| Summer Contest Discussion - Off-Season Topic |
| : | | | | | This Topic has been marked closed. No additional messages may be posted. | | | Page 2 of 10 | | | | From: steve illumina | Posted: 10/12/2003 12:19:47 PM | Message Detail |
Slowflake...u and I have the best bracket ideas on here...we should do tourneys of them. What do u think?
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Pub Trivia #9 Champions: Cheese Strikes Back!
N-Gage AKA N-Waste: Biggest flop since Virtual Boy... | | From: IMAP | Posted: 10/12/2003 12:23:59 PM | Message Detail |
If you guys do not mind, may I host a tourney based upon the initial pseudo-bracket?
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"-pokes stomach lining- Reminds me o' Moby Dick. x.O Quick mate, make a fire!"--Priest Of Gix on being eaten by Rosie O'Donnell
| | From: Slowflake | Posted: 10/12/2003 12:28:43 PM | Message Detail |
Which one? Mine? Go ahead and do it, but don't draw conclusions from it.
And Yesmar... better yet, boot Carmen Sandiego and put Tails in. Probably the best contestant to never have won a match.
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Sephiroth is feeling pretty after killing and then screwing Lance Bass. -SSJ3 Popo merging my sig and quote | | From: IMAP | Posted: 10/12/2003 12:31:35 PM | Message Detail |
Do not worry, I will let the voters draw the conclusions :).
But is it ok if I allow predictions?
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"-pokes stomach lining- Reminds me o' Moby Dick. x.O Quick mate, make a fire!"--Priest Of Gix on being eaten by Rosie O'Donnell
| | From: Slowflake | Posted: 10/12/2003 12:33:18 PM | Message Detail |
No
problem. At all. This won't be the real SC2004 bracket anyway, unless
CJayC happens to see it somehow and likes it. So at least let's do
something with it!
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Sephiroth is feeling pretty after killing and then screwing Lance Bass. -SSJ3 Popo merging my sig and quote | | From: Yesmar | Posted: 10/12/2003 5:10:00 PM | Message Detail |
OK, for my bracket, put Tails in Carmen's place, put Carmen in Vyse's place and just boot Vyse out.
And does anybody know where the archivation of the Second Stats Topic is? I found the first on solarshadow's site, but I couldn't find the second one.
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Heh Heh... The wind... It is blowing...
--Ganondorf in The Legend of Zelda: The Wind Waker | | From: Slowflake | Posted: 10/12/2003 5:10:34 PM | Message Detail |
Neither could I.
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Sephiroth is feeling pretty after killing and then screwing Lance Bass. -SSJ3 Popo merging my sig and quote | | From: Haste2 | Posted: 10/12/2003 7:36:33 PM | Message Detail |
Remember
that Squall beat Jill Valentine more handily (60%) in 2003 than Tidus
beat Claire Redfield (w/55.5%); you could say Tidus increased in
popularity, but, nope, Tidus had almost the exact same value both years
(about 34% against Link). It's highly, highly unlikely that Claire >
Jill...or maybe she is? I've had very little RE experience, but her
odds and seeding last year showed she was weaker than JIl. Tidus could
also have an larger anti-vote base than Squall, as well.
And
Squall did better against the 2003 Samus than Tidus did against Sonic
in 2002, who's no more popular than Samus of 2003, guaranteed. Trust
me, Samus' percentage against Link means nothing of weakness for an
obvious reason so many refuse to consider.
Now, if Claire
really is that much more popular than Jill, you could say the Squall of
2003 gets about .5% higher against the 2002 Claire Redfield than the
2002 Tidus does, anyway, which still puts Squall barely on top. So
basically...either Samus has to have dropped a bunch in popularity,
Claire > Jill, and/or Tidus has to have increased in order for Tidus
to theoretically beat Squall in 2003. Or you can say "screw numbers."
;) It does seem like Tidus would increase slightly, considering that
happened with Crono, as well, and his "value" shows that both years. (I
consider both values accurate, as neither Tidus' could possibly be
suspected of SFF effect)
So I actually think Squall could barely beat Magus...only in 2003, of course.
I've
got my fingers crossed that Morrigan Aensland can be in the contest,
yep...and I hope she gets paired against a highly overestimated
opponent, and watch the previous records get shattered. =P
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"Ah, a party! We haven't had one of those. It could be fun! So...what is a party?"
"Well, you drink punch and eat CAKE! ...I think." | | From: Slowflake | Posted: 10/12/2003 7:39:25 PM | Message Detail |
Comparing an FF character from 2003 with another from 2002 = FATAL MISTAKE. Any point you try to make will hold no grounds if you do this.
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Sephiroth is feeling pretty after killing and then screwing Lance Bass. -SSJ3 Popo merging my sig and quote | | From: Haste2 | Posted: 10/12/2003 7:49:21 PM | Message Detail |
For
some odd reason, I remember looking at the 2nd stats topic just a
couple months ago...but I have no idea how I got to it...unless it was
deleted since then or something.
Lesson learned a few days ago:
Don't try to read a whole archived stats topic at once. o_O It will
take your hours and hours and hours to read every word...
About Shadow vs. Bowser...
Using
math, ignoring an incredibly obvious SFF like Mario vs. DK, Bowser gets
an expected 40.6% against Mario while Shadow got 44.9% against Mario.
Could this be a small enough difference in expected performances to be
compensated by the anti-Mario vote? I'd like to see anyone's
opinions...and I won't say it's wrong, no matter what, since I am
clueless. My personal opinion says it's a little much, but you never
know...
We also must remember this...Shadow hung around 40%
against Mario for the first few hours, and then Shadow slowly caught
up, and then received MAJOR boosts in the last 2-3 hours, climbing a
percent or two. Think about that, too. Also, almost the same exact
thing happened with Shadow against his battle against Wario.
I sure wish Shadow faced someone from the 2002 contest...
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"Ah, a party! We haven't had one of those. It could be fun! So...what is a party?"
"Well, you drink punch and eat CAKE! ...I think." | | From: Enoch Camas | Posted: 10/12/2003 8:14:52 PM | Message Detail |
Decided to make my own bracket! Here we go:
North Division
1) Cloud Strife
16) Ness
8) Kirby
9) Jill Valentine
5) Squall Leonhart
12) Viewtiful Joe
4) Shadow the Hedgehog
13) Chun-Li
6) Luigi Mario
11) Pac-Man
3) Zero
14) Mewtwo
7) Knuckles the Echidna
10) Fox McCloud
2) Samus Aran
15) Geno
East Division
1) Mario Mario
16) CATS
8) Master Chief
9) Vivi
5) Zelda
12) Kefka Palazzo
4) Aeris Gainsborough
13) Captain Falcon
6) Yoshi
11) Terra Branford
3) Solid Snake
14) Strider Hiryu
7) Alucard
10) Rikku
2) Sonic the Hedgehog
15) Crash Bandicoot
South Division
1) Link
16) Spyro the Dragon
8) Miles "Tails" Prower
9) Lara Croft
5) Auron
12) Sam Fisher
4) Tidus
13) Felix
6) Dante
11) KOS-MOS
3) Ganondorf Dragmire
14) Ramza Beoulve
7) Frog
10) Proto Man
2) Mega Man
15) Sarah Kerrigan
West Division
1) Sephiroth
16) Pikachu
8) Morrigan Aensland
9) Aya Brea
5) Ryu
12) Sweet Tooth
4) Bowser
13) Wario
6) Tommy Vercetti
11) Peach Toadstool
3) Magus
14) Bomberman
7) Donkey Kong
10) Sub-Zero
2) Crono
15) Ridley
There
can be some seeding changes, of course, and a few replacements, but I
think it's fairly good. I didn't give any new character below a 7,
because I believe they should prove themselves first.
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"Do these huggies make my ass look big?" - Stewie Griffin
"Don't tease the octopus, kids!" - Ultros | | From: Heroic Knuckles | Posted: 10/13/2003 12:34:14 PM | Message Detail |
You mean no new characters got above a seven right? Minor typo, that's all....
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Frantic, exhilarating, and addictive, Viewtiful Joe is a classic and everything a game should be. ~Gamepro | | From: Slowflake | Posted: 10/13/2003 12:49:05 PM | Message Detail |
Well, if you consider that 7 is above 6 in the numerical order, then I can see his point...
Question of the day: Who would have won had the tournament not been held on a site biased towards RPGs? (points to the PotD of a few days ago)
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Sephiroth is feeling pretty after killing and then screwing Lance Bass. -SSJ3 Popo merging my sig and quote | | From: StopPokingMe | Posted: 10/13/2003 2:23:38 PM | Message Detail |
Whoa, this topic is moving fast.
So many brackets... I was going to review them all, but now that would take until next summer to do.
Heihachi?
I wouldn't dare to put him in after what happened to Kazuya. Link's
popularity carried the Gamecube version to the top, while the PS2
counted on the sheer number of owners.
I doubt Nightmare
would look any better than Kazuya out there. I was just thinking that
two series are better than one. The best rep for Soul Calibur, if it
should get one at all, would probably (sadly?) be one of the
well-endowed women.
I thought about putting Tifa in, but I
realized that I did NOT want the absolute top 64 to duke it out. If it
happened, we would have an avalanche of Square characters (including
the entire cast of FF7), a good number of Nintendo characters, Snake,
Sonic, Megaman, Shadow and Ryu. I like the idea of a weaker bracket
that covers more ground.
Since that's what the contest looks
like by the start of round 2 anyway, paying lip service to these other
guys by including and then slaughtering them seems almost insulting...
but hey, that's just me.
Remember, both of these characters lost to Aeris. Kasumi -- 37%, Tina -- 23%!
My
bad, I didn't check the numbers. I thought they had performed about
equally against Aeris. Kasumi is the better pick. But "Xbox fighting
game character" is two strikes against her before she even steps up to
the plate.
Mario vs. Crono... some people don't want a third installment, some do.
MvC
III would be another great nail-biter, no question. I'd love to see a
rematch if they were in a class all their own, like Tidus, Ganondorf,
and Magus. But the numbers indicate there are so many other great
matches to be had involving one of them. Aren't you the least bit
curious to see how Crono would fare against someone else? What about
Mario vs. Samus?
SFF is pretty much nonexistant, except for some select combinations that I don't think Squall/Tidus belongs to.
True,
but we've never seen either of those two against a fellow Square
character. I don't know why, my gut just tells me Squall has all the
right credentials for an upset, including the all-important KH
screentime... and the FF7 nuts seem to hate Tidus worse.
Question
of the day: Who would have won had the tournament not been held on a
site biased towards RPGs? (points to the PotD of a few days ago)
Interesting. I think there are two answers:
a)
If it was this site, but all of the RPG fans were surgically removed:
What you're left with is a horde of Nintendo fans and (not just a
little overlap here) old-schoolers ranging to old-school supremacists.
I see a real knockdown-dragout between the three Nintendo giants and
Mega Man. I'll give the crown to Link or Samus this year (probably
Link), but not without a hell of a fight. Without a top-notch Zelda or
Metroid game per year respectively, you've got to figure the permanent
favorite would be Mario.
b) If it was just any old random site
that had nothing to do with gaming: Mario, duh. Mario would crush
everyone and everything. Sonic would crush everyone who isn't Mario.
Those two are the most recognizable faces in video gaming, nothing else
comes close. I read somewhere that more people age 10-20 recognize
Mario than Mickey Mouse, or something like that.
My Question of the Day:
Kingdom Hearts gave an unbelievable boost to the FF characters that
appeared in cameos. The leading theory is that this is due to expanding
their fanbase into strange new territories (first appearances in up to
6 years, not a turn-based RPG). Next spring, Solid Snake will appear on
a Nintendo console for the first time since Metal Gear 2 for NES. This
gives him a whole new user base from which to draw fans (those whose
only current system is the 'cube). How much will this improve his
performance in SC2K4?
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The GameFAQs Summer Contest 2003 Fanfiction Project: http://members.aol.com/gcbfiles/ffproj.html | | From: Slowflake | Posted: 10/13/2003 2:46:28 PM | Message Detail |
Answer: a small boost at most, if any.
1.
The cameo guys' respective careers were very young (in terms of games,
not years, mind you) when KH came around, so there was plenty of room
for improvement, especially the older characters with cameos... Cloud
and Sephiroth. Meanwhile, Snake already got a good legacy...
2. ...not unlike Samus last year... and Samus stagnated or went up only by a small bit, even with Prime/Fusion.
3.
The fact that the new games are coming out for Gamecube won't mean
much. Everyone and their snake got a PS2 around these parts, to the
exception of yours truly... now a GC-to-PS2 move would mean more, so
I'd actually worry about SONIC more than Snake on that aspect.
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Sephiroth is feeling pretty after killing and then screwing Lance Bass. -SSJ3 Popo merging my sig and quote | | From: Yesmar | Posted: 10/13/2003 4:20:06 PM | Message Detail |
Now that the Contest is over is time to look back on it and address some. . .
<cue dramatic music>
Summer Contest 2003 Mys-teries!!!!
Some serious, some not as serious, some I answered myself, well one I answered myself.
Nobody can deny that Kingdom Hearts
had the biggest impact of anything in this contest. It skyrocketed the
popularity of Cloud, Sephiroth and Squall. Sora is inapplicable, since
it was his first appearance. However, Kingdom Hearts didn't
nearly have as much of a huge effect on Aeris. In fact, in her battle
against Master Chief, many said she under performed. Even so, she
didn't have any huge surprising wins. Why didn't Kingdom Hearts affect
Aeris as much as the rest?
My Answer: I have never played
Kingdom Hearts, but from what I can tell, Squall, Cloud and Sephiroth
got infinitely cooler than they already had been. However, Aeris stayed
roughly the same so she didn't attract as many fans as the above three.
Kingdom Hearts did a lot of things. It gave roles to five/six year old characters. It crossed genres attracting new fans. However, Metroid Prime
did roughly the same thing. Samus hadn't had a starring role in a game
for almost ten years. And it crossed genres a hell of a lot more than Kingdom Hearts did. But, if anything Samus decreased in popularity. What happened?
Only
one match in the past two years has been officially accepted as
including the SFF. Mario Vs. Donkey Kong. However, I think another one
should be mentioned. Crono Vs. Kefka. 78%?!!! Kefka may be old but he's
highly revered. Even if you break the match down to a match between the
two character's games rather than then themselves, it would be pretty
darn close. I wouldn't be surprised if Chrono Trigger lost in fact. Even so, even if Chrono Trigger
is the more popular game, Crono is just a mute hero (not that there's
anything wrong with that.) Kefka has a personality all his own. Plus,
thanks to this, Pac-Man is deemed lower than I think he really is. The
SFF was probably at work here, but why?
How couldn't Megaman get over 90% on Mr. Resetti?
How could Snake not get over 85% against Raiden? Somebody posted the answer once and it made sense, but I forgot it.
Does Luigi really have the same popularity as Jill Valentine?
I
know a lot of people think, albeit not all have said so directly, that
Mario won by cheating. Now I'm not trying to say that he didn't. The
results of his match are highly suspect. Perhaps a Crono cheater got
lazy, perhaps a NOA office worker came across the site and encouraged
everybody inside to vote for Mario. Perhaps a Mario fan stuffed the
ballot in the final hours. Who knows? However, if I recall correctly if
you look at a graph of Mario's votes it forms a curve. A very
steep curve, but a curve nonetheless. It seems to be an extremely
condensed version of a gradual voting curve that would occur throughout
the day. This leads me to believe something. Around the time of Mario's
victory a great influx of visitors suddenly came to GameFAQS, a
majority of which, but by no means all or perhaps not even more than
65%, voted for Mario. Who they are or why they arrived, I have no idea.
Lastly, I go back to Kingdom Hearts.
If you adjust everyone involved in that game's match results (with the
exception of Aeris) accordingly, the results seem like how we assumed
they would be, before we thought about the effect of the game. However,
some people, like the bottom ringers like CATS and Max Payne got what
people expected them to. You can explain that away, by saying that
against the bottom tiers all thought goes out the window.
However, the same thing happened to Alucard. Are we to believe that without Kingdom Hearts Sephiroth would have beaten Alucard with only around 62-65%? Why was Alucard not affected?
And phew, I'm finished.
---
Heh Heh... The wind... It is blowing...
--Ganondorf in The Legend of Zelda: The Wind Waker | | From: Slowflake | Posted: 10/13/2003 5:08:23 PM | Message Detail |
Aeristery:
Ho-hum, Master Chief is a horrible reference, like Mario, since MC
seems to have few regular fans, but a lot of rabid fanboys, and a lot
of haters as well. I believe Cloud or Link would have as much trouble
doubling the Chief as MC would have doubling Mr. Driller, the worst
joke of the two contest. And she came helluva close to Sonic, much
closer than against Snake the year before. So while she's improved,
it's probably nowhere near as much as Cloud, who actually overtook
Sephiroth with KH.
Samus losing feathers: I don't think so. Last
year showed she was a hair above Mario, and it's the same this year.
But she didn't improve either, a point I was making on my Snake post
earlier.
Crono vs. Kefka: Search me why, but without SFF, Kefka
would have gotten 22 or 23% TOPS. Link beat Scorpion 76-24, and
Pac/Scorp can let us assume that Pac-Man would have done no better than
17 or 18% against Link. Kefka being on par with Pac, and Crono being a
bit weaker than Link... remember, it's not the difference in
percentages we must look at with such low scores, but the ratio of
these scores. Therefore, the 5% of difference between the two time
travelers against weak opponents seems to hold up fairly well. SFF:
minimal.
Megaman failing to get 90%: Like it or not, AC was BIG
when it was first released. Look at the popularity of Pac-Man... it's
easy to understand why the "other" 3/4 pizza got so low. And Sam who?
While Resetti came from a rather popular game. That and I still believe
Megaman was riding a huge hype wave after the Ms. Pac-Man match.
Which
Raiden?: There, you have it. MASSIVE confusion between Raiden from MK,
Raiden from MGS2 and even others. That and Raiden seems to have fans
who would REALLY take him over Snake. But the main factor seems to be
the incredible confusion brought by the name itself.
Luigi vs.
Jill: I have a LOT of trouble believing it myself. But as a lot of
people pointed out, Luigi has NEVER been playable in a non-spinoff game
since SMW, which is more than a decade old, except for a lame dud
called Luigi's Mansion. "Player 2 syndrome"... hey, it's still not as
bad as Freeman Flu.
Mario vs. Crono: The answer may lie in a
Male vs. Female poll spammed across Internet forums, and each vote for
either option somehow created an auto-vote for Mario (or male=Mario and
female=Crono, another version of the story). I've seen the poll for
myself the day after, tried to vote on it and was taken to the MvC poll
page, and it said that the time was up to vote on the poll.
Sephiroth
vs. Jobberville: As I mentioned earlier, there is an illusion created
by the jobbers' scores: a percent more actually means a huge lot: the
difference between 10% and 13% is a lot larger than between 40% and
43%. I'm going to get lost if I try to explain this phenomenon, but I
know it's true, and I'm going to leave it at that.
Sephiroth vs.
Alucard: The Samus vs. Sephiroth of this year, which throws every
theory out of the window all by itself. The aforementioned "illusion"
is much smaller at that point (25-30%)... I believe that it would be a
little bit stronger than what Sephiroth could have done last year. Just
a little. But it does help prove that he didn't improve as much as
Cloud, and that if he did, our champion would be an NPC.
---
Sephiroth is feeling pretty after killing and then screwing Lance Bass. -SSJ3 Popo merging my sig and quote | | From: Haste2 | Posted: 10/13/2003 7:43:27 PM | Message Detail |
Sorry,
maybe I shouldn't go so in depth on explaining my opinion on one stupid
little idea...I suppose nobody even cares anyway...but I guess I just
find it fun to do it sometimes. Besides, I see it definitely possible
for Tidus to beat Squall (he would have done it easily in 2002).
Also,
there are things difficult to explain why Sonic would appear better in
2003 compared to 2002 in terms of Ken, but worse in terms of Scorpion,
(and likewise, Ken looks worse, and Scorpion better) even though Ken
looked better than Scorpion in 2002; likewise Ryu looked to be almost
where he was in 2002. It's all just a big mess. I don't even have a
clue as to who would win in Scorpion vs. Ken (my gut says Ken). Maybe
the whole Squall/Jill/Tidus/Claire thing is a similar situation, and
very difficult to pick things out of it.
---
"Ah, a party! We haven't had one of those. It could be fun! So...what is a party?"
"Well, you drink punch and eat CAKE! ...I think." | | From: steve illumina | Posted: 10/13/2003 7:56:06 PM | Message Detail |
Some points:
Slowflake: Excellent discussions here.
Whatever happened to solarshadow? He in retirement till next June?
IMAP:
Yes do Slowflake's bracket cause he was first, allow predictions. Then
do mine :) Then I say Slowflake and I make a masters bracket using data
culled from his and I's brackets to present a masters bracket.
Other than that, good job to all who are still posting in the analysis threads!
---
Pub Trivia X: Starts Soon Go Red Sox & Cubs!
N-Gage AKA N-Waste: Biggest flop since Virtual Boy... | | From: Haste2 | Posted: 10/13/2003 7:59:25 PM | Message Detail |
Ah
yes, thanks for mentioning the fact that Mr. Resetti and Tom Nook were
from a popular game ensured they would get at least 10% of the vote,
unlike some absolute fodder like Ms. Pac-Man.
As for jobbers, I
feel that they are very unpredictable in what their exact score would
be. Take, for example, Raziel's and Max Payne's performances this
year...nearly the same scores against Sephiroth. However, if you look
at the numbers in 2002, Raziel would clearly beat Max Payne about
65/35. So Raziel should've performed far better than Max...but he just
didn't.
Speaking of unpredictable jobbers, what about Captain
Olimar vs. Mario? Mario was supposed to do terrible against the weakest
opponents, but ended up being part of the 3rd biggest blowout of the
2003 Contest.
Luigi vs. Jill Valentine would indeed be
interesting...obviously numbers would mean nothing here. :D Of course,
if it did end up 50/50 Luigi would definitely win because...you know...
---
"Ah, a party! We haven't had one of those. It could be fun! So...what is a party?"
"Well, you drink punch and eat CAKE! ...I think." | | From: Haste2 | Posted: 10/13/2003 8:30:46 PM | Message Detail |
Actually,
I believe Aeris *did* improve. She got went from 43.5% against Snake in
2002 to 48% against Sonic. And, as Slowfake mentioned, Master Chief was
not a good measuring stick. Sounds like a big enough difference to me.
(Man, it scares me that Master Chief might have almost overcome Squall in 2002 had they been paired up)
---
"Ah, a party! We haven't had one of those. It could be fun! So...what is a party?"
"Well, you drink punch and eat CAKE! ...I think." | | From: Who Cares? | Posted: 10/14/2003 12:15:48 AM | Message Detail |
This topic needs a bump, so I guess I'll put down my bracket too!
NORTH
(1) Cloud
(16) Billy Hatcher
(8) Aya Brea
(9) Morrigan
(5) Auron
(12) Viewtful Joe
(4) Zero
(13) Fox McCloud
(6) Vercetti
(11) Wario
(3) Solid Snake
(14) Sweet Tooth
(7) Luigi
(10) Chun-Li
(2) Samus
(15) Kerrigan
EAST
(1) Mario
(16) CATS
(8) Master Chief
(9) Geno
(5) Aeris
(12) Felix
(4) Zelda
(13) Sora
(6) Knuckles
(11)Vivi
(3) Squall
(14) Strider
(7) Frog
(10) Sub-Zero
(2) Sonic
(15) Pikachu
SOUTH
(1) Link
(16) Crash
(8) Lara Croft
(9) Tails
(5) Tidus
(12) Captain Falcon
(4) Ryu
(13) Kefka
(6) Donkey Kong
(11) Pac-Man
(3) Shadow
(14) Nightmare
(7) Yoshi
(10) KOS-MOS
(2) Mega Man
(15) Ridley
WEST
(1) Sephiroth
(16) Ness
(8) Kirby
(9) Jill Valentine
(5) Ganondorf
(12) Bomberman
(4) Bowser
(13) Mewtwo
(6) Dante
(11) Duke Nukem
(3) Magus
(14) Ghaleon
(7) Alucard
(10) Rikku
(2) Crono
(15) Sam Fisher
| | From: kawaiifan | Posted: 10/14/2003 2:35:28 AM | Message Detail |
First of all, my gratitude again to Yesmar for saving the previous topic. ^.^
StopPokingMe wrote:
Since
that's what the contest looks like by the start of round 2 anyway,
paying lip service to these other guys by including and then
slaughtering them seems almost insulting... but hey, that's just me.
I completely agree with you.
In
particular, I certainly wouldn't want my Nakoruru or Rimururu included
in the tournament if they had to be tagged with a 15 or 16 seed,
therefore facing the likes of Cloud or Samus in the first round. I'd
much prefer that they be excluded instead.
The more I ponder the
various brackets for next year, the more the same conclusion keeps
interjecting itself: 'Why are those other 48 characters even here? So
that they can lose to Link 80-20? So that they can lose to Mega Man
75-25? Or, alternatively, so that they can lose to somebody who in turn
proceeds to lose to Link 80-20 or to Mega Man 75-25 in the next round?'
Worse,
and unlike after 2002, just skimming off the Noble Nine and excluding
them wouldn't help all that much. In the 2002 results, the Noble Nine
had been clearly head and shoulders above the rest of the field. After
2003, they do continue to occupy the top nine spots, but the gap
between them and the remainder has been filled in by new characters
including Magus, Ganondorf, Shadow, Zero, and Bowser.
Before
2002, the only ideas as to how the characters would perform were that
familiar names such as Mario, Sonic, and Sephiroth (and Lara Croft ...
) would probably do well.
After 2002, all 64 characters'
performances could be used to predict pretty accurately how they would
fare in 2003, except for such things as the KH factor. And all which
even the KH factor accomplished was just to reshuffle the Noble Nine;
it didn't insert any new characters into their ranks.
Now we have yet more data, with the 2003 results on top of the 2002 ones.
More data = more predictability = sadly, less excitement. ;.;
The
best I feel I can hope for is to keep the other characters and
especially the new characters away from the clutches of the strongest
ones for as long as possible, and hopefully instead see some
interesting battles between well-matched opponents.
---
Supporting Nakoruru, and her little sister Rimururu too!
| | From: kawaiifan | Posted: 10/14/2003 2:35:33 AM | Message Detail |
Pondering
something new ... the standard arrangement has a 1 seed and a 2 seed in
every division, right? One new possibility that I just thought of right
now, but which will likely meet with universal disapproval ^.^;;;
is to intentionally create a 'King Division', as follows.
Stick
the entire Noble Nine, along with seven other strong competitors such
as Magus, Ganondorf, Tidus, Shadow, Zero, Aeris, and Bowser, into a single division.
This
way, we still get to see them and they're not excluded from the
tourney, but they will merely proceed to knock off one another instead
of killing off the new (and/or lesser) characters nine-at-a-time in
humiliating fashion throughout the first and second rounds.
Everyone
else, new and returning, fills the 48 remaining slots in the other
three divisions, permitting some interesting and exciting matchups to
be created there.
The King Division's first round would closely
resemble the actual third round of 2003. Sixteen strong characters,
eight matches. Likewise, the King Division's second round would closely
resemble the actual fourth round of 2003, the King Division's third
round would closely resemble the actual fifth round of 2003, and the
one fourth round / 'divisional final' match of the King Division would
equate to the final match of 2003. Everything would be the same, except
that the sixteen selected participants wouldn't each be required to
slaughter two weaker characters in order to get there.
Sure,
doing it this way will indeed ruin two matches: the 61st between the
winner of the King Division and that of another division, and the
63rd/'final' between the winners of the two semifinal matches. The 57th
match, the fourth-round / quarterfinal / 'divisional final' of the King
Division, will surely be the one which identifies the eventual winner
of the tournament.
Still, isn't ruining two matches far better than ruining eighteen?
(And,
by the way, I still haven't given up on my 'byes' proposal ^.~ ... but
I figured that most of what there was to say about it, pro and con, had
already been said in the previous topic. ^.^;; )
---
Supporting Nakoruru, and her little sister Rimururu too!
| | From: kawaiifan | Posted: 10/14/2003 3:03:21 AM | Message Detail |
Two little points which I wish I could have thought of while composing the above....
The King Division should probably be renamed the 'Royal Division' or somesuch ... after all, Samus and Aeris are in it. ^.^
And
if used it should probably replace the West Division, not the North. I
wasn't fully 'into' the tournament the first two weeks, and probably at
least a few other voters felt similarly. It wouldn't be fun to have
eight of the top contenders be knocked out on 1 July through 8 July,
while everybody's still 'warming up'.
Making the West the Royal
Division would schedule its first-round matches on 25 July through 1
August, allowing plenty of time. Also, this way the real final (the
Royal Division fourth-round match) would be the 60th, with only three
matches still to go in the tournament, instead of the 57th, with six
matches still to go.
---
Supporting Nakoruru, and her little sister Rimururu too!
| | From: torey luvullo | Posted: 10/14/2003 4:01:08 AM | Message Detail |
| excellent reading. please continue writing, i shall continue reading... | | From: Slowflake | Posted: 10/14/2003 4:14:08 AM | Message Detail |
I
soooo don't like the idea. I personally think it would stink up 3
divisions... remember Gordon vs. Max and how of a stinker that was,
even if it was close? I don't want to see that EVER again. That's a
quick assumption, that only the last 3 matches would be ruined... we
would be subject to more of these boring matches by putting two random
jobbers against each other.
That and I don't want Shadow in the finals. EVER.
---
Sephiroth is feeling pretty after killing and then screwing Lance Bass. -SSJ3 Popo merging my sig and quote | | From: kawaiifan | Posted: 10/14/2003 4:33:15 AM | Message Detail |
<rant>
Slowflake, do you like anything that I post? Neither my byes proposal nor my Royal Division one....
Let's take a step back. There are three kinds of matches:
1) Top-tier vs. other.
2) Top-tier vs. top-tier.
3) Other vs. other.
'Other'
encompasses the newcomers, the middle-of-the-roaders like Kirby and
Vercetti and Knuckles, the lower-tier ones like Vyse and Kite and Isaac
and Felix, and the shouldn't-be-here ones like AiAi and Olimar and Nook
and Resetti.
If anyone can think of any one-on-one match which does not fit into one of these three categories, please speak up.
Both of my proposals are geared toward increasing the number of types 2 and 3, by decreasing the number of type 1.
I
find type 1 boring. The outcome is preordained. It's humiliating for
the fans of the character who proceeds to get slaughtered 80-20. It's a
waste of a day, it's useless, and it's all-around thoroughly
undesirable, at least in my opinion.
Type 2 can be close and
exciting. Sometimes it isn't (e.g. Cloud/Bowser, Cloud/Sonic,
Sephiroth/Mario), but often it is. Much, much more often than type 1,
at the very least.
Type 3 is the best of all. Two newcomers, or a
newcomer versus a beatable character. Many of these matches, especially
the ones involving newcomers, are unpredictable. Virtually all are fun.
And what was the bad thing about Gordon vs. Max? It was the
knowledge that the prize for whoever 'won' that match would be the
right to get annihilated by Sephiroth in the very next round!
Slowflake, you can keep your Link vs. AiAi, your Mario vs. Olimar, your Crono vs. Nook.
I'd rather watch fun matches between two characters of similar strength. That's just the way I am.
</rant>
| | From: Slowflake | Posted: 10/14/2003 4:36:31 AM | Message Detail |
I didn't intend to offend anyone. Whoa, easy.
It's
AiAi, Olimar and Nook that I want to get rid of. If we can get some
characters in there so that the absolute worst they could do against
the top guys is 20-25%, THEN I likey.
---
Sephiroth is feeling pretty after killing and then screwing Lance Bass. -SSJ3 Popo merging my sig and quote | | From: kawaiifan | Posted: 10/14/2003 5:41:09 AM | Message Detail |
That and I don't want Shadow in the finals. EVER.
Using the Royal Division, Shadow would be gone in the first round! As a 4 seed, his first-round match would pit him against the likes of Cloud!
Do
you want Shadow out in the first round, or would you rather see him
crush some 13 seed by some embarrassing margin and then have a
better-than-50% chance of beating a 5 seed, thus advancing into the
third round before he has to tangle with a 1 seed?
.
Here
are the characters from your own bracket on the first page, with the
exact same seeds that you gave them, but with the divisions rearranged
to fit my proposal.
(A 5 seed is now the strongest in the first
three divisions, and so occupies the spot ordinarily given to a 1 seed.
The leftover 5 and two of the 6's are second strongest, so they fill
the erstwhile 2 slots. Two leftover 6's and a 7 are the third
strongest, so they go where a 3 would have been. The other three 7's
are fourth strongest, so they fill the 4-seed slots, and so on.)
I
did this very quickly and haphazardly; surely even better matches could
be created by arranging the characters more deliberately than I did.
NORTH
/ (5) Zelda
\ (16) Ness
/ (11) Ramza Beoulve
\ (10) Morrigan Aensland /* Ramza has the slight edge */
/ (8) Sora
\ (13) Kefka
/ (14) Mewtwo
\ (7) Donkey Kong /* a 7 vs 14 but with potential for an upset */
/ (6) Auron
\ (14) Vyse
/ (12) KOS-MOS
\ (8) Yuna
/ (9) Jill Valentine
\ (11) Claire Redfield /* quite interesting match */
/ (15) Nightmare
\ (5) Bowser
CENTRAL
/ (5) Squall Leonhart
\ (16) CATS /* fitting, after he lost to Cloud this year */
/ (11) Viewtiful Joe
\ (10) Wario
/ (8) Geno
\ (13) Ken Masters /* poor Ken, 0-3 after this */
/ (14) Kasumi
\ (7) Alucard
/ (6) Tommy Vercetti
\ (15) Sarah Kerrigan
/ (12) Fox McCloud
\ (9) Master Chief
/ (9) Tails
\ (12) Sam Fisher /* Tails finally gets a match he can win */
/ (15) Pikachu
\ (6) Knuckles the Echidna
SOUTH
/ (5) Frog
\ (16) Crash Bandicoot
/ (11) Pac-Man
\ (10) Scorpion /* a rematch, after the weakness that Scorpion showed in 2003 */
/ (8) Kirby
\ (13) Duke Nukem
/ (14) Ghaleon
\ (7) Dante /* potential for Kirby vs. Dante in the second round */
/ (7) Luigi Mario
\ (15) Ridley
/ (13) Bomberman
\ (9) Lara Croft /* should be close */
/ (10) Aya Brea
\ (12) Captain Falcon
/ (16) Gordon Freeman
\ (6) Yoshi
Please tell me which of the 24 pairings above that you would consider to be
more of these boring matches by putting two random jobbers against each other.
ROYAL
/ (1) Cloud
\ (4) Shadow
/ (3) Ganondorf
\ (2) Mega Man
/ (2) Crono
\ (3) Zero
/ (4) Tidus
\ (1) Mario
/ (1) Link
\ (4) Ryu
/ (3) Magus
\ (2) Solid Snake
/ (2) Samus
\ (3) Sonic
/ (4) Aeris
\ (1) Sephiroth
---
Supporting Nakoruru, and her little sister Rimururu too!
| | From: Slowflake | Posted: 10/14/2003 5:48:23 AM | Message Detail |
Okay, so you did a good job at it. However, you have some B-rank jobbers matches out there. Nowhere near as bad as Gordon/Max.
And
about Shadow, the reason I mentioned him is because he's extremely
borderline. He could end up as a top seed in either one of the weak
divisions... though him getting squashed by Cloud or Link, I likey.
Though it would happen eventually with my setup, or even funnier... a
humiliating loss against Bowser. Now I want to see that.
---
Sephiroth is feeling pretty after killing and then screwing Lance Bass. -SSJ3 Popo merging my sig and quote | | From: DaruniaTheKing | Posted: 10/14/2003 7:43:07 AM | Message Detail |
Samus was in the Super Smash bros. Series!
Maybe was that the reason she didn't improve too much... | | From: Enoch Camas | Posted: 10/14/2003 9:07:46 AM | Message Detail |
a rematch, after the weakness that Scorpion showed in 2003
I'd
say that was more of Zero's strength than Scorpion's weakness. Zero
came the closest of anyone to taking out one of the top nine
characters(excluding others in the top nine, of course), and that
established him as a solid 3 seed.
37% againts a 3 seed isn't that bad, IMO.
---
"Do these huggies make my ass look big?" - Stewie Griffin
"Don't tease the octopus, kids!" - Ultros | | From: StopPokingMe | Posted: 10/14/2003 3:11:21 PM | Message Detail |
And
what was the bad thing about Gordon vs. Max? It was the knowledge that
the prize for whoever 'won' that match would be the right to get
annihilated by Sephiroth in the very next round!
No, the bad thing about it was that neither character had any business being in the contest to begin with. They have no fans.
The outcome of the victors' next matches were never in doubt either,
but did that make Fox-Pikachu, Wario-Shadow, or Knuckles-Yuna dull?
Ok, about this whole Royal division thing: I like your byes proposal better.
There
are two big problems, the first being scoring(somewhat less important).
The whole theory behind the bracket scoring (1 pt for 1st round, 2 for
2nd, 4 for 3rd, etc.) is that, assuming halfway decent seeding, no
match is "overvalued." For example, first-rounders are either really
easy to call (and so not worth much) like a 1-16, or ultimately
unimportant (and so not a big deal to botch) like a 7-10. With the
"royal" setup, I get 2 points for picking which of Mario and Mega Man
will win, but 8 points for picking which of their sidekicks will. And that's assuming said sidekicks get through a division that they really can't dominate!
The second problem is seeding. The "royal" plan requires
excellent seeding. We've seen that CJayC's guessing and board-user
nominations are at best so-so, and I don't see a much better method
getting implemented next year. Yeah, the "royal" plan looks all nice in
Slowflake's bracket, but let's look at what happens to the 2003 bracket:
(1) Cloud Strife
(16) Sam Fisher
(8) Sonic the Hedgehog
(9) Master Chief
(5) Sephiroth
(12) Kirby
(4) Solid Snake
(13) Yoshi
(6) Mega Man
(11) Luigi
(3) Mario
(14) Crono
(7) Samus Aran
(10) Tommy Vercetti
(2) Link
(15) Dante
SOOO
many bad seedings, about half of the characters don't deserve to be
there, total blowouts in the 8-9 and 7-10 matches... and that 5-12
match ought to really hammer my point home to you (sorry). And that's with
some degree of knowledge of their actual strength taken into account
when comparing equal seeds (except the 3-14, I just couldn't resist --
it should be Mario-Yoshi and Snake-Crono).
Also, even if you can
seed it right, there will be the board equivalent of rioting in the
streets when the 10th strongest character in the contest goes down in
round 1. As a big Mario fan, I find it fun to be hoping (not in vain)
for a final four berth each year. Seeing him as a perennial 2nd-round
lock and 3rd-round longshot, just so Scorpion and Duke Nukem can do a
little better, turns my stomach. Remember, you're eliminating half of the most popular characters remaining each round.
Lots of people are guaranteed to get annoyed. And it STILL doesn't
change the fact that Link, Cloud, and Sephiroth will tear through
everything they face until they see each other.
The worst the
bye system does with bad seeding is make a character or two who could
beat Luigi (for example) face each other beforehand for the right to.
---
The GameFAQs Summer Contest 2003 Fanfiction Project: http://members.aol.com/gcbfiles/ffproj.html | | From: Slowflake | Posted: 10/14/2003 3:23:26 PM | Message Detail |
Yes, it takes perfect seeding to do this. Sam Fisher, Master Chief and pals have no business being there.
I
definitely don't want to see Sonic and Magus go first round while
Squall is PWNING the competition. I personally would complain... and
there are the people who think 1 win > 0 win, no matter the quality
of the opponent, the people who think Max Payne could beat Tails
because Max won 2 matches to Tails' 0. There would be some serious hell
to pay if Bowser made it much further than Crono.
---
Sephiroth is feeling pretty after killing and then screwing Lance Bass. -SSJ3 Popo merging my sig and quote | | From: Enoch Camas | Posted: 10/15/2003 3:25:38 PM | Message Detail |
Bumpin' it up.
---
"Do these huggies make my ass look big?" - Stewie Griffin
"Don't tease the octopus, kids!" - Ultros | | From: red sox 777 | Posted: 10/15/2003 5:02:15 PM | Message Detail |
bump
---
Red Sox Magic Number to win the ALCS: 2
To Win the World Series: 6 Tonight's Score: 7-6 9th | | From: Yesmar | Posted: 10/15/2003 6:26:10 PM | Message Detail |
I
thought of a way to change seedings around to make the 2004 Contest a
little more interesting, with the exception of Cloud, Link, and Mario
who are all pretty much guaranteed a 1 Seed.
Okay first, CJayC
seeds the bracket like he did this year. Then he takes all the 1's,
2's, 3's and 4's (with the exception of the above three) and scrambles
them around, randomly assigning them either a 1, 2, 3, or 4.
Same for the 5, 6, 7, and 8's
9, 10, 11, 12's and
13, 14, 15 and 16's
Pros:
A little more variety in the Sweet Sixteen and Elite Eight.
Not all ones and twos in the Elite Eight.
Cons: Possibility of having Sam Fisher as a 1 Seed or Magus as a 16 Seed.*
*CJay would most likely never let this happen
---
Heh Heh... The wind... It is blowing...
--Ganondorf in The Legend of Zelda: The Wind Waker | | From: Haste2 | Posted: 10/15/2003 7:55:24 PM | Message Detail |
Heh,
yet another good tourney idea, kawaii...I love those well-matched
battles. It's too bad the general GameFAQs public wouldn't like wimpy
vs. wimpy.
Oh, and I've decided that Squall > Shadow. That's
because if Wario managed 35% against that hedgehog, I would imagine
Luigi would get at *least* 40%, which he fell just short of doing
against Squall. Wouldn't you agree? It just couldn't believe that Wario
is anywhere *near* Luigi.
Man...the thought of Squall getting over 45% against Mario, yet being nearly doubled by Solid Snake in 2002.
Still,
if Squall gets 46% against Mario but 42% against Samus (we can assume
they're both about equal), so Mario's anti-vote seems to exist
And here's another good method by Yesmar; man, the thought of 1 vs. 16 being Sam vs. Magus. o_O
---
"Ah, a party! We haven't had one of those. It could be fun! So...what is a party?"
"Well, you drink punch and eat CAKE! ...I think." | | From: Slowflake | Posted: 10/16/2003 5:22:36 AM | Message Detail |
Yesmar: What's the difference between a 3-4 Snake/Megaman match and a 1-2 Snake/Megaman match? That I'd like to know.
Haste2:
I could believe Luigi's popularity being this low myself. No one
expected Squall to beat Luigi, but he absolutely manhandled him. Sure,
Scarface improved, but even there, I think 2002 Squall would have
narrowly beaten Luigi. So now it's down to 35% against Shadow vs. 35%
against Snake. Clearly, 2002 Squall is superior to Wario. But I don't
think this advantage PLUS his improvement would carry him from Wario to
Shadow. Note that I haven't even mentioned Mario!
On another
subject, remember all the talk about Samus vs. Sephiroth and Alucard
vs. Sephiroth defying all logic? Perhaps in the middle of the Marios
and Master Chiefs, maybe Sephiroth lacks a bit of consistency. Though
much less than the other two, that's for sure. Throw in the Raziel/Max
debate and you have a serious question on your hands.
QUESTION OF THE DAY:
Outside of gaming circles, how would you rank these Elite 9 characters
in terms of popularity: Samus, Snake, Cloud, Sephiroth, Crono?
I'd
be tempted to put Samus above the rest, and maybe Snake is a little
heard of too. The other three? I'd think they're pretty much unknown
among non-gamers.
---
Sephiroth is feeling pretty after killing and then screwing Lance Bass. -SSJ3 Popo merging my sig and quote | | From: Haste2 | Posted: 10/16/2003 9:19:35 AM | Message Detail |
Tell
me...what was it again about Samus vs. Sephiroth that defied all logic?
I can think of only one possibility, but it makes perfect sense in my
mind. ;p It does kinda scare me that Samus was actually leading
Sephiroth for a couple hours in 2002, yet Sonic, who was exactly on par
with Samus in 2002, died a horrible death against Cloud.
My opinion on popularity rankings outside of VG circles...though I really have no idea.
1. Samus
2. Cloud
3. Sephiroth
4. Crono
5. Solid Snake
---
"Ah, a party! We haven't had one of those. It could be fun! So...what is a party?"
"Well, you drink punch and eat CAKE! ...I think." | | From: Slowflake | Posted: 10/16/2003 9:29:03 AM | Message Detail |
Exactly
what I was talking about. And Sonic had a good lead on Samus two thirds
through the poll... the only explanation would be Sonic going
downwards, but he did better than Samus against Ken, then in the grand
scheme of things got logical results against Zero and Aeris before
doing worse than he should have against Cloud. I'm sorry, but I don't
see Sonic getting so close to 2002 Sephiroth... heck, I think Crono
would have gotten that kind of numbers, and Crono > Sonic, probably.
So perhaps I'm blaming Sephiroth too quickly here, because clearly
Sonic's rather inconsistent too. It doesn't prevent that Sephiroth
should have done much better against Max and Alucard.
---
Sephiroth is feeling pretty after killing and then screwing Lance Bass. -SSJ3 Popo merging my sig and quote | | From: StopPokingMe | Posted: 10/16/2003 1:51:34 PM | Message Detail |
Yesmar: If you're going to do that, why not just go all the way and build the bracket randomly among those nominated?
Sonic's rather inconsistent too.
Makes
perfect sense. He has a lot more in common with Mario than he does with
any other character (excluding his own game-mates), intangible-wise. If
Sega still made consoles, we wouldn't even give a second thought before
concluding the two should perform in a similar pattern.
Outside
of gaming circles, how would you rank these Elite 9 characters in terms
of popularity: Samus, Snake, Cloud, Sephiroth, Crono?
Do you mean casual gamers, ex-gamers, non-gamers, or some mishmash of the above?
Non-gamers
wouldn't know any of them. None of them have a massive all-pervasive
series named after them or plastering their face all over everything.
Ex-gamers
might remember Samus from back in the day, and possibly Snake as well
but less likely. Crono's a tough call, but FF7 is too recent for a
quitter to remember/care about.
Casual gamers would surely know (1)Snake above the rest, simply because he's on PS2 and they aren't. Lots of guns and blood can't hurt either. (2)Samus
is next, SSB/SSBM's multiplayer and Metroid Prime's recency score big
for her. There's an outside chance that a handful have played FF7 back
when it was the hottest new thing going around, but probably they would
only remember (3)Cloud because you play as him. RPG's aren't exactly casual gamer material though, so most likely Cloud and (4)Sephiroth would be considered nobodies. (5)Crono... words cannot express how much of a nobody he is among this crowd.
As for appearance votes, the only other factor that could possibly sway things? I don't think any of these five, portrayed properly,
has a noticeable advantage over any of the others. Snake's tendency to
come with a godawful picture half the time might hurt him, and non-KH
Cloud just looks kinda bland, though.
---
The GameFAQs Summer Contest 2003 Fanfiction Project: http://members.aol.com/gcbfiles/ffproj.html | | From: Slowflake | Posted: 10/16/2003 2:13:06 PM | Message Detail |
Except
Sonic's the reverse of Mario. He's all-powerful against much weaker
characters, so-so against characters a little weaker than him, and
downright trashy against much stronger competitors.
---
Sephiroth is feeling pretty after killing and then screwing Lance Bass. -SSJ3 Popo merging my sig and quote | | From: Yesmar | Posted: 10/16/2003 4:14:46 PM | Message Detail |
Yesmar: What's the difference between a 3-4 Snake/Megaman match and a 1-2 Snake/Megaman match? That I'd like to know.
Mostly just more variety (seeding-wise) among the Elite Eight. All one's and two's would be kinda boring.
The next reason I don't think is very important, but there would also
be a lower prediction percentage. People could have looked at the
seedings and perfectly guessed the Elite Eight this year.
Also,
there's a chance for some extra people to get into the Sweet Sixteen
(most likely not Elite Eight like Scorpion) that wouldn't have normally
gotten there.
---
Heh Heh... The wind... It is blowing...
--Ganondorf in The Legend of Zelda: The Wind Waker | | From: Yesmar | Posted: 10/16/2003 4:17:36 PM | Message Detail |
Oh, and I just noticed, but the whole Sam Fisher and Magus going up against each other in my example was just a coincedence.
I was just considering them the least deserving of their respective seeds.
---
Heh Heh... The wind... It is blowing...
--Ganondorf in The Legend of Zelda: The Wind Waker | | From: Who Cares? | Posted: 10/16/2003 4:37:26 PM | Message Detail |
Just
for kicks, I decided to make a master seeding list from the five
brackets posted in this thread. (Snowflake, Enoch, Steve, Yesmar, and
myself) What I did was I took where a character was seeded in the
bracket and gave them points appropriate to that seed. (#1 seeds get 16
points, #16 seeds get 1 point, no appearance in the bracket means no
points) With this, I think we can get a rough projection of where we
expect some of these characters to be seeded. Anyway, look it over at
your pleasure.
1 (all unanimous/80pts)
Cloud
Mario
Link
Sephiroth
2
Crono - 75pts
Samus - 75pts
Mega Man - 75pts
Sonic - 73pts
3
Solid Snake - 72 pts
Magus - 70pts
Zero - 68pts
Ganondorf - 67pts
4
Shadow - 63pts
Bowser - 63pts
Squall - 63pts
Ryu - 61pts
5
Tidus - 61pts
Zelda - 60pts
Aeris - 59pts
Vercetti - 56pts
6
Auron - 55pts
Knuckles - 54pts
Alucard - 54pts
Frog - 53pts
7
Yoshi - 52pts
Luigi - 51pts
DK - 51pts
Dante - 49pts
8
Kirby - 49pts
Master Chief - 47pts
Morrigan - 41pts
Jill - 37pts
9
Tails - 36pts
KOS-MOS - 36pts
Aya - 35pts
Pac-Man -34pts
10
Geno - 32pts
Vivi -31pts
Rikku - 30pts
Lara - 30pts
11
Fox - 28pts
Viewtiful Joe -28pts
Sora -25pts
Wario - 22pts
12
Kefka -21pts
Bomberman - 21pts
Mewtwo - 21pts
Chun-Li - 19pts
13
Yuna - 17pts
Sub Zero -17pts
Captain Falcon -15pts
Ramza - 14pts
14
Sam Fisher - 14pts
Sweet Tooth - 12pts
Duke Nukem -12pts
Pikachu - 12pts
15
Terra - 10pts
Peach - 10pts
Strider - 9pts
Scorpion - 9pts
16
Sigma - 9pts
Felix - 9pts
Crash - 9pts
Vyse - 8pts
CATS - 5pts (unanimous 16 seed)
Bubble Characters
Proto Man - 7pts
Issac - 7pts
Max Payne -7pts
Raiden(MK) - 7pts
Ness - 7pts
Ken - 7pts
Kerrigan - 6pts
Claire Redfield - 6pts
Ghaleon - 6pts
Ridley - 6pts
Gordon - 6pts
Dr. Wily - 5pts
Nightmare - 5pts
Cervantes - 3pts
Carmen Sandiego - 3pts
Ryo - 2pts
Maximo - 2pts
B.B Hood - 2pts
Billy Hatcher -1pt
Rayne - 1pt
Blinx - 1pt
Frogger - 1pt
Marina Lightyears - 1pt
Navi - 1pt | | From: torey luvullo | Posted: 10/17/2003 5:27:33 AM | Message Detail |
| just
my 2 cents on character recognition among the general populace: you
guys pretty much have it nailed. if people have any knowledge of games,
but don't play that much, they've probably heard of snake, maybe heard
of samus, and the rest only if they played the game. | | From: Who Cares? | Posted: 10/17/2003 9:34:43 AM | Message Detail |
Looking
at the recent posts about a alternative method of running the brackets,
I still say the bye system is the best one. If you remember what
kawaiifan & myself posted about it in the last thread, all we are
doing is getting rid of the pointless 1st rounders with the top
characters and letting some of the lower characters have a shot at
success.
Seeds 9-16 faceoff in a preliminary round, & those
winners take on seeds 5-8 in the 'true' first round, then after this
the second round starts as it normally does with 32 charactrs
remaining. This way, you don't destroy logic behind seeding, you have a
higher chance of closer matches (which means more inaccuracies in
prediction brackets), and you create a lot more general excitement.
IMO,
the only real con to this system is that you have to wait a month
before the 1-4 seeds finally get into action, while a successful lower
seed may end up winning two matches before the top seeds get started.
But really, I think this is the best way of restructing the contest
without doing unnecessary unbalancing of the brackets. | | From: steve illumina | Posted: 10/17/2003 10:04:12 AM | Message Detail |
Who Cares? Interesting post there!
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