for making fun of me, haven`t I already proven that I could really care less about any of your opinions of me, whether I`m right or wrong? I don`t respect you in the least, simply because you`re one of those people who thinks that they`re better than everyone else just because you`re older than most of the people around you. And while no one else in these topics has the guts to say of these things, I`m willing to bet that if I privately IM`d each of them, that most of them would agree with me. I was cool with you after our last debate, but with your more recent posts, I just don`t know, man. You simply cannot automatically assume that you`re better than the people around you just because you`re older (I`m guessing you`re in your late twenties). Respect comes from intelligence and proper grammar, not age. The fact that you`re too dense to have realized this after over a year on this board simply proves the fact that you don`t deserve much respect. Then again, you may grow up and prove me wrong, though you certainly haven`t come close yet. To start, you can learn how to use the lovely "Preview and Spellcheck Message" we have at the bottom of our text fields. And capitilization would help, too, while we`re on the subject. Anyway, on to a different subject. While I still think that Perfect Dark can and will beat Symphony of the Night (is there any game in this contest with a cooler name?), creativename has me convinced that Goldeneye will beat it in round 2. Sales figures and popularity are usually synonyms, especially with the Same Fanbase Factor. My apologies on making what seems to be a false claim for that match. As for being confident in my picks, I`m sorry about that, too. I get way too caught up in my numbers, I guess. But on the flipside of this, some of us have been here since day one. Doesn`t the past give us a better indication than most of the other users as to how the matches may turn out? We have sat here and analysed it for years now. Certainly, we must have an advantage in comparison to most of the other bracketeers, yes? I think most of the hardcore analysts feel the same way I do about their picks; I`m just very vocal, but I`ll work on that. Anyway, before I go to bed, I have one last thing to say to Chichiri here. I`m not as upset with you as it may sound, but either way, you have no basis whatsoever for your arrogance. Age and credibility are not synonymous with each other, and as such, will you PLEASE stop beginning sentences with "Unlike you children..."? I`ve seen that from you three times in the last two days, and it`s really insulting to those of us who are working our asses off for higher education, with jobs on top of that. You went to college, yes? You should already know how disrespectful it is to have an opinion discredited solely on age, so why do it? Makes no sense. Good night, guys. --- My SC2K4 Petition: http://cgi.gamefaqs.com/boards/genmessage.asp?board=7&topic=12558738 Boards Hunted: 3277 |
| From: UltimaterializerX | Posted: 3/5/2004 2:17:24 AM | Message Detail |
| One final post before I sleep. And Ultimaterialzer, you are entirely waaay too confident in your picks. "Too much talk is being given to three easy matches, in my opinion"? The matches you think are easy, aren't. Plain and simple. Chichiri, that`s a perfect example of how to be respectful to someone when you disagree with their opinions. I have yet to ever see you do this. And creativename, I agree with you on that, too. I`m going to work on not being like that anymore. Thanks for the help. --- My SC2K4 Petition: http://cgi.gamefaqs.com/boards/genmessage.asp?board=7&topic=12558738 Boards Hunted: 3277 |
| From: UltimaterializerX | Posted: 3/5/2004 2:19:35 AM | Message Detail |
| Actually, I have another reason why I was wrong on Perfect Dark/Goldeneye. Choose your favorite: Metal Gear Solid Metal Gear Solid 2 Go. --- My SC2K4 Petition: http://cgi.gamefaqs.com/boards/genmessage.asp?board=7&topic=12558738 Boards Hunted: 3277 |
| From: Sir Shake | Posted: 3/5/2004 3:03:27 AM | Message Detail |
I am baffled by the support for the matches I picked in the BangFang Triangle. It seems that (Its with me as well) Goldeneye has a special quality. Now that's a bit vague, and I would prefer hard numbers, but seeing the sentiment backed by so many people strengthens me in believing that the Rare game will come out on top. Now all that is left is Perfect Drak vs Sotn. I'm inclined to go wth the Castlevania game, but as Solarshadow said, it would have to be in-between the two shooters. Statistically, it might be better to side with Perfect Dark, since there's a whole lotta space beneath as opposed to in-between. That would make me ignore my gut-feeling. I can do that, but I'll have to sleep on it. And Ulti, I thought you knew better then to react to Chichiri. ^_~ Words like 'stooping' and 'his level' come to mind. Don't get too worked up over it. Later, guys. --- Shake : Can ya cook? Kali101 : Not really. I nearly killed myself once, trying to make spaghetti. |
| From: Qwaar | Posted: 3/5/2004 4:29:04 AM | Message Detail |
| "So,
in theory, if SotN is going to beat a Perfect Dark game that is so much
like Goldeneye, what's to stop it from actually beating Goldeneye?" That could technically be used to reverse things.If SOTN can't beat Goldeneye, then what's to stop it from losing to Perfect Dark? --- Proud Supporter of OoT and Starcraft In SC2K4! |
| From: cyko | Posted: 3/5/2004 4:36:20 AM | Message Detail |
And capitilization would help, too, while we`re on the subject. hey, i'm the one who doesn't capitilize. maybe i should......... *shrugs* =P SotN was a big game on the PlayStation which may have a lot more popularity around here than we're giving it credit for (and I don't think Alucard's performance is particularly indicative of the game). exactly, Solarshadow. that's what i was trying to show with Alucard's numbers. not all SotN fans like Alucard, because he doesn't have many redeeming qualities as a character. but even without all of the SotN fans, Alucard still did respectable. and a large portion of his votes came from people who supported him solely because of his game. but, to be perfectly honest, i'm still not thoroughly convinced that SotN will take down Goldeneye. i believe that will be a very close match. Perfect Dark won't do quite as well as Goldeneye, which should be enough of an opening for SotN to squeak through. but Goldeneye had more exposure, more sales and seems to have a larger fan-base than Perfect Dark. Choose your favorite: Metal Gear Solid Metal Gear Solid 2 Metal Gear Solid, hands down. MGS2 wasn't a bad game, but again, it seemed to be a lot more of the same. the gameplay and exploring allowed you more freedom in MGS2, but it was still pretty similar to MGS; just more of it. that's not neccassarily bad in a sequel, but the story spiraled out of control into a big bowl of nonsense. part of MGS's draw was it's great cinematic story. MGS's story was a little tough to follow, but MGS2 was just plain ridiculous. after the first couple of hours in MGS2, you didn't really care what happened to anyone anmore. and i'm sorry, but Raiden is pathetic compared to Solid Snake. he was whiny, cowardly, and naked. --- Please go nominate Secret of Mana for SNES. Right Now. A Cheese Legend of Trivia 12 |
| From: Slowflake | Posted: 3/5/2004 4:39:27 AM | Message Detail |
| I
don't get how me playing said games or not will have an impact on how I
can guess a game's popularity. If it was up to me, I'd have Sonic
Heroes in the Elite 8. ;) Well, I was convinced to go with Goldeneye for winning the BangFang Triangle over SOTN, but I'm not sure... well, historically, in a tough 4-pack, the winner often is the one who gets the easy first round match (see Magus and Alucard, 2003). --- SpC2K4 Status --- Winner: FF7 --- Finalist: CT --- Semifinalists: SMB3, LoZ:WW |
| From: NT220 | Posted: 3/5/2004 5:41:13 AM | Message Detail |
| Round 1 Contra beats Phantasy Star. I'm unconvinced that Phantasy Star Online will have much of an impact on the votes, and Phantasy Star's high seeding was solely due to its being the only Master System game people actually remember. Pong edges out River City Ransom. While just about everyone who's played RCR will vote for it, that number simply amounts to too few. Pong wins on name recognition. Mario RPG barely beats Street Fighter 2. I'm willing to say that Ryu is more popular than Street Fighter, since he has cameo appearances in the vs. titles to back him up. And Mario RPG is generally well regarded among Mario fans even though it won't rack up votes in favorite Mario game polls. Earthbound... I really, really want it to beat Doom. And I say this is a deceptively tricky match. Ness disappointed last year, but it was against Nintendo stalwart Bowser. Doom has lots and lots of name recognition, yes, but it's primarily a PC game (which = death on GameFAQs) and frankly seems quite washed-up lately. It'll be another story if Doom 3 had come out earlier, but I'm still not decided here. Pokemon beats Xenogears, and I doubt it will be close. Pokemon popularity >>>>> Pikachu popularity. Symphony of the Night beats Perfect Dark. PD is being vastly overrated by some people here; it came out far too late in the N64's lifespan to garner attention. And even among N64 fans it doesn't get as much support as people think; its framerate issues are legendary and people generally agree that it lacked "that something." Meanwhile, SotN sold decently and took the series in a whole new direction. Not to mention that I think that the game's more popular than Alucard. Halo beats Starcraft. XBox isn't well liked here, but many consider Halo to be the system's sole saving grace. Still close, though. I was ready to switch to Starcraft when someone mentioned battle.net spamming, but switched back when someone else mentioned XBox Live spamming. Kingdom Hearts... beats Soul Calibur. I think. I thought Sora was a disappointment last year, but he was probably drowned out in his game among all those Disney characters and Final Fantasy characters. Not sure how Soul Calibur 2 will change the voting. Fire Emblem beats Final Fantasy Tactics Advance. I'm probably alone in this, but I honestly don't see this being too close. FFTA simply isn't popular enough among Square supporters; I know plenty of Tactics fans consider it a travesty. Fire Emblem, on the other hand, should have the near-undivided support of Nintendo fans. SSB Melee beats Metal Gear Solid 2, starting a run of shattered brackets. Like most here, I fear Melee, since I have no idea how much support it will get. I wouldn't be very surprised to see it lose this very opener. It did get an incredibly high seed, but I believe that's because it's the only Gamecube game a lot of people here have played. Metal Gear Solid 2, on the other hand, is possibly the most underseeded game in the entire tournament. I don't want to think about this too much now - just went with my gut and prayed that the Nintendo fans will prove their mettle... --- "The surest sign of intelligent life outside Earth is that none of them has tried to contact us" ~Calvin |
| From: NT220 | Posted: 3/5/2004 5:41:33 AM | Message Detail |
| Round 2 Final Fantasy beats Contra. I doubt the average GameFAQser has played either; name recognition (and to a lesser extent Final Fantasy Origins) gives FF the advantage. A Link to the Past beats Super Metroid, but the match is closer than most expect. Link to the Past is weaker within its own series, but not by enough to let the weaker icon squeak by. Goldeneye beats whatever it faces. Goldeneye is immensely popular for an N64 game (I believe it was the 64's second-biggest seller, behind only Mario Kart), and it has Bond to further boost its popularity. That should be enough for it to beat Castlevania. And it will slaughter Perfect Dark, should the latter win; not only does it have far more exposure and sales, but I find that people who have played both usually prefer the latter. Kingdom Hearts beats Halo in a respectably close match. Halo will do better than Master Chief did, but not enough. Prime barely edges out Wind Waker. WW has received mixed reviews; Prime is almost universally praised. WW has sold slightly more, but it also had an excellent preorder deal and came from a far better-known (at that time) franchise. Prime's far better appeal to the non-Nintendo crowd allows it to steal a win. Melee beats Vice City in a wincingly close match. I do think that Vice City will win a year ago, but if there's one thing Melee has in its favor it's longevity. GTA's popularity has tapered off these past few months. And for the record, I do think Kingdom Hearts can beat Vice City Round 3 Zelda beats Tetris in a surprisingly close match. Far more people have played Tetris than Zelda, but the Zelda fans come through. CT beats Super Mario World. SMW is well regarded, but I don't see it quite getting the |0\/3 that CT will. FF6 beats LTTP in a photo-finish. I'm not feeling confident about this at all, so I won't comment. FFX beats Melee. They have their hardcore supporters, but FFX has far better casual support. Quarterfinals and Onwards By here I'm mainly going by gut feeling. Here's my preliminary predictions: Semis: SMB3 vs. CT, OoT vs. FFX Finals: SMB3 vs. OoT Champion: OoT --- "The surest sign of intelligent life outside Earth is that none of them has tried to contact us" ~Calvin |
| From: Albertpink | Posted: 3/5/2004 5:46:08 AM | Message Detail |
| That
could technically be used to reverse things.If SOTN can't beat
Goldeneye, then what's to stop it from losing to Perfect Dark? yes, obviously it goes the other way around as well. I just brought it up as a point to discuss with the people who, like me, have SOTN beating PD and losing to Goldeneye. --- For two points to exist, a third point must exist between them. .999~ = 1 |
| From: Slowflake | Posted: 3/5/2004 5:49:31 AM | Message Detail |
| I
have a question about PS vs. Contra. Were these two games all that
played by GameFAQs visitors, you think? After all, the site has a rep
for housing a lot of whippersnappers who began with FF7. Because if barely anyone among the voters played them, then the franchise voters will become big, very big, and that's where PS will win if it happens. --- SpC2K4 Status --- Winner: FF7 --- Finalist: CT --- Semifinalists: SMB3, LoZ:WW |
| From: NT220 | Posted: 3/5/2004 6:01:21 AM | Message Detail |
| Hmm,
that's a very good point. Contra is infinitely more played than PS on
GF, I'd say (in fact, that's probably the case for... everywhere). Is
it enough to overwhelm the franchise voters, though? I still think Phantasy Star's support is overrated, though. And Contra does have some franchise voters itself (it had a pretty popular SNES incarnation, and the recent PS2 sequel has gotten decent reviews). --- "The surest sign of intelligent life outside Earth is that none of them has tried to contact us" ~Calvin |
| From: smitelf | Posted: 3/5/2004 6:29:39 AM | Message Detail |
| Melee
beats Vice City in a wincingly close match. I do think that Vice City
will win a year ago, but if there's one thing Melee has in its favor
it's longevity. GTA's popularity has tapered off these past few months.
And for the record, I do think Kingdom Hearts can beat Vice City I hate this match. Truthfully, I didn't particularly like either game myself, though I would rather stab myself than vote for anything with GTA in it after the bad rep it has given the game community (no, we do not all like to play badasses who run over people and screw prostitutes). I don't believe my opinion is the most popular one on GTA games, however. I don't see how GTA's popularity has tapered off all that much, especially with San Andreas coming out in October (I like to keep track of the games that make people think I'm a serial killer waiting for the right moment). --- "Your fate is sealed, and none but yours." -- Auron Proud Supporter of Starcraft in the Spring 2004 Contest |
| From: NT220 | Posted: 3/5/2004 6:39:20 AM | Message Detail |
| I
hate Melee in general >_> Seriously, there's no good way of
judging how well it's going to be received. It could win anywhere from
zero matches to three (no, no way it beats Prime/WW; do you think
Nintendo fans would really rally behind it when faced with one of those
two?) GTA... it seems a lot less talked-about now compared to a year ago. As someone else in this topic said, it's making more waves in courts than among gamers. --- "The surest sign of intelligent life outside Earth is that none of them has tried to contact us" ~Calvin |
| From: Slowflake | Posted: 3/5/2004 6:41:38 AM | Message Detail |
| But looks at what's on top of the Gamespot top 10... San Andreas. Great. As if we needed any more oil. Fortunately, we're asked about Vice City... hopefully the voters will realize that come May 18. --- SpC2K4 Status --- Winner: FF7 --- Finalist: CT --- Semifinalists: SMB3, LoZ:WW |
| From: ChichiriMuyo | Posted: 3/5/2004 6:51:33 AM | Message Detail |
| Poor
Ulti, seems like you're upset because you can't be the only arrogant
jerk around here. :) You children, I swear (: Really, the reason noone
says anything about the things I say and do is because no one gives a
crap. This is a message board, after all, so why should they. Relax a
little, why don't you? How I manage to push all your buttons is beyond
me, it's not like I really try. Sure, I try tried to tease you since
you are always overly confident (believe me, I can recognize it when I
see it, I'm a PRO) and make statements that imply you aren't wrong. And
no, your time spent here talking about this and that means nothing to
this contest. Your years of talking have focused on characters, not
games, so this is all new to even you. --- The cry sounds out from the throngs. PICS NOW, with you both in thongs! - Villainous Janus |
| From: NT220 | Posted: 3/5/2004 6:58:57 AM | Message Detail |
| But looks at what's on top of the Gamespot top 10... San Andreas Y'know, I actually did not know that. (bahstupidssbanditsmysteryfanbase) Oh well, I still have it losing to FFX, so hopefully I won't lose too many points from that... seriously, the divisions are incredibly lopsided this contest in terms of difficulty. 16 and 128 are the impossible to call ones... --- "The surest sign of intelligent life outside Earth is that none of them has tried to contact us" ~Calvin |
| From: steve illumina | Posted: 3/5/2004 8:23:40 AM | Message Detail |
| All these have been some good reading! :) Keep it up. Good arguments for Vice against my Pro Star Wars: KOTOR argument...yet I am sticking with my convictions on that one. My comments on the Triangle... I agree with cyko on Perfect Dark falling to SOTN. Its just not as well remembered, not as well liked, not as well played. So the casual vote swings Castlevania to the 2nd round, where it will fall to the N64's best non-Zelda game. Goldeneye was and still is quite popular, and it will carry the Nintendites and FPS ranks to victory, where it will fall in the 3rd round anyway...to the juggernaut that is Ocarina. Contra...I got a soft spot for that game and the series. Shattered Soldier was great, the upcoming Neo Contra looks great too. The SNES Contra still is one of my top 10 fav games. If that game would have made this bracket...alas But Phantasy Star will win on name recognition and RPG loyalty votes. Too bad for Contra...it should have had RCR's spot...it would have beat Pong easily. --- Trivia XII: Neo Diehards...SC2K4: Match 1: Go SMB3! "A real gamer...standing tall against fanboys for over 20 years!" |
| From: Albertpink | Posted: 3/5/2004 8:28:05 AM | Message Detail |
Phantasy Star > Pong ?! You're mad. --- For two points to exist, a third point must exist between them. .999~ = 1 |
| From: Slowflake | Posted: 3/5/2004 8:40:01 AM | Message Detail |
| I think he's talking about Contra. --- SpC2K4 Status --- Winner: FF7 --- Finalist: CT --- Semifinalists: SMB3, LoZ:WW |
| From: Starion | Posted: 3/5/2004 9:05:49 AM | Message Detail |
| Any thoughts on the inevitable FFVII VS OoT fight? I'm thinking this will pretty much make or break people's chances of winning. |
| From: Slowflake | Posted: 3/5/2004 9:09:38 AM | Message Detail |
| I'm shocked that the board is split down the middle on this. I just can't see FF7 losing. KH and AC are just doing it too much good for the time being. Meanwhile, while OoT will rack up a lot of Link voters, definitely the most out of any Zelda game, it won't have them all, since there are some people who liked the 2D games but loathed the 3D ones. It's nowhere near as bad as Megaman, or even Mario, but when you have multiple big games, of course the popularity of each individual one will split itself a bit. Cloud, Sephiroth and FF7 don't have that problem. --- SpC2K4 Status --- Winner: FF7 --- Finalist: CT --- Semifinalists: SMB3, LoZ:WW |
| From: irriadin | Posted: 3/5/2004 9:11:57 AM | Message Detail |
| I
think the legions of Zelda fans will band together to overcome the
might of the series greatest rival. Also, those still bitter about
Cloud's victory over Link last year might throw aside any doubts about
OoT, and vote it to victory. --- Backing StarCraft and Ocarina of Time in the Spring 2004 contest. |
| From: Heroic Tails | Posted: 3/5/2004 9:30:07 AM | Message Detail |
| Of
course Advent Children is going to gather some more votes, and the
Cloud vs Sephiroth final last year doesn't look good. Yet, there are
also many factors that plays against FF7: - we still don't know for sure what caused the surge of popularity of Cloud and Sephiroth. Kingdom Hearts? A possibility, but in this case, they shouldn't perform as well this year, since Kingdom Hearts is a little older. A change in population? Well, in that case, why not another change this year? - I'm still convinced Wind Waker Link just isn't as strong as Ocarina of Time Link. I have no way to prove it of course, but I just can't change my mind on this. - Fanboyism works on both sides: there will be Final Fantasy fanboys, but don't count out the Nintendo fanboys - and if Mario is the character that represents best Nintendo, Ocarina of Time is the game that represents best Nintendo's past glory. - Most people, even here, have played both games - and Ocarina of Time is still generally considered better (note how I said "generally"). - Every year until now, the favorite was taken down. Of course, there were both of the time reasons for it. But if anti-champ/favorite votes exist just a little bit, then it'd still help in what I expect to be an extremely close match. And about other pro-FF7 arguments: - Top 50 FAQs? Well, Ocarina of Time is on it too, but you'd always need a FAQ more for a RPG than for a Zelda game. - Top message boards? Yes, FF fanboys are strong here. But we saw how well Ramza performed last year. I stand by my gut choice for now. --- "I tried a SMB speed run once but I ran into the first Goomba and died because I forgot to jump. After that, I never tried again." - PsychoSwordsman |
| From: Starion | Posted: 3/5/2004 9:39:48 AM | Message Detail |
| AC? True, there are people who prefer the 2D Zeldas over the 3d ones (you can say the same thing about FF actually.) But does this really affect their vote when it's 3D Zelda vs FF? I have a hard time believing those who prefer the 2D Zelda's would be hateful or apathetic towards OoT. This doesn't apply if the 2D Zelda lovers also love FFVII but I just don't see that being the case. Jeez, this contest is tougher than the 2003 one. I suppose it's because of the new format (game). It actually feels like the 2002 character contest. SlowFlake, I see you have WW going far. Can you explain why you think so? I may be underestimating WW and overestimating Kingdom Hearts (and Tetris!!!) |
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